The lady in front of me asked one of the Green "Create Jersey City Jobs" shirt union guys where he lived, he admitted he was not from Jersey City.

Robin.

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Well as the organization that did Homeland Security for the Bush W administration, would you expect anything less?

I missed the part where they said they apparently can't put the pipeline in the river -- can anyone recap that?

When is the next hearing? And do we get to talk this time? (I was at one of the meetings over the summer, but I was just learning about the issue then. I might be brave enough to speak next time.)

The biggest oopsie moment in my book was when the guy couldn't answer the question regarding where Spectra has the most densely populated area where they have pipeline. He couldn't give a number, just "in the Boston area"... like, really? Really?

I hope that anti-pipeline supporters keep even heads and use their facts. We don't have to get dirty, just speak smartly. I know I saved my choice words of frustration for the privacy of my own home :) (I witness an exchange of words between a green shirt and an anti-pipeline supporter when leaving city hall tonight, so I just wanna toss that out there!) :)

Spectra has a pretty solid union presence at the caucus meeting. Their green T-shirts and signs linking this pipeline to jobs ade quite visible.

The arguments proposed by Spectra are hollow: this is the best, cheapest, and safest alternative.

They argue that the pipeline would not be a terrorist target; whom are they kidding?

BTW, the videos shown were quite funny, particulalrly the last one attempting to demonstrate that the pipeline structure is idiotproof. Sometimes, intellectual dishonesty in an argument IS funny, but here it is dangerous.

What seems to be coming across the
presentatuon is that they throwing "facts" around, and these facts are often spurious. The guy from the Chertoff group did more damage to Spectra than helped Spectra. His speach was pretty disjointed and his ability to weave fact, fiction, and immaterial statements together had SNL-type entertainment value.

Greetings all - Spectra will be appearing before the City Council Tuesday, Feb. 22 at 5:30. Lets get a good turnout!

Spectra Energy officials will appear at the Jersey City City Council meeting Tuesday night to discuss its proposal to build a gas-pipeline extension through the city.

The 15.5-mile extension plan, which has been lambasted by city officials for more than a year, is being reviewed by the federal government. It would snake through portions of Bayonne, Jersey City, and offshore Hoboken before heading into New York.

The City Council, which has a caucus scheduled Tuesday night next week because of the Monday holiday, does not permit the public to comment or ask questions during caucuses. But residents are encouraged to attend to hear Spectra's presentation, a city official said.

The council will meet in the council chambers on Tuesday, Feb. 22 at 5:30 p.m. on the second floor of City Hall, 280 Grove St.

.

piece in USATODAY 2/11/2011

Allentown pipeline explosion revives natural gas worries

Quote:

Exactly! El Paso generated more than $2.8 billion in operating cash flow in 2007. $15.5 million is trivial to them - especially when you figure that they probably have saved much more than that each year by skimping on maintenance. If they get caught every five or ten years and have to pay out a few million each time, they come out way ahead.

Quote:

A bit more than a million per dead body.

Chump change for a natural gas company.

.
wow lostinjc that is some news....this is from the piece


Hoppel said he observed the sky "all lit up" from the county seat in Lisbon, about 20 miles from the scene of the blast. Others up to 40 miles away reported seeing a glow, he said.

The explosion occurred in an area of farms in the rural county bordering on Pennsylvania and West Virginia, Hoppel said. "Had it been close to one of our villages or cities, why, it would have been much more serious," he added.

Company spokesman Richard Wheatley said the explosion involved a 36-inch, buried transmission line that carries natural gas through the region. Mechanisms in the section that "failed" automatically shut off the segment and the residual gas burned off, he said.

Wheatley did not immediately respond to a message Friday seeking information about the age and condition of the pipeline.

In 2007, El Paso Corp. agreed to a $15.5 million fine as part of a settlement with the government involving an explosion in 2000 near Carlsbad, N.M., that killed 12 people camping near a 50-year-old pipeline.

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Is it me or do we seem to hear about a gas explosion in the news once a week? If that is rare, I'd sure hate to see commonplace.

Apparently, the gas lobbyists and transportation department have previously concluded that valves may not increase safety.

"Since 1969, NTSB has called for the more-sophisticated valves on natural gas or hazardous liquid pipelines eight times.

The first followed a 1970 propane pipeline explosion that injured 10 people in Franklin County, Mo. The NTSB said a fire that raged for an hour and 40 minutes after the initial blast "would have burned out much sooner" if there were valves.

In response, the Transportation Department proposed requiring remotely operated valves on some types of lines. The proposal, however, was later withdrawn. Agency officials concluded in 1981 that such valves were "not an effective means to reduce the accident effects" following a pipeline rupture, saying most damage in pipeline failures comes from the initial blast"

http://abcnews.go.com/Business/pennsy ... es-dead/story?id=12883552

Early in the investigation, but the natural gas main was likely involved.

In all fairness, the Spectra plan for Jersey City involves deeper pipes and probably thicker pipes.

But still... there is no way to eliminate risk in a project like this and though accidents are rare, they can be catastrophic and lethal.

Quote:

3 dead, 2 missing after massive Pa. gas blast
Elderly couple, baby killed in explosion, fire that consumes row of houses

UGI Corp. said Thursday morning that one of its natural-gas pipelines likely exploded.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/41503700/ns/us_news-life/

Looks like SHUT-OFF VALVES AGAIN AGAIN & AGAIN did NOT work Spectra? We need to ask SPECTRA Execs to live in the houses where the proposed gas pipelines pass thru!!! This is very scary (cnn.com):

"If gas is leaking out into the street, you know, it's going to follow the path of least resistance and it could seep in the ground, into your home and stuff," Scheirer said. "And any ignition source inside the home could create that explosion."

Leaking Gas Line Sparks Explosion, Inferno; 8 Homes Destroyed; Hundreds Of People EvacuatedBlast Felt Several Miles Away; Firefighters Battle Multi-Alarm Blaze

Jamie Peter | Web Producer
3:17 am EST February 10, 2011

ALLENTOWN, Pa. -- Firefighters from around Lehigh County are battling a multi-alarm fire that followed a gas explosion in the area of North 13th and West Allen streets in Allentown.

Allentown Mayor Ed Pawlowski told 69 News that the blast, which happened around 10:45 Wednesday night, was sparked by a leak of natural gas, although UGI has been unable to confirm that.

http://www.wfmz.com/lehighvalleynews/26813478/detail.html

Plant burns in Mont Belvieu (Texas 2/8/2011)
Enterprise Products operates facility in Chambers Co.

By MIKE MORRIS and TOM FOWLER
Copyright 2011 Houston Chronicle

Shortly after noon a pipeline to Enterprise Products? natural gas plant exploded in Mont Belvieu, leaving one maintenance contractor unaccounted for, company officials said. The explosion occurred at the company's west storage facility.

Rick Rainey, public relations director for Enterprise Products, said there are normally eight to 10 workers in the facility located 35 miles east of Houston. All the workers got out safely, he said.

"As of right now our main concern is to make sure that we get this thing contained," Rainey said.
Hours after the explosion, the plant, which processes and stores liquids that are separated from natural gas, continues to burn. Nothing that is burning is toxic, Rainey said.

Pipelines to the plant were shut down so no new flows come into the facility. But the liquids in the pipe are continuing to burn.

full piece

It's interesting - Spectra can confidently say what is and isn't safe, yet management would never run a pipeline, build a refinery, host a gas processing plant, etc. in their own backyards. Houston-based energy companies operate with virtual impunity with regard to the crappy things they do in other parts of the country and world. They are never held to account in their own town - they throw a few million into the symphony or the expansive medical center and everyone is happy.

It would be great if the Houston Chronicle ran stories about what their town's titans are up to - it could be a regular feature: Hey, look - your little league coach has paid off the Nigerian government to get their military to kill oil pipeline saboteurs! Wow - the church deacon's gas pipeline just took out ten campers in the New Mexico desert! That guy hosting the charity ball's gas wells poisoned the drinking water of a dozen east Texas towns!

When everything is left to the corporate level, it's all so anti-septic: "Exxon releases excessive amounts of benzene at Bayway refinery, to pay fine." That fine is immaterial to Exxon and they likely only get caught a small percentage of the time. There is no real disincentive for large energy companies to break the law, short of a once in a generation type of accident like the BP Gulf blowout or the Exxon Valdez.

I think if Spectra's management had to personally account for their actions - if Spectra CEO Greg Ebel and his family had to deal with questions and judgments about their actions and there were actual personal consequences for those actions when they adversely affect others - maybe things would be different. In this case, why should the greed of one entity entitle it to gamble with the safety/lives of others simply to justify a better return?

Instead of sending out cheesy mailers with a child on it telling us how safe your pipeline is - show us! Run one down your street and demonstrate over the next decade how your children weren't harmed. That would be a useful testimonial. Until then, get your effing pipeline out of our town and put it in the river where it belongs. Underwater pipelines are laid all the time - the only difference is that they cost more.

Route for proposed gas pipeline through Bayonne, Jersey City and Hoboken has been changed, and safety assurances given, but opponents aren't being swayed

Saturday, February 05, 2011
By TERRENCE T. McDONALD
JOURNAL STAFF WRITER

Crossing the Kill Van Kull before running north for 15.5 miles through Hudson County, the controversial Spectra Energy pipeline would wind through mostly industrial and vacant properties of Bayonne and Jersey City, shadowing Route 440 and the New Jersey Turnpike Extension most of the way, before reaching Hoboken and traveling under the Hudson River to Manhattan.

The pipeline, if it is approved by the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission and then withstands almost-certain legal challenges, would run "through parking lots and such," and steer clear of most residential neighborhoods in the area, according to Spectra Energy Project Director Ed Gonzales.

Gonzales took two reporters and a photographer from The Jersey Journal on a tour of the proposed pipeline route last month, to help give the public a better idea of how the pipeline would affect residents of Bayonne and Jersey City.

The $850 million project has been criticized for nearly a year by local officials, community groups, and other residents who say the pipeline would be too dangerous for densely populated Hudson County.

But Spectra officials, who filed their formal application with FERC on Dec. 20, say the proposal has gone through "dramatic changes" intended to answer critics' concerns.

The original plan to dig under First Street in Bayonne, mere feet from houses that overlook the Kill Van Kull, has been replaced with a proposal to put the pipeline in the water, roughly 100 feet south of the shoreline.

In addition, Spectra now plans to use a specialized drill to burrow 60 feet under the roadway in two portions of Jersey City, instead of excavating the roadway in those two sections.

Gonzales said that contrary to complaints from some of the project's opponents, the project is "dramatically different" from the gas pipe in San Bruno, Calif., where an explosion last year killed eight people.

"There are layers and layers and layers of safety," Gonzales said. "Safety is as important to us as it is to anybody else."

Despite the changes Spectra has made to its plans, city officials remain opposed to the project. They don't care how Spectra might change how it puts the pipeline in the ground - they don't want it there, period.

"It should not traverse across Jersey City at all. There's no point to it," said Ward A Councilman Michael Sottolano.

Ward E Councilman Steven Fulop, meanwhile, said Spectra should keep away from Bayonne and Jersey City altogether by putting the entire pipeline in the Hudson River.

"The pipe belongs in the water," Fulop said.

The proposed pipeline would start at an existing gas compressor on Staten Island, and then move into Bayonne via the Kill Van Kull. It would head north on Ingham Avenue, and then run along Route 440, passing Global Terminal, the Little League fields in Dennis P. Collins Park, and the South Cove Shopping Center on Lefante Way.

The pipe would then cross into Jersey City along the Turnpike Extension before turning north under Merseles Street. It would bend east at 18th Street before heading into the Hudson River toward Manhattan.

This just in from Greenwich Village - presumably from a small pipe. By comparison, the threat of explosion from a massive gas pipe is too scary to even comprehend:

http://www.dnainfo.com/20110128/green ... by-gas-leak#ixzz1CLMbmVGa

More than 300 entities girding for bout over natural-gas pipeline's extension
Friday, January 28, 2011
Question: What do the Urban League of Hudson County, St. Joseph's Roman Catholic Church in Jersey City, the Village Neighborhood Association, the New Jersey Sierra Club, and the City of Jersey City all have in common?

Answer: A pipeline.

These five entities are among more than 300 residents, companies, nonprofits, religious institutions, and governmental entities that have filed for intervenor status in the case of Spectra Energy's proposed 15.5-mile natural-gas pipeline expansion.

The deadline to file for intervenor status - which gives these entities the right to litigate if the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission approves the expansion - was yesterday.

A FERC spokeswoman told The Jersey Journal earlier this month that the commission is compiling information for an environmental-impact statement regarding the pipeline's proposed expansion.

The plan is for the pipeline to snake through Bayonne, Jersey City, and offshore Hoboken before heading into New York.

The Jersey City Board of Education and the City of Hoboken have also filed to be intervenors.

The City of Bayonne has not filed papers. The city has concerns about the project but has had an ongoing dialogue with Spectra about those issues, Bayonne spokesman Joe Ryan said yesterday.

Spectra project director Ed Gonzales said it's "not unusual" for so many groups to file as intervenors for projects of this magnitude.

"That's fine. That's just part of the process," Gonzales said.

Spectra hopes to begin construction on the expansion by April 2012.

TERRENCE T. McDONALD

On 1/26/2011, the following Filing was submitted to the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission (FERC), Washington D.C.:


Filer: Sierra Club
Eastern Environmental Law Center (as Agent)
Food & Water Watch
Eastern Environmental Law Center (as Agent)
No Gas Pipeline
Eastern Environmental Law Center (as Agent)

Docket(s): CP11-56-000
Filing Type: Motion/Notice of Intervention
Description: Motion to Intervene of Sierra Club, Food & Water Watch, and No Gas Pipeline under CP11-56.

To view the document for this Filing, click here
http://elibrary.FERC.gov/idmws/file_l ... cession_num=20110126-5413

Quote: From: Mike Benard Spectra Energy's 3-minute Kiddie Video -- No exploitation is too pathetic for gas industry -- "high-level messages"? When gas companies send children to defend the industry, it is a sign of desperation. Houston-based Spectra Energy?s latest 3-minute PR effort in the form of a kiddie video begins with the kids comparing natural gas to farts, when asked, ?What is natural gas?? ?It?s kind of gross,? replies one child. Maybe the kids know that the gas industry?s behavior stinks. Believe it or not, Spectra Energy, calls these ?high-level messages? in a press release. More than 20 kids are used in the 3-minute video, all of them children of Spectra Energy employees. Suggestion: If the company is going to use kids, let them hear the whole story. Let the kids visit with children their age who live in a shale gas zone ? whether Barnett in Texas or Marcellus in Pennsylvania or other shale gas states. But don?t let the gas industry kids stay there long enough to develop nose bleeds, skin rashes or headaches. Explain that this is why gas industry executive families don?t live in a shale gas zone. Check out Spectra Kiddie Video: http://www.spectraenergywatch.com/blog/?p=1026

As of December 20, Spectra Energy has filed their project application with the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission (FERC), the agency that approves pipeline projects. The deadline to intervene is January 26. The time to call Govenor Christie is NOW. Demand the Governor Intervene @ FERC! The FERC Process-FILE as INTERVENOR By Jan 26 @ 5PM! STOP SPECTRA's PIPELINE!! How to File & Why http://bit.ly/gQxczz Call Governor Christie's office at (609) 292-6000. Suggested script: My name is ______ and I live in Jersey City. Please demand the Attorney General intervene at FERC to stop the natural gas pipeline, proposed to run through Jersey City. Only intervenors can overturn a FERC ruling through the Federal Courts. Mayor Healy has declared to seek Intervenor standing. We ask the Governor to demand our New Jersey Attorney General declare to seek intervenor legal standing with FERC before upcoming deadlines are announced. Call Governor Christie's office at (609) 292-6000.

Have you had enough or ya' thirsty for more?

Entire Ohio town ordered to evacuate after gas explosion

This from Yahoo News:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_thelook ... 0BHNsawNlbnRpcmVvaGlvdG8-

I only call Spectra's Jersey City office to argue with them.

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While NO Gas Pipeline is pleased to see others intervene, understand that is step 1 in the FERC Process.

Filing as an intervenor gives you access to info made public in the process and IF you decide to sue FERC to overturn their ruling on behalf of Spectra you have legal standing to do so.

Only those who filed as an intervenor AND sue have a final voice. NO Gas Pipeline intends to sue if necessary.

Go to our site, sign up for alerts and to volunteer to spread the word. Most folks in JC don't know about the pipeline.

Please donate funds for expert witnesses, mailings and expenses for any possible suit. ALL monies will go to fight Spectra! Click on the PayPal button at our site to donate any amount.

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Seems like Hoboken is also jumping on board to intervene. JC Independent reported on it today. Sounds like the State and municipalities are joining forces and building a strong defense team against Spectra!

Hoboken will apply for Intervenor Status

The interesting point about those "jobs" is that each "job" really represents one year of work. So, for example, if I did something that created a job expected to last for five years, two positions expected to last for two years, ten one-year functions and 100 six month positions - 69 "jobs" would have been created (5+4+10+50.) I talked to the people at Rutgers who did the study that Spectra sites in their propoganda and this is apparently standard usage.

I don't know about you, but if someone told me they'd hire me for a year I wouldn't consider that a job. It's temp work. And if I work somewhere for five years, no one thinks I have five jobs.

saw a flyer that says 500 construction jobs, 2300 other jobs would be created right now, and tens of thousands more in hte future. But didn't the report they're touting state something like 1700 jobs over the course of 20 years?

The funny thing about those economic benefits Spectra keeps touting is that they would still accrue to to the region if they put the pipeline in the river, except there would be even greater wealth creation. All of the elements necessary to lay the pipeline on land would be needed to put it in the river, with the added benefit of it taking more time.

Environmental benefits? I'm pretty sure the ConEd plant on 14th street (where this pipeline is headed) already runs solely on natural gas. This line isn't being used to displace coal, merely provide an additional (cheaper) source of gas to the plant.

I would actually walk around town and lobby on their behalf if they would just send out postcards saying "We don't live here. Your safety is inconsequential to us. This project will allow us to make a lot more money." Everything else they say just sounds silly.