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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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So the studies are wrong that show the cameras cause more accidents?

What is the proof? And no, a police captain from Bumblescrew Corrupt Everytown, NJ saying "they make us safer" doesn't count.

Posted on: 2013/7/3 14:13
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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Haha! The people who cannot seem to stop before making a right on red are the same people who blame cameras for their inability to drive. "Officer, the camera caused the accident, not me."

Posted on: 2013/7/2 21:34
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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Don't tailgate me 'cause I stop on a dime, ain't going through neither reds nor yellows.

Posted on: 2013/7/2 14:35
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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Gotta love the "obey the law" crowd in these threads. Did some of you just move to NJ yesterday?

Study after study shows that the cameras cause MORE accidents.

Not to mention that the cameras have been found to be completely defective in many cases and towns were lowering the yellow time to SCAM people.

You really think these camera companies and the corrupt municipalities that buy their crock of BS care about safety or the law?

If they did, why not donate all the fines to traffic safety? Why not donate them all so we can have a bridge for pedestrians over the Holland Tunnel or Marin or Christopher Columbus or Grand where there are constant accidents and people getting hit?

Oh, no. Sorry. But someone has to pay for that no-show JC employee to get their six figure pension. And that someone is us. And that someone has to imperil themselves just to do it.

The light on JFK and 139 is a great example of a split second yellow. It's a total scam.

How many accidents were there at 18th and Jersey before? And it's only recently that Cast Iron went up and that there are people walking around.

With all the problems in the city...real problems with traffic and accidents, this is how the city wastes our money.

And they manage to inexplicably convince people it's about safety. So safe...more accidents and more cash and the latter is all the matters.

But the safety advocates can hopefully take themselves those burgeoning bastions of safety like Linden that pioneered this program once Fulop reviews the whole thing as promised and reveals it as more Healy scamola.

That or the NJ Supreme Court orders the cameras down. And finally democracy will get another rare victory over corrupt home rule in this state.

Posted on: 2013/7/2 13:41
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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I've had the same experience. Usually those people are from out of town or do not know the roads. It is especially egregious when there is a sign clearly marked "no turn on red" I just roll down the window, point to the sign and shut them up.


Quote:

someguyinjc wrote:
Your observation is 100% on point. What really amuses me is when I stop at a red light with the blinker on while a "NO TURN ON RED" sign is prominently displayed. The agitated individual(s) behind my jalopy proceed to blare their horns expecting me to just roll into oncoming traffic so they can make their turn. Why is everyone in such a rush to die?

Quote:

JadedJC wrote:
Most people who think they're "stopping" at a stop sign or before a right turn on red really aren't. They're usually rolling through slowly. How to tell if you've done it correctly? When there's angry honking behind you.

Posted on: 2013/7/2 12:19
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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Quote:

fat-ass-bike wrote:
Love it !
We complain about crosswalk issues, speeding cars, failing to stop at intersections, pedestrian and cyclist safety the need for more enforcement etc etc.

Sorry, but no sympathy from me - The cameras go 'off' for a reason and unless there is a medical or life threatening situation / excuse or some sort of mechanical / software program with the camera you are caught and should pay or face the consequences.


The cameras have malfunctioned since their inception. As I stated earlier, the state of NJ has been sued by a class action lawsuit for this very reason.

I have posted a recent link in the settlement of the lawsuit.... Rebates of $7 per ticket, so NJ still makes off like bandits!

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2012 ... _reached_in_red-ligh.html

Posted on: 2013/7/2 9:52
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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Quote:

MDM wrote:
I keep hoping someone will just set those cameras on fire like they started doing to the speed cameras in the UK.


Hahaha... When NYC first installed the cameras, a group of people decided to steal them in protest.... It was awesome!

Posted on: 2013/7/2 9:48
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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Your observation is 100% on point. What really amuses me is when I stop at a red light with the blinker on while a "NO TURN ON RED" sign is prominently displayed. The agitated individual(s) behind my jalopy proceed to blare their horns expecting me to just roll into oncoming traffic so they can make their turn. Why is everyone in such a rush to die?

Quote:

JadedJC wrote:
Most people who think they're "stopping" at a stop sign or before a right turn on red really aren't. They're usually rolling through slowly. How to tell if you've done it correctly? When there's angry honking behind you.

Posted on: 2013/7/1 22:08
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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That signal is poorly timed. It allows about 3 cars to pass before turning red. If there is 2 Jitney's good luck.

Quote:

Toonces wrote:
The one intersection where I'd LOVE to see a traffic camera is JFK and Pavonia Ave. I've stood and watched there as literally every single time the JFK southbound, turning onto Pavonia, left-hand turn signal turns red, someone if not multiple cars run the light, in front of oncoming traffic.

Every. Single. Time.

Especially the dollar vans...

Posted on: 2013/7/1 12:30
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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The one intersection where I'd LOVE to see a traffic camera is JFK and Pavonia Ave. I've stood and watched there as literally every single time the JFK southbound, turning onto Pavonia, left-hand turn signal turns red, someone if not multiple cars run the light, in front of oncoming traffic.

Every. Single. Time.

Especially the dollar vans...

Posted on: 2013/7/1 10:49
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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The extent to which people will go to excuse their own behavior amazes me.

Posted on: 2013/6/30 16:54
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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Quote:

Bike_Lane wrote:
These cameras might help the problems with stop signs too. The other day I was sitting at BASIC (8th and Erie), watching cars move through the intersection.

Of the first 20 cars, care to guess how many came to a complete stop?

Five. That includes two that didn't stop until they were halfway into the intersection.

15 just rolled right through the intersection with no intention of stopping. smh


I watched someone blow through an entire red light right in front of a JC cop who was in the left turn lane to his left. That is how little JC traffic laws are enforced.

Posted on: 2013/6/30 15:39
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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These cameras might help the problems with stop signs too. The other day I was sitting at BASIC (8th and Erie), watching cars move through the intersection.

Of the first 20 cars, care to guess how many came to a complete stop?

Five. That includes two that didn't stop until they were halfway into the intersection.

15 just rolled right through the intersection with no intention of stopping. smh

Posted on: 2013/6/30 14:03
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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Thank you for everyone offering advice.

The video is completely black, you do not see anything. I will have to pay regardless of guilt, taking off a day of work for an $85 fine doesn't make sense for me.. My question was posted bc I do not believe there is a sign posted. It was not for me to find a way to not "man up" and get out of a ticket. Can't post anything on this site without someone trying to tear you down. Geez.

Again, thanks to the helpful neighborly responses. :) I will not be turning right on red tonight when I come back from Hoboken!

Posted on: 2013/6/30 13:28
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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Quote:

Binky wrote:
Quote:

dtjcview wrote:
By the same logic would you remove warning signs and crash barriers from dangerous road curves, and tell drivers to "man up" after they fall off a cliff?


The sign isn't to warn you of a dangerous condition.
It's to tell you that there is a camera at the intersection.

:ROFL:


I'll answer this with the first section of the Manual on Uniform Traffic Control Devices.

Quote:


Page 1
..........................................
Section 1A.01 Purpose of Traffic Control Devices
Support:
01 The purpose of traffic control devices, as well as the principles for their use, is to promote highway safety
and efficiency by providing for the orderly movement of all road users
on streets, highways, bikeways, and private
roads open to public travel throughout the Nation.
02 Traffic control devices notify road users of regulations and provide warning and guidance needed for the
uniform and efficient operation of all elements of the traffic stream in a manner intended to minimize the
occurrences of crashes.
.........

and Page 2
.........

Section 1A.04 Placement and Operation of Traffic Control Devices
Guidance:
01 Placement of a traffic control device should be within the road user’s view so that adequate visibility is
provided.
To aid in conveying the proper meaning, the traffic control device should be appropriately positioned
with respect to the location, object, or situation to which it applies. The location and legibility of the traffic
control device should be such that a road user has adequate time to make the proper response in both day and
night conditions
.




...it's about SAFETY.

From the NJ statute approving the use of Traffic Monitoring Cameras http://www.state.nj.us/transportation ... ata/rlr/pdf/bill4314.pdf:
Quote:


d. In any municipality where the governing body has authorized the installation and use of a
traffic control signal monitoring system pursuant to subsection b. of this section, a sign notifying
drivers that such a monitoring system is being utilized shall be placed on each street converging
into the affected intersection. The sign shall be of a design and 1
[shall be]
1
placed in accordance
with specifications approved by the municipal engineer. The specifications so approved shall
conform with the uniform system set forth in the "Manual on Uniform Traffic Control Devices
for Streets and Highways."





Doesn't that mean that an improperly placed sign violates the statute? It also may mean, that the same way a lot of tickets were refunded because of improper yellow light timing, there is also case for challenging tickets at this intersection, since it doesn't conform to the NJ statute.
The scofflaws might get a refund on their tickets, because the camera operator failed to provide the correct signage.

Posted on: 2013/6/30 13:16
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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I make that right turn a lot. The best part is when those behind me start honking impatiently after I've stopped. The even better part is when the flash goes off after they've rolled right through behind me. GOTCHA.

Posted on: 2013/6/30 10:56
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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Quote:

dtjcview wrote:
By the same logic would you remove warning signs and crash barriers from dangerous road curves, and tell drivers to "man up" after they fall off a cliff?


The sign isn't to warn you of a dangerous condition.
It's to tell you that there is a camera at the intersection.

:ROFL:
Resized Image

Posted on: 2013/6/30 10:46

Edited by Binky on 2013/6/30 11:10:23
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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Most people who think they're "stopping" at a stop sign or before a right turn on red really aren't. They're usually rolling through slowly. How to tell if you've done it correctly? When there's angry honking behind you.

Posted on: 2013/6/30 10:28
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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Quote:

Vigilante wrote:
People are still complaining even after admitting that they probably didn't come to a full stop? There is no "gray area". You stop, wait about 8 seconds then go when it's safe. All I can say is GOTCHA.


Eight seconds at an intersection in Jersey? Now THAT'S debateable.

Posted on: 2013/6/30 9:59
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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Quote:

dtjcview wrote:
By the same logic would you remove warning signs and crash barriers from dangerous road curves, and tell drivers to "man up" after they fall off a cliff?


Quote:

dtjcview wrote:
The sign is meant to indicate that this is a known accident trouble spot (debatable),


Man up and pay the fine for running a red light, then demand that Fulop move the sign warning drivers about the debatable intersection.

Posted on: 2013/6/30 9:55
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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As someone else has mentioned, you can go online to watch the video of your infraction. With the ticket letter, you should have received an insert explaining how you can access the information online, which is where you can see the actual video of your infraction. Unfortunately, I was also caught with a similar infraction, and there is no way to get out of it, as it clearly shows (at least, in my case) that I did NOT make a full stop. I went to court (to see how it all works out, and hoping that MAYBE I could plead to a lesser, less costly ticket, but they really have you on video, and they will review it, if you so request. And, the law is clear: you must come to a COMPLETE stop, and do so BEFORE the white line, and the stop must be at least 3 seconds (or, is it five?) before proceeding.

If you didn't make that full stop, there is no way to get out of that ticket. Save yourself the aggravation, and pay it. And, consider it a lesson learned.

Posted on: 2013/6/30 9:47
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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People are still complaining even after admitting that they probably didn't come to a full stop? There is no "gray area". You stop, wait about 8 seconds then go when it's safe. All I can say is GOTCHA.

Posted on: 2013/6/30 9:41
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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By the same logic would you remove warning signs and crash barriers from dangerous road curves, and tell drivers to "man up" after they fall off a cliff?

Road regulations and signage are a means to an end. Safety. And not an end in themselves. Putting traffic cameras on dangerous intersections is a good thing. Not warning drivers about the dangerous intersection isn't.

Posted on: 2013/6/30 9:34
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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Did the sign say "Okay to run red light if you don't think a full stop is necessary and a cop isn't parked across the street"?

Posted on: 2013/6/30 9:28
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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Excuses, excuses.
Obey the law.
If you get a ticket there, you can log in and view the short video that shows you breaking the law.
The obscured sign merely says that a camera is recording you, like a store posting signs warning that you are being monitored on a closed circuit television system. Do you think that if a store doesn't post that sign, that it's okay to shoplift?
Man up.

Posted on: 2013/6/30 7:06
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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Quote:

tern wrote:
What does the obscured sign say that could be relevant in this situation?

Unless it was a sign I've never heard of before saying "You don't have to come to a stop before turning right at this junction".

Robin.


The sign is meant to indicate that this is a known accident trouble spot (debatable), traffic laws will be more rigorously enforced, and proceed with extra care. Same as you see marked on areas of the highway on posted speed limits. It tells the driver to proceed more cautiously and in this case allow more time to stop.

Recently, that section of road has been a bit of a slalom course, you turn the corner under the bridge, try to avoid the huge potholes, the river cause by the broken water mains, the broken glass on the roadway, then as you merge right into the junction, the yellow light can come at you fast. If you hit the brakes hard you risk being rear-ended, and also risk your brakes/abs seizing when they hit the sunken manhole covers on the right hand side of the road.

I believe there are also some legal obligations around this kind of selective enforcement. Personally I think they're a good idea - I'd even like to see them extended to catching people running through stop signs. But let's not forget their real purpose. Safety.

Posted on: 2013/6/30 2:03
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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I got one at Jersey and Christopher Columbus.
The video shows me clearly rolling through the light to turn right onto Jersey.
Luckily I actually did have a medical emergency, my wife was pregnant at the time, so I went to court to contest it.
They only let me off for that reason and I had to prove it.
So, yes make sure you stop at all red lights before you turn right.
Or make sure you have an emergency ;).

Posted on: 2013/6/30 1:57
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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What does the obscured sign say that could be relevant in this situation?

Unless it was a sign I've never heard of before saying "You don't have to come to a stop before turning right at this junction".

Robin.

Posted on: 2013/6/30 0:33
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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Love it !
We complain about crosswalk issues, speeding cars, failing to stop at intersections, pedestrian and cyclist safety the need for more enforcement etc etc.

Sorry, but no sympathy from me - The cameras go 'off' for a reason and unless there is a medical or life threatening situation / excuse or some sort of mechanical / software program with the camera you are caught and should pay or face the consequences. I'd like to see more cameras on our streets to show people breaching the laws - The cameras also mitigate people complaining about what they actually did and unnecessary legal costs for police and enforcement agency.

The Police should offer alledged traffic violators the opportunity to view the footage for a fee (it would require time for staff to review footage as your cost) before court, or the violator should request a copy if they want it heard in Court.

Posted on: 2013/6/29 20:01
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Re: Traffic violations for turning right on red?
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I keep hoping someone will just set those cameras on fire like they started doing to the speed cameras in the UK.

http://english.controleradar.org/burning-gatso.php

As for turning right on red.. I don't if there is a camera present (even if it is legal)... I don't trust the operators to see that I came to a complete stop. I don't have enough personal days to take off work to fight a red light camera ticket.

Posted on: 2013/6/29 15:36
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