Must be and think of all the money Asbury Park must have saved since us saps in Jersey City are paying for his lifetime health benefits and 94g pension for his 3 years of service he gave us.

http://www.nj.com/hudson/index.ssf/20 ... e_benefits_from_city.html

Apparently he is one of the greatest city business administrators of all time.

Asbury Park hires former Jersey City administrator as city manager

By Christopher Robbins/NJ.com
January 09, 2014 at 11:51 AM

ASBURY PARK ? The city is under new management.

The Asbury Park Council appointed former Jersey City Business Administrator John Kelly to the city manager position at it?s Wednesday night meeting.

?He was the best qualified person to come into Asbury Park,? Councilman John Moor said. ?He?ll be ready to hit the ground running, and I think he?ll be good.?

When he starts work next month, Kelly will be paid a $140,000 annual salary.

?He?ll start on Feb. 1,? Moor said. ?Until then he?ll be meeting people and finding his way around.?

Through the end of the month, the city will continue to run under the supervision of interim City Manager Anthony Nuccio.

Kelly?s term of employment ends Dec. 31, when a new council will decide whether to retain him.

Before abruptly retiring in August 2013, Kelly, 54, oversaw Jersey City?s 3,000-person workforce. He spent over 20 years as the Chief Financial Officer in Orange.

Asbury Park has sought a new city manager since choosing to part ways with Terrence Reidy in July.

Moor said disagreement on the City Council was responsible for the delay.

?We should have hired him in November,? Moor said. ?I?ll go to my grave saying that. I?m really frustrated by the obstructionism on the council.?

Since the council reorganized, incumbent council members John Loffredo and Sue Henderson have resisted replacing Reidy.

At the start, Kelly will inherit a city beset by violent crime, infrastructure and financial issues amid a period of economic and cultural revitalization.

http://www.nj.com/monmouth/index.ssf/ ... boss_as_city_manager.html

John ?Jack? Kelly is a good man.

He embodies all of the venerable qualities that become any gentleman. For example,

He is hardworking; how many other men can withstand the demands and pressures of maintaining 2 full-time jobs and 2 part-time jobs at once and still have time to enjoy a family life, a social life, and sneak an occasional round of golf here and there.

He is modest; ?Jack? Kelly came to Jersey City unannounced and without the public fanfare that many officials demand. All he asked was that Jersey City taxpayers finance his medical benefits for life to the tune of about $17000 a year, after only working one day rather that the 25-30 years that every other Jersey City employee is required to work. In return, ?Jack? Kelly would ?graciously? decrease government services and increase property taxes in order to support ?generous? contracts like his.

He is athletic; ?Jack? Kelly can jump over the heads of the Mayor and the City Council in one leap and supersede their authority by entering into contracts without their consent or consideration in the matter. In June 2011, Mr. Kelly had a closed door meeting with representatives from Frenkel & Co. and Express Scripts resulting in Mr. Kelly entering into an agreement to change employee prescription plan benefits in violation of collective bargaining agreements. Mr. Kelly has repeatedly refuse to comply with OPRA requests to produce a copy of the Express Scripts plan agreement he entered into, and has forced Jersey City into costly litigation defending his unethical actions.

He is a celebrity; who doesn?t know John ?call me Jack? Kelly? You can find him waving to the crowds from his Jaguar during his extended lunches. His name even echoes in the halls of the State Capital Building when he was prominently named in a State Investigation where he was notably recognized for his ?unethical? and ?irresponsible behavior?

He is organized: ?Jack? Kelly surreptitiously entered into an agreement to change the employee dental plan from Delta to Horizon without council approval, so when he was asked to produce a side-by-side comparison, his office said they ?couldn?t find it?, ?it wasn?t ready?, ?they didn?t have it.? In addition, when asked why he waited until the last minute to change the agreement, he may have simply ?forgot? that a significant contract was due. What else has he forgotten?

He is an optimist; even though it is estimated that at the end of 2012 upwards to 100 police officers, almost an entire police precinct, will retire, leaving the Jersey City police department even more critically understaffed, allowing the overtime budget to swell into the millions.
Nevertheless, we believe that Mr. Kelly anticipates his cuts to government services and property tax hikes will reduce crime and not recklessly endanger the city by ignoring plans to properly staff critical emergency services.

He can see into the future: ?Jack? Kelly didn?t care that empirical research from think tanks such as the RAND Institute and the Economic Policy Institute had overwhelmingly demonstrated that from a social or economic perspective, police layoffs were irrational since the costs that they impose are 12.9 times greater than the costs they save. Had Mr. Kelly?s obstructionist ruse prevailed in the face of the collaborative efforts between the POBA and the Mayor?s office to prevent the layoff of 82 police officers, Jersey City would have surely been worse of financially and communally.

So, the question remains??Do you still want a man of this caliber as your Business Administrator??

CALL YOUR COUNCILPERSON TODAY TO DEMAND THAT JOHN KELLY?S CONTRACT BE ANNULLED AND MR. KELLY IMMEDIATELY TENDER HIS RESIGNATION.





Council President Peter Brennan.
BrennanP@jcnj.org


Councilwoman-at-Large
Viola Richardson RichardsonV@jcnj.org

Councilman-at-Large Rolando Lavarro
(201) 547-5458

Ward A (Greenville) Councilman
Michael Sottolano SottolanoM@jcnj.org

Ward B (West Side) Councilman David Donnelly
DonnellyD@jcnj.org



Ward C (Journal Square) Councilwoman Nidia Lopez
NLopez@jcnj.org


Ward D (The Heights) Councilman William Gaughan bgaughan@hcnj.us


Ward E (Downtown) Councilman Steven Fulop
FulopS@jcnj.org


Ward F (Bergen/Lafayette) Councilperson Michelle Massey

nothing changes. Healy's team makes a mockery of the rules and knows that no one can really slow them down. These federal charges against Vega, Beldini etc don't seem to have slowed down the biz as usual attitude.

WOW, this guy Kelly is a real piece of work. He's got a long history of corruption in Orange and will fit in just peachy here.

Check out this 1998 report from the State of New Jersey Commission of Investigation.

Fundraising scandals, travel scandals, personal car scandals. John "Jack" Kelly should go back to Orange. We don't need more of his type here.

http://www.taxes2high.org/Municipal%20Spending.html

Plus his biggest claim to fame is presiding over FOUR revals? Yeah, that's just what we need.

Jersey City Business Administrator defends his work for three other municipalities WORKING 3 JOBS?

Monday, August 30, 2010
By MELISSA HAYES
JOURNAL STAFF WRITER

A Jersey City councilman has asked the mayor to remove a recently-hired city official becaause he also does work for three municipalities outside Hudson County.

But Business Administrator John "Jack" Kelly is defending his job and the work he is doing, saying one of the jobs is only temporary.

Ward E Councilman Steven Fulop wrote a letter to Mayor Jerramiah T. Healy last week asking for Kelly to be removed because he has continued to serve as finance director of the City of Orange Township.

When the city hired him in May, Kelly said he would keep his part-time job as joint municipal tax assessor of Essex Fells and Caldwell Borough at night and on weekends, but he said nothing about Orange.

When Fulop learned that Kelly was still serving as Orange's finance director he fired off a letter to the mayor saying, "Anything less than removing him from his role in Jersey City is not acceptable and we should be cutting ties early when issues of public trust exist."

Healy is supporting Kelly, who said last week that he didn't intend to keep working in Orange when he came to Jersey City.

"I'm working very part-time," Kelly said. "I go in on Saturdays or Sunday mornings and a file is left for me."

Kelly said that shortly after he accepted the position in Jersey City, about 10 Orange employees announced they were retiring in June, including four from the finance office, leaving only six in the department.

Kelly, who has worked in Orange's finance office for 21 years, said he is helping transition in John Ditinyak, whom Orange hired as a deputy finance director, to the department's top job. Kelly said it is no different from what former Jersey City Business Administrator Brian O'Reilly, who retired Aug. 1, did for him.

"The city (of Orange) has hired someone, but because there is no institutional memory there now, I've been helping - just like Brian was here for three months when I got the job," he said.

But in his letter, Fulop said Kelly should dedicate all of his time to Jersey City.

"I need not remind anyone of the difficult financial situation the city is currently experiencing and the role of business administrator for Jersey City is not a part-time job," Fulop wrote.

"While disturbing that your office was willing to accept him remaining in his tax assessor capacity within two other towns elsewhere, the fact that he is still part of the administration in Orange and being compensated is reprehensible and inappropriate." Healy noted that Kelly is only working in Orange temporarily.

"In the short time Jack Kelly has been here he has proven to be an asset to our city," Healy said in a statement.

"Mr. Kelly has displayed a wealth and depth of knowledge in city government, municipal contracts, and all other fiscal matters. Considering the fiscal crisis that this city and all others around the nation are in, it is a privilege to have him here. The position in Orange is part-time and temporary in nature and consists of transitioning a new CFO there as needed."

Kelly said he's more than carrying his load in Jersey City.

"My attitude is, I work more than 50 hours a week here and if Fulop is going to wonder what I do on a Saturday morning maybe he's going to start questioning my religion," Kelly said.

Jersey City Business Administrator John "Jack" Kelly is defending his jobs in Jersey City and Orange after Ward E Councilman Steven Fulop called for his removal yesterday.

For the full story:

http://www.nj.com/hudson/index.ssf/20 ... business_administr_2.html

May 13th, this BA got confirmed. It is 3+ mo and still Orange could NOT find a replacement. How long, he is going to be temping there? NO wonder why they asked for a 6 month extension to fix the Budget... God, save this city !!!

Jersey City business administrator retains job in Orange
Published: Monday, August 23, 2010, 5:29 PM Updated: Monday, August 23, 2010, 5:37 PM
Melissa Hayes/The Jersey Journal

Jersey City?s business administrator is juggling three jobs in four municipalities.
When the city hired John ?Jack? Kelly in May, he disclosed that he would continue working his part-time job as joint municipal tax assessor of Essex Fells and Caldwell Borough at night and on weekends. But Kelly didn?t say anything about keeping his position as finance director of the City of Orange Township.

Kelly has continued to work in Orange, according to a letter Ward E Councilman Steven Fulop sent to Mayor Jerramiah T. Healy today.

Kelly, who took a personal day today, could not be reached for comment.

In his letter, Fulop calls on Healy to remove Kelly. But Healy released a statement supporting the business administrator.

?I need not remind anyone of the difficult financial situation the city is currently experiencing and the role of business administrator for Jersey City is not a part time job,? Fulop wrote.

?While disturbing that your office was willing to accept him remaining in his tax assessor capacity within two other towns elsewhere, the fact that he is still part of the administration in Orange and being compensated is reprehensible and inappropriate,? Fulop continued.

Healy responded to Fulop?s letter with a statement calling Kelly?s position in Orange ?temporary.?

?In the short time Jack Kelly has been here he has proven to be an asset to our city,? Healy said. ?Mr. Kelly has displayed a wealth and depth of knowledge in city government, municipal contracts, and all other fiscal matters.

"Considering the fiscal crisis that this city and all others around the nation are in, it is a privilege to have him here," Healy added. "The position in Orange is part-time and temporary in nature and consists of transitioning a new CFO there as needed.?

Fulop called it ?disturbing? that Kelly could work three jobs in four municipalities while pushing to furlough and layoff Jersey City employees to close a budget deficit.

?Anything less than removing him from his role in Jersey City is not acceptable and we should be cutting ties early when issues of public trust exist,? Fulop wrote. ?As an organization we should let him pursue the jobs and roles that he wishes to hold onto in his three other capacities.?

WTF ?! Fire this bozo !!!!

Quote:


Uhh... but yet Healy was voted in... 3 million dollars for 22000 voters... that is change you can believe in...

Jersey City names new business administrator with 7-1 vote by City Council

Thursday, May 13, 2010

Despite concerns raised by residents, the City Council last night named John "Jack" Kelly as Jersey City's new business administrator.

Several residents mentioned Kelly being named in a 1998 State Commission of Investigation report on Orange, where he has worked for 21 years, most recently as chief financial officer.

Council members defended Kelly, saying the report focused more on Orange's then-mayor Robert Brown and that no criminal charges came of it.

Resident Dale Hardman told the council that the investigation charged Kelly with "unethical" and "irresponsible behavior," and said he participated in intimidation of employees for political donations for the mayor, didn't put contracts out to bid and didn't submit required financial reports.

Resident Yvonne Balcer also took issue with Kelly keeping part-time jobs as the joint municipal tax assessor of Essex Fells and Caldwell Borough, a position he plans to keep.

Council members defended Kelly, saying that as a certified tax assessor he brings a wealth of knowledge and has experience with revaluations, a task the city is undertaking.

"I spoke to at least 10 financial people and business people outside of the city in Hudson County and also people that are in his field in other counties," Ward D Councilman Bill Gaughan said. "I will honestly say I didn't have one negative report on Mr. Kelly. They all praised his work ethic."

The council voted 7-1 to hire Kelly with Ward E Councilman Steve Fulop casting the lone no vote. Ward F Councilwoman Viola Richardson was absent.

Kelly called the CSI report a "scarlet letter" on his otherwise impeccable career.

Kelly replaces Business Administrator Brian O'Reilly, who is retiring.

MELISSA HAYES

Quote:

Several people spoke out against Kelly at council mtg. I thought it SOS with the double dipper Gaughan praising our new double dipper Jack Kelly (works as BA for several other towns as well as JC) who's "character" is easily assessed by reading the 1998 NJ Commission on Investigation document. Just do a "find" on Kelly to see what I'm talking about. Here is the main link, then scroll down to the link for the Commision report:

http://www.taxes2high.org/Municipal%20Spending.html

And the only "blemish" on Bernie Madoff's record was that one Ponzi scheme.

Jersey City names John 'Jack' Kelly its new business administrator

By The Jersey Journal
May 13, 2010, 9:02AM

By a vote of 7-1, Jersey City City Council names John "Jack" Kelly its new business administrator.

Council members were able to see past Kelly's name appearing on 1998 State Commission of Investigation report on Orange, citing it as the only blemish on "impeccable career."

The lone no vote came from Ward F Councilman Steven Fulop. Viola Richardson wasn't present.

"I spoke to at least 10 financial people and business people outside of the city in Hudson County and also people that are in his field in other counties," Ward D Councilman Bill Gaughan started in response to residents' questions about Kelly's character and work ethic. "I will honestly say I didn't have one negative report on Mr. Kelly. They all praised his work ethic."

I think we need to attend the Council meeting this wed. to let City Hall know that Jack Kelly isn't good enough for Jersey City...

I just got through reading the entire 1998 NJ Commission of Investigation "into matters concerning the City of Orange Township"and the coverage on Jack Kelly is extensive. My friend said this: Quote: This guy Jack Kelly is some piece of work! *intimidation of employees for political donations("...pernicious, city-wide atmosphere of pressure to support Brown?s political ambitions....) * no oversight on vendor purchases including not putting contracts out to bid *not signing off on a purchase of a car for the Mayor that the city council never approved *"Kelly ignored his obligation under the Orange Municipal Code, which dictates that the finance director submit to the mayor, Council and business administrator monthly and quarterly reports that are to include ?appropriate analysis, explanations and forecasts of income, expenditures and surplus in relation to the budget.? *Kelly, an avid golfer, made two trips at city council expense that no record of being approved by the council exists, only a manual check that Kelly said should be cut, over a year after the Florida trip took place and then a subsequent trip to Anaheim, both trips to survey the possibility of building a golf course over the city's reservoir! The expense of the Anaheim trip where he was accompanied by the Mayor, were subpoenaed but never were submitted. *"Funds were not routinely certified before the expenditures were made, as required by law" *"In every annual report since 1988, the city?s auditors have recommended ?[t]hat all vouchers be properly signed and completed with supporting documentation, in the form of invoices or other appropriate information, attached. When Chief Financial Officer Kelly was questioned by the Commission on whether he reviews the vouchers prior to payment, he sought to disclaim responsibility:"

from the above link:

"Full time Orange Chief Financial Officer, John W. (Jack) Kelly, works as a tax assessor for other towns, owns commercial property in Orange, and appears to be getting property deals and tax breaks through his City of Orange position.

Kelley worked for the previous mayor and was cited by the 1998 New Jersey Commission of Investigation for "unethical" and "irresponsible behavior" in performance of his City of Orange duties. Read the report and see if you feel your tax dollars are safe."

I can't believe Healy would hire someone unethical, just don't believe it.

Just plain egregious.

http://blogs.app.com/politicspatrol/2 ... ublic-pay-passes-private/

Very interesting site and illuminating.

http://www.taxes2high.org/Municipal%20Spending.html

Streamline city costs so that the taxpayers aren't sucked dry.

County owes millions in unused time

Sick, vacation and OT benefits add up to large payouts

Sunday, May 18, 2003

BY KASI ADDISON AND JEFFERY C. MAYS
STAR-LEDGER STAFF


? See unused time for Essex County



Over a 30-year career as an Orange police officer, Frank Benevento earned a reputation as the Cal Ripken Jr. of his department.

Like the former Baltimore Orioles infielder who set baseball's record for most consecutive games played, Benevento rarely missed a day at work, using only 46 sick days during a career where he worked his way from patrolman to captain. When he retired last summer, Benevento had accumulated 611 compensatory days for unused vacation and sick days, and time in lieu of overtime.

"He was a hard-working guy. He came in to work every day and you knew he was coming in to work. He was an ironman," said Richard Conte, former Orange police chief and police director.

For his steadfast work ethic, the city of Orange cut Benevento a check for $226,062.04 for his unused time. Benevento was one of three Orange retirees last year to receive six-figure checks from the city. Police Lt. Samuel Battista left with a check for $209,976.71 and Lt. Louis Castro received $112, 237.74.

Orange is Essex County's eighth-largest municipality, yet it ranks second behind Newark, the county's biggest municipality, in the amount of money owed to its workers in unused sick and vacation time.

The city of almost 33,000 residents owes its municipal employees $7.5 million in unused sick and vacation time.

Orange's figures are just part of $156 million in unused sick, vacation and other time that Essex County taxpayers owes its municipal, county and school employees. The county ranks third in the state behind Hudson and Bergen counties in the amount owed.

Sue Strande, Livingston's comptroller, said that while the numbers may seem high, benefits compensate workers for salaries that are traditionally lower than in the private sector. Livingston owes a total of almost $4.7 million.

"You can't compare apples to oranges," she said. "You have to compare everything. One of the perks of these jobs is benefits, it is certainly not the pay."

Even top executive employees benefit from the perks.

When former Essex County Executive Jim Treffinger left office in December, he took with him a check for $43,383.33.

Already out on bail for charges of getting county jobs for campaign workers, extorting money from a sewer contractor and then trying to cover up his actions, Treffinger says he was owed the money for 118 unused vacation days during his eight years in office.

The new administration disagreed with his calculation, saying Treffinger was only entitled to be paid for 40 unused vacation days -- the same as every other non-civil service county employee. In fact, Treffinger himself had instituted the rule.

The state attorney general subpoenaed records in the case and, after a review of state statutes by Treffinger's attorney, the former executive refunded the county $21,161.65.

Orange's Chief Financial Officer Jack Kelly said he doesn't like writing out big checks and finds some of the sums "ridiculous." But he said that when it comes to compensatory time, it's a case of "pay now or pay later." Employees who use a lot of sick time cost a lot of money in overtime for other employees.

"How do you compensate that employee who is here every day? We don't have bonus plans so they get compensated at retirement. It's a bonus for being a good employee," Kelly said.

William Faitoute, 77, worked for Millburn as the health officer for 33 years. When he retired, he received $88,152 for unused sick and vacation time.

"I felt I earned that money," Faitoute said. "When I began working, public service jobs paid less than they do now and benefits made up the difference."

But being a good employee can be costly to a town. West Orange owes its municipal employees $7 million. Money owed to county and school employees brings the cost to $12.2 million, or $271 for every man, woman and child in town.

The policies governing the accumulation and payout of compensatory time are governed by union contracts and government policy.

For example, Orange's 60 non-uniformed employees are paid for 110 sick days at 100 percent of value upon retirement and the balance are paid at 20 percent. Employees can accrue an unlimited number of sick days. The same employees are allowed to be paid for up to two years of vacation time.

And employees are paid for the time at the daily pay rate in effect when they retired. For example, although Orange police officer Benevento accrued his time over a 30-year period, he was paid at a captain's salary of $366.30 per day.

Fairfield has a strict "use them or lose them" policy, said township Business Administrator Joseph Catenaro.

"What can happen is that people accumulate the time in a given year and then by the time they retire, their salary doubles or triples," he said. "You would have overpaid for that time off."

The township owes its municipal employees nothing, and has $967,000 in school and county unused compensatory time, according to documents filed with the state. Fairfield's policy translates into savings for taxpayers, Catenaro said.

Kelly said Orange is trying to take steps to reduce the amount of money it pays out, but it's going to take time. The town's Fire Superior Officers Association recently negotiated a new contract where they agreed to reduce the bankable amount of terminal leave time from 126 to 120 days.

Kelly said there's no way the union or an arbitrator would agree to cut that amount of time in half. "The unions fight tooth and nail for this time," Kelly said.

While other towns are trying to reduce their unused compensatory time debt, the South Orange-Maplewood School District will, for the first time next year, reimburse employees for unused sick and vacation time.

Karla Milanette, the district's assistant business administrator, said the policy was negotiated into the last teachers union contract as a way to reward employees for good attendance.

In the past, South Orange-Maplewood School District employees either used their days off or lost them. They were allowed to bank up to 50 sick days for later use, but were not paid for them upon retirement. Under the terms of the new contract, that has all changed.

Teachers and support staff can be reimbursed for unused sick days up to a cap of $100,000.

The staff had been working toward the benefit for some years, said Hannah Edelman, president of the district's teachers union.

"This was a way to acknowledge and affirm those people that have been in the district for an extended period of time," she said of the perk.

Conte, the former Orange police chief, said his suggested solution is to allow employees to accumulate time as a reward, but to pay employees at the end of each year for the time they are owed. That way, employees are paid for the time at their current salary, not after 30 years of raises.

"This eliminates the big bill at the end of people's careers. It also eliminates employees using all their sick days because of a use-it-or-lose-it policy," he said.

Mayor Nominates Longtime Orange CFO as Business Administrator
By Shane Smith ? May 6th, 2010

Jack Kelly, the current Chief Financial Officer (CFO) of Orange in Essex County, has been nominated by Mayor Jerramiah Healy to replace Brian O?Reilly as Jersey City?s business administrator, the mayor announced today. O?Reilly, who has held the business administrator job since 2004, announced in November that he was planning to resign his position.

?While several exceptional candidates applied for the position,? Healy says in a statment, ?Mr. Kelly possess the unique municipal government experience in administration and finance. We are confident in his skills, knowledge and expertise to lead the department of administration during this difficult economic time.?

The nomination of Kelly, who served as Orange?s CFO for 21 years, must be confirmed by the City Council before he can assume office; at this point the council?s assent seems likely. Ward B councilman David Donnelly says he was ?very impressed? when he met with Kelly and says he thinks the hire is ?a good move.? Likewise, Ward A councilman Michael Sottolano intends to support Kelly?s nomination.

?He?s obviously got quite a bit of experience,? Sottolano says, noting that the city was searching for a candidate ?with enough municipal experience? to handle the city?s finances in a difficult time.

Kelly also comes with high praise from state Sen. Richard Codey, who acted as New Jersey?s governor from 2004 to 2006 after former Gov. James McGreevey resigned from office. Codey, an Orange native, tells JCI that he ?relied on [Kelly] often as governor and still [does]? when he has questions about municipal government.

?He?s a hard worker,? Codey says, adding that Kelly?s nomination is ?good news for the city.?

For his part, Kelly says he?s fully cognizant of the fiscal challenges facing Jersey City, and is ready to ?dive right in and roll up [his] sleeves? to tackle them.

Read the rest at
jcindy.com

JC mayor nominates new business administrator

The Hudson Reporter May 06, 2010

JERSEY CITY ? Mayor Jerramiah Healy announced on Thursday that he has nominated Jack Kelly, the current chief financial officer and past city administrator for the City of Orange as the new business administrator for Jersey City.

The appointment, which is pending the approval of the Municipal Council, has been approved by the New Jersey Division of Local Government Services.

Kelly, who has 21 years experience as the CFO of Orange, replaces Brian O?Reilly, who has served as the business administrator since 2004.

Earlier this year Mayor Healy launched a statewide search for a new business administrator in preparation for O?Reilly?s retirement, which will happen before the end of the fiscal year in June.

?While several exceptional candidates applied for the position, Mr. Kelly possess the unique municipal government experience in administration and finance,? Healy said. ?We are confident in his skills, knowledge, and expertise to lead the Department of Administration during this difficult economic time.?

Kelly brings with him experience in municipal budgets, bonding, labor negotiations, as well as streamlining health benefits costs. In his tenure in Orange, Kelly has overseen four property tax revaluations, an endeavor the city of Jersey City is starting to undertake. -- RK