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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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heights wrote:
The cap on rent increases in a rent controlled building is 4% but the owner's responsibility is what ever the hike in tax rates are. So if taxes are raised a certain percentage over a specific amount of years it should equate 4% a year. Lets look at the hike in the property tax rate for the last ten years, including this year.


The cap on rent controlled buildings is based on the rate of inflation to a maximum of 4%/year.

Posted on: 2010/4/24 19:15
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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I recently filed a property tax appeal. Having said that:

1) the landlord who owns the rental property pays property tax and the theory is that cost is calculated in the cost of the rental, so it's not like the renter or the property owner are getting off without paying taxes

2) "Don't buy a property you can't afford?" - ok are you retarded or just don't you realize you live in the corruption capital of the world? Affordable property becomes unaffordable when property taxes are raised by crazy percentages (like 16% in 2 years) because corrupt politicians have cover budget gaps created when they either stole the money outright, kicked it back somewhere or took money for crazy tax abatements from the developers they are in bed with creating a revenue shortfall.

Posted on: 2010/4/24 19:10
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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The cap on rent increases in a rent controlled building is 4% but the owner's responsibility is what ever the hike in tax rates are. So if taxes are raised a certain percentage over a specific amount of years it should equate 4% a year. Lets look at the hike in the property tax rate for the last ten years, including this year.

Posted on: 2010/4/23 16:59
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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You would have a more compelling argument if voter turnout wasn't so pitiful to begin with. Over all voter registration is on average between 60% and 70% of eligible voters.

Voter turnout, as measured as a percentage of those actually registered is in the best years 50% to 60%.

Last May's municipal election was about 30%. I don't think the problem is that renters don't care about property taxes; I think the problem is that residents don't care.

Posted on: 2010/4/23 15:58
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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I'm not complaining about property taxes. I just think renters and landlords have different motivators. When so many people, the old-timers, live in rent stabilized or controlled apartments, then they simply don't care if property taxes or if public spending is out of control because they are protected!

Posted on: 2010/4/23 15:38
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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The bottom line is if you shouldn't own a property you can't afford. If the property tax burden is too much for you, buy a cheaper property. Or rent.

Posted on: 2010/4/23 15:23
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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FGJCNJ1970 wrote:
What sort of bothers me is that while Renters who live in Jersey City can vote in Jersey City, they can also directly vote for all sorts of spending measures like the 100+million tax levy for schools this past Tuesday. Yet, renters don't have to pay for that tax levy and that bothers me as a homeowner.

So renter's will just vote YES all the time screwing over property owners.

One idea I have is that if you aren't a tax-paying property owner, but are sending kids to a JC public school, there should be some sort of additional fee/tax imposed in order to lessen the tax burden on property owners.

I would be interested to see of all of those who voted YES in Tuesdays School tax levy, how many are renters versus property owners. I have a hunch based on all the property tax increases lately, property owners probably said NO.

FG


Oh, I think this is a little hysterical, no? What's the incentive for renters to "just vote YES all the time"? I'm not arguing that many renters don't vote, but I would argue that those who do are likely to be as informed as the homeowners and hopefully would vote accordingly. I don't think the renters are out to "screw" the homeowners.

Posted on: 2010/4/23 15:06
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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Robustus wrote:
Yes, renters pay property tax due to increased rent. But I think by-and-large, most renters don't really "feel" the tax because it's not a separate bill. Humans are irrational that way. I'm a renter, btw. I haven't registered to vote here, primarily because I only intend to be here for two years, max. I'm sure there are lots of renters like me.
And if I *did* vote here, I'd be incentivized to vote for short-term benefit over long-term prosperity.

Go vote where you last registered, or does it have to coinside with your primary or current residential address ? What about when you vote for president you should be able to vote somewhere for president of the U.S.

Posted on: 2010/4/23 15:03
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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What about absentee landlord buildings ?? Now you have only tenants living in the building with X amount of apartments. What if the building owner owns multiple buildings, he can't live in everyone of them or maybe none. A; should owners vote in the voting district as many times as the amount of houses or condos they own in it, and B; should an owner be able to vote in an election even though he or she does not live in the voting district they own a house in ? You can have only one primary residence and so you can't have it both ways.

Posted on: 2010/4/23 14:56
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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Yes, renters pay property tax due to increased rent. But I think by-and-large, most renters don't really "feel" the tax because it's not a separate bill. Humans are irrational that way.

I'm a renter, btw. I haven't registered to vote here, primarily because I only intend to be here for two years, max. I'm sure there are lots of renters like me.

And if I *did* vote here, I'd be incentivized to vote for short-term benefit over long-term prosperity.

Posted on: 2010/4/23 14:17
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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This is the dumbest thread ever. Renters pay property tax through their rent. And your property tax is tax deductible, which gives you a big breakd when you file your taxes at the end of the year.

I didn't get a chance to vote for the school board election. The timing didn't work for me, if polls were opened in the morning I would have voted. And guess what? I would have voted NO, so your theory is blown. The reason why so many people voted YES here is because JC is a pretty liberal town, and god forbid we ask state employees to make sacrifices. And yes, I have to admit, if I owned and if my children went to the public school I probably would have made a bigger effort to vote here.

Posted on: 2010/4/23 12:38
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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Any renter with a brain realizes that the property that they live in pays property tax and that this will be passed on to them. Do you realize this?

Furthermore, renters (at least downtown) are much less likely to have kids and therefore are subsidizing schools that matter more to homeowners (even if they don't have kids; they impact property values). Given this, why would a renter without kids be more likely to vote for the bloated JC school budget of $600M?

Perhaps "bitter owner" is a newly appropriate meme.

Quote:

FGJCNJ1970 wrote:
What sort of bothers me is that while Renters who live in Jersey City can vote in Jersey City, they can also directly vote for all sorts of spending measures like the 100+million tax levy for schools this past Tuesday. Yet, renters don't have to pay for that tax levy and that bothers me as a homeowner.

So renter's will just vote YES all the time screwing over property owners.

One idea I have is that if you aren't a tax-paying property owner, but are sending kids to a JC public school, there should be some sort of additional fee/tax imposed in order to lessen the tax burden on property owners.

I would be interested to see of all of those who voted YES in Tuesdays School tax levy, how many are renters versus property owners. I have a hunch based on all the property tax increases lately, property owners probably said NO.

FG

Posted on: 2010/4/23 2:23
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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ianmac47 wrote:
Let's simplify things and just make property ownership a qualification for voter registration. And literacy. And caucasian ancestry. And a penis.




Ahhhhh........the good old days....................sigh

Posted on: 2010/4/23 0:21
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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hero69 wrote:
The financial burden s borne by the homeowners and not the renters so they don't directly feel the impact of their decisions...


sour grapes. Property owners benefit in so many ways, but now that home values are tanking and property taxes are going up (or is it property taxes are going up and home values are tanking?) we want a home owner bail out?

Sorry, but it's a double-edged sword folks. When times were good, renters bore the angst of not being able to increase their net worth effortlessly. Now the shoe is on the other foot. Renters are winning in today's climate and property owners are losing.

Things will turn around sooner or later (probably later), but in the meantime, let's not go changing the rules willy nilly, umm-K?

Posted on: 2010/4/22 23:21
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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By that theory, we should tax only car-owners for paved roads. There is such a thing as a general good, which includes educated children.

Posted on: 2010/4/22 22:55
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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i'm sure renter's would go for a tax if you also allow their rent to be tax deductible.

why not also an extra tax on families with children, they are the ones who will benefit the most from the education system.

Posted on: 2010/4/22 20:22
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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FGJCNJ1970 you articulated my point. The financial burden s borne by the homeowners and not the renters so they don't directly feel the impact of their decisions...and not even mention those in rent-stabilized or rent-controlled units - these renters live in an alternate universe.

I found it odd that JC and Hoboken approved the increase in school budgets (which even I voted for) while so many other communities rejected them.

Posted on: 2010/4/22 20:03
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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Just a few points... renters do indirectly chip in for property taxes through their rent. If taxes increase, the landlord is usually forced to increase rent due to their increasing expenses.

Also, many renters in JC do not register to vote in JC, especially if they do not plan on staying for more than a year or so. I'd be interested to see what the percentages are!

Posted on: 2010/4/22 19:19
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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Let's simplify things and just make property ownership a qualification for voter registration. And literacy. And caucasian ancestry. And a penis.

Posted on: 2010/4/22 18:42
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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What sort of bothers me is that while Renters who live in Jersey City can vote in Jersey City, they can also directly vote for all sorts of spending measures like the 100+million tax levy for schools this past Tuesday. Yet, renters don't have to pay for that tax levy and that bothers me as a homeowner.

So renter's will just vote YES all the time screwing over property owners.

One idea I have is that if you aren't a tax-paying property owner, but are sending kids to a JC public school, there should be some sort of additional fee/tax imposed in order to lessen the tax burden on property owners.

I would be interested to see of all of those who voted YES in Tuesdays School tax levy, how many are renters versus property owners. I have a hunch based on all the property tax increases lately, property owners probably said NO.

FG

Posted on: 2010/4/22 18:30
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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hero69 wrote:
It seems that there are too many renters in JC who don't bear the costs of abatements and wasteful government spending....so they are apathetic. But if they had to pay taxes directly, then many of these renters would demand better government.

They already get the chance to vote, but it is the homeowner that is responsible for the property not the renter. Are you saying the renter should pay a tax just like hotel guests ? And the state of New Jersey wants college students to pay to the cities they go to school in, the City of Jersey City voted to not participate in the college student tax levy although if the state passes the bill then all are included. Also what type of sales tax is to be collected and how do you distinguish the renters in the equation?

Posted on: 2010/4/22 17:10
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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So, lets get the land lords / land owners to not pay the property taxes, drop the already inflated price of rent for the renters and have them pay taxes directly back to the city instead.

Posted on: 2010/4/22 17:09
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Re: Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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aren't renters effectively paying for the taxes thru rent?

If taxes go up, landlords raise rents. Landlords aren't looking to lose money.

I do agree that it makes for political apathy given the short stays from most renters...

Posted on: 2010/4/22 17:09
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Maybe there should be sales or renter's tax in JC
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It seems that there are too many renters in JC who don't bear the costs of abatements and wasteful government spending....so they are apathetic. But if they had to pay taxes directly, then many of these renters would demand better government.

Posted on: 2010/4/22 16:52
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