Quote: I am also not sure that $550,000 is a great deal. Isn't that just for a lease with a rather high rent ($3355 a month or so?) and a liquor that can't ever be moved because it is one of those funny special "restaurant row" licenses? I posted about this Newark Avenue dive bar elsewhere right by Madame Claude's - it much cheaper and it is to buy the whole building and it does have a real liquor license: It is only a 5-10 min walk from Grove Street and it is downtown.
View Larger Map I saw this listed on the web - could be a cool place - talk about a downtown live music venue! Madame Claude's should buy it! I know it's a dump - but even without the liquor license it could be a restaurant - it's really cheap at $289,000 with 2,200 square ft. Bar and Building being offered for Sale Class C Liquor license and building asking package of $458,000. This valuable license is located in the downtown section and can be purchased with the building or seperatley for $169,000.Dont miss out on this opportunity to own one of the last remaining liquor licenses in downtown Jersey City. Building can be sold seperatley for $289,000 and can be used for a number of commerical uses. http://www.hhrealtycorp.com/jerseycit ... stingID=42&cmsrealty=user

We went there once and did not really like it. Not to say others wouldn't enjoy it, it just wasn't our type of place (in terms of food). Too bad that its gone though because it seems that many people enjoyed it. I wonder what will go in there next.

It's amazing this thread has had +53,000 views. Why didn't y'all just eat there while it was open?

I admit I regret not having gone there. The name turned me off, then the prices, then the hours, and then...gone!

The rent is $3355 per month.

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Not trying to be argumentative just for the sake of being argumentative, but I'm curious as to why you think that is a good deal. What numbers did you run to come to that conclusion?

Some variables to consider:

Fixed Costs:
-The $500k to "buy" the business, is that all cash, or are you financing a portion (or all of it) with debt. If the latter, what interest rate are you having to pay on that debt? Since business loans are inherently more risky for banks, so you probably end up paying quite a bit more than a regular mortgage loan, but I have no feel for what those rates would be...

-What is the "rent" that you'll be charged? What is the likelihood that this increases in future years of operation? How do you balance the risk of signing a long-term lease vs. the uncertainty surrounding having a profitable/successful restaurant? If it is not a success right away can you renegotiate lower?

Variable Costs:
-What's your outlook on food prices & the economy in general? Can you raise prices on meals if your cost of inputs goes up?

-How much will you pay for labor?

-Are you a good chef or will you have to hire (and pay) one?

Other Considerations:
-How many tables can you fill & turn over on a daily/monthly basis to cover your fixed & variable costs?

-Can you operate the business for an extended period of time at a loss while you get to critical mass/following that will make you profitable?

-And finally, after all of the above is taken into consideration, when all is said and done, are you profitable *enough*, i.e. is your venture making more than your alternative uses for your money? If you're just barely breaking even or are only mildly profitable you're not being compensated for all the risk you are assuming running the business...

I'm sure i missed a few other considerations as well. If Ox couldn't make it work (and their food IMHO was damn good) what makes you think the next person will have more success?

To me, $550k seems an awful lot if it doesn't include the actual real estate (i.e. you're still paying "rent" to another). But given the right price on all of the above, i'm sure it *could* work...And as another disclaimer, i've never run a business, so my analysis could be way off, but these would be the questions I'd be asking...

That is a good deal. $550,000 for the business and a liquor license.

That is a good spot for an upscale lounge. Give LITM so competition. They have become soft

I'm surprised the landlord didn't work with the proprietors since that space may sit empty for a while; just look around jersey city and manhattan with spaces being vacant for 2-3/more years.

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The business is for sale. You buy the fixtures, the liquor license, etc and the lease. Then you pay the rent and other overhead costs.

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It's for sale. Not for rent. You get the space, plus everything inside.

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just the business for 550k? how much is the rent then?

For sale for $550K - came across this:

http://newjersey.craigslist.org/reb/1275010639.html

How much was the lease?

I have to conclude that they had an oppressive lease, signed at the height of the real estate boom.
I liked the food at OX and didn't think it was extraordinarily expensive in comparison to NYC restaurants. But for the average JC resident, it was on the high end, so it wasn't going to be a once-a-week affair. OX probably needed to be filled every night to make their monthly nut.
Hopefully, they will open a new joint soon, with a more reasonable lease that allows for JC oriented pricing.

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I think that "for sale" sign was for the business. And it's gone now. Did it just get stolen or did something new happen?

Ironically, Ox was just named one of the Top 25 Best Restaurants in the state by the August 2009 issue of New Jersey Monthly -- the only Jersey City place to make the cut. A real shame, but I guess JC hasn't reached a critical mass yet for higher-end dining.

I find it odd that they building is for sale, as opposed to being for lease. Did they own it, maybe that's part of the problem.

I called Ox twice to make reservations and left messages both times. I was not called back. I tried...

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Cursed, yes that's probably it.

I loved that they cleaned up the little side patch of land next to the restaurant and fenced it off. There were always beautiful flowers planted there. Now all the homeless scumbags are going to come back there to gawk at chicks and drink their beer. That spot is cursed. There used to be an italian restaurant there that was always empty and eventually went out of business as well. I don't think it has much to do with the proximity to grove st either. Nia's and Cafe Saigon are seem to be doing just fine and they are further down Newark Ave.

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Aside from being old news, what does that have to do with anything?

I am not upset about this. There's a frequent refrain on this site and elsewhere: if you care about a thing, or decide to complain about some feature of it, you and the community must do your part to support that thing you love or undo the problem you see. When the problem is intractable, even more anonymous people are to blame for not joining the movement for redefinition, change, or resurrection. Of course in real life we all have our own skills and priorities by which we may effectuate change. I repeat the canard above only to say that anyone could have opened his wallet at Ox, or recommended it to a friend... even though not all wallets are created equally. For those who are bummed out, can you honestly look at yourself and say you did all you could to support this place and advocate for it? If so, you should know it was not wasted. If not, you'll have other chances. We vote with our wallets, and recession or not, restaurants and new business ventures often do not survive more than a few years. Rachel closed down and Shadman survives. Rachel did have Shadman's menu, clientele, prices, or convenience, though it far surpassed it in quality, comfort, ambiance, and hosting. More has a chance to bistro-ize the ghost of Rachel's passing. Whether it's the location, the brand, the menu, the hosting, the serving, the cooking, or simply the lack of a clientele... businesses fail. Sometimes the business model is inherently unstable. Sometimes the market is wrong or simply isn't ripe. The City will, one day and hopefully with help, get its ducks in a row to make business ventures easier to generate and liquor licenses less prohibitively expensive. But in the meantime, the market must bear both intrinsic and extrinsic constraints on profitability.

na na na nah... na na na nah ...aye aye goodbyeeeee

critics/judges don't mean smack to me. i've veaten at some "best" and have been disappointed, and I've had great food in some dives

The owner/chef was on the food network show chopped. she lost in the first round followed closely by the chef from the W in hoboken

I agree that crowds/looks can be deceiving and I agree that the location was not that great. But I think it was a startegic mistake not to offer a low price option, especially when restos in Manhattan are doing it more and more. It's a loss leader. Usually I go to a place looking for prixe fixe, but they get me on the drinks or vice versa.

BTW, I think that space next to Duane Reade would be a great place for a restaurant with outdoor dining. It's a damn shame that little plaza at the Grove Street PATH was better developed/planned.

A fantastic little spot. I'm happy that I had my birthday dinner there this year and very sad to see it close its doors.

Best of luck to all those who made the place such a gem.

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That sounds more like a reason for you not to go there. It doesnt sound like a reason you would want them to fail.

I usually go to Sawadee for take out and have had only good experiences there. I often see the owner and I know that he is very interested in his customers opinions because he asks my opinion about things and will tell me what other customers are telling him. There are some really good owners in the city who are trying hard to please their customers but also have to work hard to stay in business.

I didn't know Nicole that well but had quite a few conversations with Ed. I am really sorry that they had to close because they made a great contribution to the restaurant scene in JC. They were producing very good food while trying to offer options so people could eat less expensively, e.g happy hours until 8 (or 9 sometimes) and options to order half portions. I hope they will stay in the area and have the opportunity to do something similar in the future. Good luck, Nicole and Ed and thank you for the enjoyable times I have spent in your restaurant. You also hired some excellent staff who were always very pleasant to interact with and I wish them all the best too.

I think they had the best food in the city. Sorry to see them go. I hope the same chef or owner opens another place here.

Even if a restaurant looks full, that doesn't mean they're making as much money. As someone in the industry, I can tell you that people are still eating out these days, but spending way less. When a restaurant is already operating on razor thin profit margins, if enough people drink cheaper wine, skip appetizers and share desserts, well then, that is enough to shut a place down. Also, they signed their lease at the peak of the real estate boom... I can only imagine what they were paying every month. Places like Sawadee probably have long term leases (or own the bldg) for a much lower price. I'm going to miss Ed and Nicole and the wonderful addition to the neighborhood they gave us!!! :(

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Yeah, I agree, OX was 1 or 2 blocks from being part of group of restaurants I frequent. Being from Paulus Hook, a few of those blocks on Newark just throw the wrong vibe!