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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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Monroe wrote:
....with two sales outlets in NJ, their existing model is ONE service center, in Springfield, to take are of the whole state for service and warranty repair. Sure not very consumer friendly.

Why is it a job for the state to mandate the number and location of official service centers?



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I'm not sure such a big deal should be made over a car (with a huge Obama 'green' tax break) that costs over $70K, to enrich a billionaire like Elon Musk though.

Yet more rationalizations. How special.

If it isn't a "big deal," then there shouldn't be a problem offering them a waiver. I.e. it IS a big deal, because it can change the way cars are sold.

It's also completely irrelevant how much the car costs, or who owns the company.

Posted on: 2014/3/12 19:15
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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Monroe wrote:
Quote:

JCMan8 wrote:
Quote:

devilsadvocate wrote:
Quote:

Monroe wrote:
The horror! Imagine all those poor Short Hills Mall shoppers who are having their civil rights trampled on-the 1%ers having a problem buying a car from the billionaire Tesla owner with Obama tax breaks!

And Sweeney not organizing the Legislature to allow it! It could be the civil right issue of our time methinks.

Can the NJ Senate President be impeached for this?


You speak in the language of corrupt politicians. Very impressive. Erecting massive trade barriers for protectionism isn't a problem because Teslas are for the 1%, who of course we hate. Boooo 1%, yay corrupt dealership model.

Seriously guys, we need legislative action to repeal the dealership model.



I wouldn't go that far. Before Christie and his cabinet on the MVC changed the law, New Jersey plainly allowed for direct sales and a dealership model. If some people enjoy the dealership experience, let them continue. But do not take away the rights of others who want to buy a car like a Tesla.


Not true. They had been given a waiver, with the understanding that they would have a chance to lobby the Legislature to change the law or negotiate with Trenton over this. Every dealer has to renew yearly. And, with two sales outlets in NJ, their existing model is ONE service center, in Springfield, to take are of the whole state for service and warranty repair. Sure not very consumer friendly . . .

I'm not sure such a big deal should be made over a car (with a huge Obama 'green' tax break) that costs over $70K, to enrich a billionaire like Elon Musk though.



Do you type your schtick with a straight face?

Posted on: 2014/3/12 19:13
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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Monroe wrote:
Just imagine if Tesla sold a thousand cars without dealer support in NJ. A design fault causes every battery to fail. Consumers would be screaming at Christie after Tesla said 'well, it'll be 6 months before we can fix your cars'.

Tesla already has service centers.

There is no reason why this would be any different for Tesla than for any other car dealer.


Quote:
Or, GM, Chrysler, and every other manufacturer decides to go the Tesla route. Thousands and thousands of dealer employees lose their jobs.

1) Did you really not notice how the GM and Chrysler bankruptcies resulted in the closure of car dealerships, and the loss of jobs?

2) Should it be the role of government to mandate market inefficiencies, for the sole purpose of protecting jobs?

3) You do realize that Teslas still require sales and repair staff, yes? If you want to sell cars, you need to hire people -- regardless of whether you sell direct or through dealers.


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Again, why aren't the haters going after Sweeney?

Sweeney didn't expedite a rule change that basically targeted Tesla. Christie did.

Posted on: 2014/3/12 19:11
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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JCMan8 wrote:
Quote:

devilsadvocate wrote:
Quote:

Monroe wrote:
The horror! Imagine all those poor Short Hills Mall shoppers who are having their civil rights trampled on-the 1%ers having a problem buying a car from the billionaire Tesla owner with Obama tax breaks!

And Sweeney not organizing the Legislature to allow it! It could be the civil right issue of our time methinks.

Can the NJ Senate President be impeached for this?


You speak in the language of corrupt politicians. Very impressive. Erecting massive trade barriers for protectionism isn't a problem because Teslas are for the 1%, who of course we hate. Boooo 1%, yay corrupt dealership model.

Seriously guys, we need legislative action to repeal the dealership model.



I wouldn't go that far. Before Christie and his cabinet on the MVC changed the law, New Jersey plainly allowed for direct sales and a dealership model. If some people enjoy the dealership experience, let them continue. But do not take away the rights of others who want to buy a car like a Tesla.


Not true. They had been given a waiver, with the understanding that they would have a chance to lobby the Legislature to change the law or negotiate with Trenton over this. Every dealer has to renew yearly. And, with two sales outlets in NJ, their existing model is ONE service center, in Springfield, to take are of the whole state for service and warranty repair. Sure not very consumer friendly . . .

I'm not sure such a big deal should be made over a car (with a huge Obama 'green' tax break) that costs over $70K, to enrich a billionaire like Elon Musk though.


Posted on: 2014/3/12 18:53
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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Agreed. And while you noticed that those like Monroe in favor are either partisan hacks or are associated with car dealers, don't be tricked by yet another lie that any company seeking to circumvent dealers would face the same obstacles.

Ever been to an Apple store?

Posted on: 2014/3/12 18:49
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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JCMan8 wrote:
Quote:

devilsadvocate wrote:
Quote:

Monroe wrote:
The horror! Imagine all those poor Short Hills Mall shoppers who are having their civil rights trampled on-the 1%ers having a problem buying a car from the billionaire Tesla owner with Obama tax breaks!

And Sweeney not organizing the Legislature to allow it! It could be the civil right issue of our time methinks.

Can the NJ Senate President be impeached for this?


You speak in the language of corrupt politicians. Very impressive. Erecting massive trade barriers for protectionism isn't a problem because Teslas are for the 1%, who of course we hate. Boooo 1%, yay corrupt dealership model.

Seriously guys, we need legislative action to repeal the dealership model.



I wouldn't go that far. Before Christie and his cabinet on the MVC changed the law, New Jersey plainly allowed for direct sales and a dealership model. If some people enjoy the dealership experience, let them continue. But do not take away the rights of others who want to buy a car like a Tesla.


I mean the mandatory dealership law. I'm perfectly fine with allowing dealerships as long as direct sales are also allowed. I should be able to buy a car 100% online, just as I do with computers, watches and everything else.

Posted on: 2014/3/12 18:44
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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devilsadvocate wrote:
Quote:

Monroe wrote:
The horror! Imagine all those poor Short Hills Mall shoppers who are having their civil rights trampled on-the 1%ers having a problem buying a car from the billionaire Tesla owner with Obama tax breaks!

And Sweeney not organizing the Legislature to allow it! It could be the civil right issue of our time methinks.

Can the NJ Senate President be impeached for this?


You speak in the language of corrupt politicians. Very impressive. Erecting massive trade barriers for protectionism isn't a problem because Teslas are for the 1%, who of course we hate. Boooo 1%, yay corrupt dealership model.

Seriously guys, we need legislative action to repeal the dealership model.



I wouldn't go that far. Before Christie and his cabinet on the MVC changed the law, New Jersey plainly allowed for direct sales and a dealership model. If some people enjoy the dealership experience, let them continue. But do not take away the rights of others who want to buy a car like a Tesla.

Posted on: 2014/3/12 18:41
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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devilsadvocate wrote:
Quote:

Monroe wrote:
The horror! Imagine all those poor Short Hills Mall shoppers who are having their civil rights trampled on-the 1%ers having a problem buying a car from the billionaire Tesla owner with Obama tax breaks!

And Sweeney not organizing the Legislature to allow it! It could be the civil right issue of our time methinks.

Can the NJ Senate President be impeached for this?


You speak in the language of corrupt politicians. Very impressive. Erecting massive trade barriers for protectionism isn't a problem because Teslas are for the 1%, who of course we hate. Boooo 1%, yay corrupt dealership model.

Seriously guys, we need legislative action to repeal the dealership model.



Finally, a point made without inane Christie bashing. The fact is, ANY company trying to eliminate dealers would face the same hurdles that Tesla tried to avoid, regardless if it is Christie or Corzine.

The same obstacles face companies who would want to sell liquor direct, or in many cases wine, to NJ residents. All these things are controlled by state law and need to have legislative changes to allow them.

'Massive trade barriers?' Just how many Tesla's have been sold in NJ-do you know how much they cost? I've seen two in the time they've been selling them in NJ, and both were in Summit, next door to the Short Hill Mall.


Posted on: 2014/3/12 18:40
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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Monroe wrote:
The horror! Imagine all those poor Short Hills Mall shoppers who are having their civil rights trampled on-the 1%ers having a problem buying a car from the billionaire Tesla owner with Obama tax breaks!

And Sweeney not organizing the Legislature to allow it! It could be the civil right issue of our time methinks.

Can the NJ Senate President be impeached for this?


You speak in the language of corrupt politicians. Very impressive. Erecting massive trade barriers for protectionism isn't a problem because Teslas are for the 1%, who of course we hate. Boooo 1%, yay corrupt dealership model.

Seriously guys, we need legislative action to repeal the dealership model.


Posted on: 2014/3/12 18:28
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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The horror! Imagine all those poor Short Hills Mall shoppers who are having their civil rights trampled on-the 1%ers having a problem buying a car from the billionaire Tesla owner with Obama tax breaks!

And Sweeney not organizing the Legislature to allow it! It could be the civil right issue of our time methinks.

Can the NJ Senate President be impeached for this?

Posted on: 2014/3/12 18:22
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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Monroe wrote:
Sorry, I guess you're a big supporter of GED Leader Sweeney, lol.

Where is your outrage at our Democratic led Legislature for not sending a bill to Governor Christie to sign allowing manufacturers to sell direct in NJ?

And you're in favor of cars that give tax breaks to the 1%ers who can afford Tesla cars?

And just how is the electricity generated to power these 'electric' cars? Does it come from wind farms?


I don't follow NJ Democrats. If they're anthing like the ones in Washington they're damn near worthless.

Is the electric car ready to go and free of problems? I'd rather we were spending billions of dollars on them than spending billions of dollars on new jet fighters when the ones we have can take out a 3rd world country's airforce and defense systems in one day.

Posted on: 2014/3/12 18:20
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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Monroe wrote:
Just imagine if Tesla sold a thousand cars without dealer support in NJ. A design fault causes every battery to fail. Consumers would be screaming at Christie after Tesla said 'well, it'll be 6 months before we can fix your cars'. But where is our consumer protection? Why did Christie allow this to happen?

Or, GM, Chrysler, and every other manufacturer decides to go the Tesla route.

Thousands and thousands of dealer employees lose their jobs.

How could Christie allow this attack on employees?

The fact is, Tesla knew they had to come into compliance with existing (can I say 'settled') law and made scant attempt either to find a way to comply or get the Legislature on board.

Again, why aren't the haters going after Sweeney?? Partisan politics, of course.


Guessing you work at or have some interest in a car dealership. This post is full of nonsense.

1. The length of time to fix a car isn't closely linked to the number of car dealerships present. There are a variety of methods to fix a large number of vehicles with even 0 dealerships.

2. The 1000s of employees working at a dealership because of regulations are about as moving to me as arguing against tax simplification and reform on the grounds that accountants will lose jobs. I will happily vote to have you guys fired. Why? Because I've dealt with far too many of you jerks and your monopoly over car sales has allowed you to adopt the worst behaviors imaginable. Replacing you guys with direct sales would be fantastic and would make buying a car a decent experience instead of awful.

3. If you guys aren't awful, then the dealership model will win out in the free market. I'm guessing the second your political cover is blown you will go the way of the dinosaur.

Posted on: 2014/3/12 18:18
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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Monroe wrote:
Sorry, I guess you're a big supporter of GED Leader Sweeney, lol.

Where is your outrage at our Democratic led Legislature for not sending a bill to Governor Christie to sign allowing manufacturers to sell direct in NJ?

And you're in favor of cars that give tax breaks to the 1%ers who can afford Tesla cars?

And just how is the electricity generated to power these 'electric' cars? Does it come from wind farms?


You've already looked like an ignorant fool by coming onto this thread and spewing incorrect information about how the only change in existing law can come from the Legislature. Taking a factually incorrect swipe at Sweeney too.

I guess you are doubling down.

Posted on: 2014/3/12 18:11
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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Sorry, I guess you're a big supporter of GED Leader Sweeney, lol.

Where is your outrage at our Democratic led Legislature for not sending a bill to Governor Christie to sign allowing manufacturers to sell direct in NJ?

And you're in favor of cars that give tax breaks to the 1%ers who can afford Tesla cars?

And just how is the electricity generated to power these 'electric' cars? Does it come from wind farms?

Posted on: 2014/3/12 18:05
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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Monroe wrote: Just imagine if Tesla sold a thousand cars without dealer support in NJ. A design fault causes every battery to fail. Consumers would be screaming at Christie after Tesla said 'well, it'll be 6 months before we can fix your cars'. But where is our consumer protection? Why did Christie allow this to happen? Or, GM, Chrysler, and every other manufacturer decides to go the Tesla route. Thousands and thousands of dealer employees lose their jobs. How could Christie allow this attack on employees? The fact is, Tesla knew they had to come into compliance with existing (can I say 'settled') law and made scant attempt either to find a way to comply or get the Legislature on board. Again, why aren't the haters going after Sweeney?? Partisan politics, of course.
How does the inside of Christie's colon look from there?

Posted on: 2014/3/12 17:58
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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Posted on: 2014/3/12 17:57
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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Just imagine if Tesla sold a thousand cars without dealer support in NJ. A design fault causes every battery to fail. Consumers would be screaming at Christie after Tesla said 'well, it'll be 6 months before we can fix your cars'. But where is our consumer protection? Why did Christie allow this to happen?

Or, GM, Chrysler, and every other manufacturer decides to go the Tesla route.

Thousands and thousands of dealer employees lose their jobs.

How could Christie allow this attack on employees?

The fact is, Tesla knew they had to come into compliance with existing (can I say 'settled') law and made scant attempt either to find a way to comply or get the Legislature on board.

Again, why aren't the haters going after Sweeney?? Partisan politics, of course.

Posted on: 2014/3/12 17:44
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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bodhipooh wrote:
At a more philosophical level, I just don't see why the government must get involved in this. For anyone familiar with Tesla, their customer service is impeccable, including coming out to you when problems arise, and willing to swap cars when service is needed that requires your car to be worked on for any length of time. So, the argument that consumers need this protection (under the guise that dealerships provide valuable customer service/repairs) is bogus and disingenuous. In fact, Tesla is HIGHLY ranked as a trustworthy brand, and current owners/customers speak highly of their product and experience.


Maybe you should direct your concerns to Emperor Christie, the free market loving Republican. I'm sure he takes his constituents' concerns very seriously.


This is a corruption issue and I, for one, have little faith with regards to Christie on that topic. And I say this despite being a Republican. This incident with Tesla has reinforced my suspicions in this regard.

Posted on: 2014/3/12 17:28
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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bodhipooh wrote:
At a more philosophical level, I just don't see why the government must get involved in this. For anyone familiar with Tesla, their customer service is impeccable, including coming out to you when problems arise, and willing to swap cars when service is needed that requires your car to be worked on for any length of time. So, the argument that consumers need this protection (under the guise that dealerships provide valuable customer service/repairs) is bogus and disingenuous. In fact, Tesla is HIGHLY ranked as a trustworthy brand, and current owners/customers speak highly of their product and experience.


Maybe you should direct your concerns to Emperor Christie, the free market loving Republican. I'm sure he takes his constituents' concerns very seriously.

Posted on: 2014/3/12 17:21
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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At a more philosophical level, I just don't see why the government must get involved in this. For anyone familiar with Tesla, their customer service is impeccable, including coming out to you when problems arise, and willing to swap cars when service is needed that requires your car to be worked on for any length of time. So, the argument that consumers need this protection (under the guise that dealerships provide valuable customer service/repairs) is bogus and disingenuous. In fact, Tesla is HIGHLY ranked as a trustworthy brand, and current owners/customers speak highly of their product and experience.

Posted on: 2014/3/12 17:07
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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The entire relationship between the dealership system and the government, as evidenced by the Tesla response both in NJ and in other states, wreaks of corruption. We absolutely need to allow direct sales to customers.

Posted on: 2014/3/12 15:20
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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Like every longtime NJ resident knows, this is all about lining politicians' pockets. The idea that auto dealers (??!!) protect consumers is purely laughable. They simply beat Tesla at the cash game:

http://www.businessinsider.com/how-te ... utgunned-in-jersey-2014-3

That's right, almost $700k in donations compared to $0 from Tesla. And it's not just Christie-- Sweeney and all the rest received donations as well.

But this garbage about the "free market" is just a story they sell you when it's convenient for them. Money talks.

Posted on: 2014/3/12 14:49
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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It's all Vaudeville, fools. These politicians are bought and they stay bought. There's too much money to be made when they leave office for them to be anything more than actors in a play put on for commoners.

Edit: I meant to say "folks" but "fools" is even better.

Posted on: 2014/3/12 11:16
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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Reminders me of another vehicle manufacturer called Tucker. that was forced out by other 'established' manufacturers that had the 'ear' of law makers and governors!
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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Franchise dealers protecting consumers ?


Posted on: 2014/3/12 4:58
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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What a bunch of corrupt wankers.

Robin.

Posted on: 2014/3/12 1:12
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Tesla Stores May Be Closed After N.J. Blocks Direct Sales
By Terrence Dopp and Alan Ohnsman Mar 11, 2014 7:01 PM ET

Governor Chris Christie’s administration blocked Tesla Motors Inc. (TSLA), the electric-car maker that doesn’t have franchised retail dealers, from direct auto sales in a move the company said could shutter its only two stores in New Jersey.

The New Jersey Motor Vehicle Commission, which includes members of Christie’s cabinet, unanimously approved the proposal today in Trenton, delaying public comment on the matter until after the hearing. Tesla earlier today said it learned only yesterday, after months of negotiations, that the rule change was coming to the most densely populated U.S. state, which is important for reaching customers in the New York metro area.

Christie “has gone back on his word,” Tesla Chief Executive Officer Elon Musk said early today on Twitter. “His administration, under pressure from auto dealers, may shut down Tesla in NJ as soon as today.”

Tesla is battling dealers state by state to secure or protect the right to sell its cars directly to consumers. Auto dealers in Ohio, New York, Minnesota, Georgia and elsewhere in the past year have sought to block Tesla from directly retailing its models, arguing that independent retailers are better for shoppers and owners of vehicles. Texas dealers successfully backed a law setting the nation’s toughest restrictions on Tesla. Arizona, Colorado and Virginia also imposed limits.

No Surprises

The New Jersey vote shouldn’t have been a surprise to Palo Alto, California-based Tesla, said a Christie spokesman.

“Since Tesla first began operating in New Jersey one year ago, it was made clear that the company would need to engage the Legislature on a bill to establish their new direct-sales operations under New Jersey law,” said Kevin Roberts, the spokesman. “This administration does not find it appropriate to unilaterally change the way cars are sold in New Jersey without legislation and Tesla has been aware of this position since the beginning.”

On the commission with the three members of Christie’s cabinet are four gubernatorial appointees. The panel is led by non-voting Chairman Raymond Martinez, who was appointed by Christie, a Republican, in February 2010.

Tesla should either adjust its business model to conform with New Jersey law or seek changes to it, said James Appleton, president of the state’s dealer association.

New Jersey’s “statute is on the books to protect consumers,” he said, while “Tesla’s business model crushes competition.”

Tesla slipped 1.9 percent to $234.41 at the close in New York, the third consecutive decline for the shares that have risen 56 percent this year.

‘Bad Faith’

“A decision was made rather abruptly and certainly without any consultation with us,” Diarmuid O’Connell, Tesla’s vice president of business development, said in a conference call before the commission met. “There are probably a couple levels of bad faith and surreptitious behavior.”

The New Jersey Commission’s vote came the same day Tesla officials met in Ohio with representatives of auto dealers to seek a compromise on a bill in a Senate committee to force Tesla to use franchise dealers if it wants more sales points in the Buckeye State.

“We’re still negotiating,” said Senator Scott Oelslager, a Republican who is chairman of the committee.

The Senate panel accepted written testimony from General Motors Co. opposing any additional dealer licenses for Tesla beyond the two for stores in Columbus and Cincinnati.

“Tesla is an automobile manufacturer, they compete with our vehicles in the market, and they should compete under the same laws we do,” the Detroit-based company said.

‘Big Business’

The maker of Model S cars that start at $71,000 has already begun talks with New Jersey lawmakers about amending the state’s law and will also consider options including litigation, said Jonathan Chang, a lawyer for the automaker. Tesla’s stores in the state are at the Mall at Short Hills and at the Garden State Plaza in Paramus.

“New Jersey is one of our larger markets for Model S and so it’s an important market for us,” he said. “But really, any market is an important market for us.”

After the decision, 14 people including Chang and Appleton spoke. The crowd of about three-dozen people was weighted in favor of Tesla supporters, with many standing up to tell stories of excellent customer service.

Thomas Moloughney, 47, of Chester, New Jersey, who said he doesn’t own a Tesla or stock in the company, attended the hearing as an aficionado of electric cars.

“This board acted purely in the interests of big business and the dealerships, but they left the people of New Jersey behind,” said Moloughney, owner of Bella Casa, a restaurant in Montclair that offers diners free electric-vehicle charging in its parking lot. “If they really wanted to be fair they would have had a public hearing.”

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-03 ... -blocks-direct-sales.html

Posted on: 2014/3/12 0:54
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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Monroe wrote:
For the dumbasses here

The Legislature would have to propose changes to the existing law, and then, and only then, would Christie be able to sign into law a change to allow direct sales.

You probably could say "Democrat Sweeney sitting on his hands and not proposing changes to the Legislature to allow Tesla to sell direct" and it would be accurate though.





For the dumbass Monroe, who clearly didn't read the article.

Tesla wanted this to go through the Legislature. That's what they are so upset about. Instead, Christie pushed through a rule proposal through the DMV, as a way of circumventing the Legislature.

And, despite my posting the article mere hours ago, Christie already got what he wanted. The proposal passed, minus the Legislature, and Tesla direct sales are banned starting April 1.

http://www.businessinsider.com/report ... -direct-auto-sales-2014-3

Posted on: 2014/3/12 0:38
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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For the dumbasses here

The Legislature would have to propose changes to the existing law, and then, and only then, would Christie be able to sign into law a change to allow direct sales.

You probably could say "Democrat Sweeney sitting on his hands and not proposing changes to the Legislature to allow Tesla to sell direct" and it would be accurate though.




Posted on: 2014/3/12 0:24
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Re: Christie Administration seeks to block Tesla Motors sales
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MDM wrote:
Quoting from one of the links [emphasis mine]:

However, Christie administration spokesman Kevin Roberts sent a statement to Business Insider that claimed Tesla Motors is the one attempting to work outside normal legislative procedures in New Jersey.

"Since Tesla first began operating in New Jersey one year ago, it was made clear that the company would need to engage the Legislature on a bill to establish their new direct-sales operations under New Jersey law. This administration does not find it appropriate to unilaterally change the way cars are sold in New Jersey without legislation and Tesla has been aware of this position since the beginning," Roberts said.

Tesla did not immediately reply to a request from Business Insider asking for a specific response to Roberts' statement.



Tesla responded to that statement. Look at the first link I posted and click on the update link at the top. Christie hates the free market when it threatens his campaign donors.

Posted on: 2014/3/11 21:22
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