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Re: New Tax Rate is Insane!
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ASI hasn’t updated the Excel sheet in 11 days. When can we expect the rest of downtown to fill in, and has anyone received assessment letters before their property has appeared on the spreadsheet?

Posted on: 3/6 7:07
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Florio, Kenney and Raval-can we assume 'Florio' is Jim 'fillm flam' Florio, who is also a partner behind the group developing Canal Crossing in Greenville/BeLa?

Posted on: 3/5 10:55
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bodhipooh wrote:
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Strawhat wrote:
I love seeing the people on NextDoor who call it a "Middle Class Gentrification".
Natives like myself have been speaking of the gentrification of Jersey City for a decade now. Many poor Jersey City families have had to move out because they could not afford it anymore. Most were POC but poor is poor and knows no racial boundaries. My family was originally from DT, and now most don't even live in JC anymore. Anytime I raised these concerns online or in a group setting, I was always told variations of "oh well, the city is more safe now and theres more places to eat so the gentrification was a good thing". Twitter (usually on Fulops tweets), NextDoor, Reddit it was always the same story. Now that the bill has come for those who benefited, we're seeing protests and media coverage. People in this thread and other places have been making the argument that "Old lady Sally has lived here her whole life, why should she have to sell her house". I made similar arguments for years. But in my case "Old Lady Sally" was "My Puerto Rican Aunt", and my argument fell on deaf ears.

Because of this, I'm finding it very hard to feel sympathy for the DT owners. The NIMBYS of DT have demanded so much from their politicians. Bike lanes, revamped parks, additional policing, festival after festival, road work. It has always seemed like a major portion of the city's expenditures have been centered Downtown. And the rest of the city has footed the bill. Not anymore.


I think it is simplistic, and not at all helpful, to try and cast this situation as a matter of race, or to pit competing narratives of a "puerto rican aunt" versus "old lady Sally". Sticking to the facts is simple enough, and tells anyone willing to listen the plain truth: the reval is a matter of fairness. Poorer areas of JC have subsidized DTJC by paying higher effective rates for well over a decade, when the law stipulates that every homeowner should pay the same effective rate.

Also, it is disingenuous to try and cast gentrification as a whites-only "attack" on a "native" population. Cities continually evolve, and surely anyone would agree that the JC newcomers are not a monolith mass of white people. To claim that is silly, and a distraction to this conversation. Heck, if anything, you could claim that a large amount of the JC newcomers of the past decade are non-white: Indians, Chinese, blacks, hispanics, etc. Anyone claiming otherwise is blind to obvious facts.


Sorry for the late response, I was on vacation last week.
Nowhere in my post did i label it a white attack on anything. Did not even use the word white. My first sentence labeled gentrification as I intended: by class. I highlighted race to point out that many POOR poc were some of the first victims, but as I said in the same sentence, poor is poor and knows no racial boundaries. You attributed a lot more of your own thinking to my post than was necessary.

I do take issue with your last statement. Those were not "obvious facts" about anything. First, nowhere did I make any claim about a monolith of new white people. Not even something close to that claim. Again, adding your own words and calling them mine. And it has always seemed to me and people i talk to that the majority of new people have been White and Chinese, with a smaller subset being Indian. Black and Hispanics have not made up a large subset of newcomers. I really don't know how you came to that conclusion, nor how you can say that is an obvious fact. I mean none of this are facts, we're basing it on what we see.

Posted on: 3/5 10:41
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As reval heats up, Jersey City finds new attorneys to handle tax appeals

As Jersey City struggles to deal with anger over the incoming results of the property revaluation, the city has dropped the outside attorney who has handled tax appeals for the city for four years.

Since October 2013, Matthew O'Donnell, of Morristown firm O'Donnell McCord, has represented the city in front of the Hudson County Board of Taxation when property owners seek new assessments. It has been a lucrative gig for his firm, which made $260,720 in 2015 alone, city records show.

The council last night approved contracts with two firms that will replace O'Donnell: Eric M. Bernstein & Associates, of Warren, and Florio Kenny Raval, of Hoboken, each for $75,000.

http://www.nj.com/hudson/index.ssf/20 ... al_attorney_as_reval.html


Posted on: 3/5 5:50
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We need transparency...


TRANSPARENCY is what has been missing for decades. The property card is confusing as hell. It should show the implied current value, 15% appeal value, hi-level budget breakdown, and links to additional resources.

The online card should have a simple online click to appeal button that at the very least walks you through the forms needed and steps to take....


Posted on: 2/28 14:12
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I don't intend to speak for all "liberals" (I prefer "progressive"), but the problem you point to can be looked at two ways, Brewster. There are places that are solidly Democratic that have high taxes and people don't really complain all that much. Those are places where people actually get good services and infrastructure for their money. I'd be happy to continue paying what I'm paying if we had the type of schools, government services, public safety and infrastructure you'd expect for the money. So - yes, by all means, let's root out waste and corruption. Let's also get rid of incompetence wherever possible. But let's also set the bar higher - Jersey City has a long way to go in the improvement department before we start looking to cut back.


I don't see a disagreement here. We want to get what we pay for, and only pay for what we get. (As a city, I'm not supporting the "I don't have kids so why should I pay for schools" crowd)

We need transparency. Why is the cashflow of the Parking Authority not in the budget? That's just one simple example. Trained forensic accountants get baffled by the crap here.

Posted on: 2/28 12:34
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It was in BeLa.

Posted on: 2/28 12:18
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there is a certain irony in witnessing the complete about-face from so many DTJC homeowners now clamoring for fiscal restraint, smaller government, and lower taxes.


Irony, but also hope. Being liberal doesn't necessarily mean you are required to be braindead and roll over for corrupt, bloated government as long as it's Democrat. It would be amazing if an outcome of all this is a surge of citizen oversight of where our money actually goes. It's hard to even find out! The maze of agencies and authorities are literally designed to prevent auditing.


I don't intend to speak for all "liberals" (I prefer "progressive"), but the problem you point to can be looked at two ways, Brewster. There are places that are solidly Democratic that have high taxes and people don't really complain all that much. Those are places where people actually get good services and infrastructure for their money. I'd be happy to continue paying what I'm paying if we had the type of schools, government services, public safety and infrastructure you'd expect for the money. So - yes, by all means, let's root out waste and corruption. Let's also get rid of incompetence wherever possible. But let's also set the bar higher - Jersey City has a long way to go in the improvement department before we start looking to cut back.

Posted on: 2/28 12:17
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Simple solution.
Sell your million dollar house Downtown and buy in Greenville.



Isn't that the place where steve originally lost the bidding war for his home here? Must be a hot market LOL. I would love to see the documentation on that whole debacle. #promisebroken

Posted on: 2/28 8:56
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Simple solution.
Sell your million dollar house Downtown and buy in Greenville.


Posted on: 2/28 7:58
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bodhipooh wrote:
there is a certain irony in witnessing the complete about-face from so many DTJC homeowners now clamoring for fiscal restraint, smaller government, and lower taxes.


Irony, but also hope. Being liberal doesn't necessarily mean you are required to be braindead and roll over for corrupt, bloated government as long as it's Democrat. It would be amazing if an outcome of all this is a surge of citizen oversight of where our money actually goes. It's hard to even find out! The maze of agencies and authorities are literally designed to prevent auditing.

I have no trouble believing upwards of 20% of our workforce is unnecessary. Did you read the Times article on the 2nd ave subway where they found that 200 of 900 workers making $1000/day had no job descriptions and were immediately laid off? No one could even tell how long they'd been there. Is it hard to speculate JC & Hudson County has similar? How did ex Councilman Steve Lipski go from drunkenly pissing on Dead fans to Vice Principal at a County High School?

Posted on: 2/27 18:38
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Strawhat wrote:
I love seeing the people on NextDoor who call it a "Middle Class Gentrification".
Natives like myself have been speaking of the gentrification of Jersey City for a decade now. Many poor Jersey City families have had to move out because they could not afford it anymore. Most were POC but poor is poor and knows no racial boundaries. My family was originally from DT, and now most don't even live in JC anymore. Anytime I raised these concerns online or in a group setting, I was always told variations of "oh well, the city is more safe now and theres more places to eat so the gentrification was a good thing". Twitter (usually on Fulops tweets), NextDoor, Reddit it was always the same story. Now that the bill has come for those who benefited, we're seeing protests and media coverage. People in this thread and other places have been making the argument that "Old lady Sally has lived here her whole life, why should she have to sell her house". I made similar arguments for years. But in my case "Old Lady Sally" was "My Puerto Rican Aunt", and my argument fell on deaf ears.

Because of this, I'm finding it very hard to feel sympathy for the DT owners. The NIMBYS of DT have demanded so much from their politicians. Bike lanes, revamped parks, additional policing, festival after festival, road work. It has always seemed like a major portion of the city's expenditures have been centered Downtown. And the rest of the city has footed the bill. Not anymore.


I think it is simplistic, and not at all helpful, to try and cast this situation as a matter of race, or to pit competing narratives of a "puerto rican aunt" versus "old lady Sally". Sticking to the facts is simple enough, and tells anyone willing to listen the plain truth: the reval is a matter of fairness. Poorer areas of JC have subsidized DTJC by paying higher effective rates for well over a decade, when the law stipulates that every homeowner should pay the same effective rate.

Also, it is disingenuous to try and cast gentrification as a whites-only "attack" on a "native" population. Cities continually evolve, and surely anyone would agree that the JC newcomers are not a monolith mass of white people. To claim that is silly, and a distraction to this conversation. Heck, if anything, you could claim that a large amount of the JC newcomers of the past decade are non-white: Indians, Chinese, blacks, hispanics, etc. Anyone claiming otherwise is blind to obvious facts.


I generally agree with your sentiment, but must highlight the irony that you've already made it a point several times in this thread to say "the liberals" this and "the liberals" that. It adds nothing of value to the conversation.


True, and I pointed out that myself in my previous post.

But the facts clearly borne out that DTJC is an overwhelmingly liberal, Democratic-voting population. And, more often than not, you are much more likely to come across that type of person advocating for more services. So, there is a certain irony in witnessing the complete about-face from so many DTJC homeowners now clamoring for fiscal restraint, smaller government, and lower taxes.

Posted on: 2/27 17:43
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Strawhat wrote:
I love seeing the people on NextDoor who call it a "Middle Class Gentrification".
Natives like myself have been speaking of the gentrification of Jersey City for a decade now. Many poor Jersey City families have had to move out because they could not afford it anymore. Most were POC but poor is poor and knows no racial boundaries. My family was originally from DT, and now most don't even live in JC anymore. Anytime I raised these concerns online or in a group setting, I was always told variations of "oh well, the city is more safe now and theres more places to eat so the gentrification was a good thing". Twitter (usually on Fulops tweets), NextDoor, Reddit it was always the same story. Now that the bill has come for those who benefited, we're seeing protests and media coverage. People in this thread and other places have been making the argument that "Old lady Sally has lived here her whole life, why should she have to sell her house". I made similar arguments for years. But in my case "Old Lady Sally" was "My Puerto Rican Aunt", and my argument fell on deaf ears.

Because of this, I'm finding it very hard to feel sympathy for the DT owners. The NIMBYS of DT have demanded so much from their politicians. Bike lanes, revamped parks, additional policing, festival after festival, road work. It has always seemed like a major portion of the city's expenditures have been centered Downtown. And the rest of the city has footed the bill. Not anymore.


Amen

Posted on: 2/27 12:54
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bodhipooh wrote:
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Strawhat wrote:
I love seeing the people on NextDoor who call it a "Middle Class Gentrification".
Natives like myself have been speaking of the gentrification of Jersey City for a decade now. Many poor Jersey City families have had to move out because they could not afford it anymore. Most were POC but poor is poor and knows no racial boundaries. My family was originally from DT, and now most don't even live in JC anymore. Anytime I raised these concerns online or in a group setting, I was always told variations of "oh well, the city is more safe now and theres more places to eat so the gentrification was a good thing". Twitter (usually on Fulops tweets), NextDoor, Reddit it was always the same story. Now that the bill has come for those who benefited, we're seeing protests and media coverage. People in this thread and other places have been making the argument that "Old lady Sally has lived here her whole life, why should she have to sell her house". I made similar arguments for years. But in my case "Old Lady Sally" was "My Puerto Rican Aunt", and my argument fell on deaf ears.

Because of this, I'm finding it very hard to feel sympathy for the DT owners. The NIMBYS of DT have demanded so much from their politicians. Bike lanes, revamped parks, additional policing, festival after festival, road work. It has always seemed like a major portion of the city's expenditures have been centered Downtown. And the rest of the city has footed the bill. Not anymore.


I think it is simplistic, and not at all helpful, to try and cast this situation as a matter of race, or to pit competing narratives of a "puerto rican aunt" versus "old lady Sally". Sticking to the facts is simple enough, and tells anyone willing to listen the plain truth: the reval is a matter of fairness. Poorer areas of JC have subsidized DTJC by paying higher effective rates for well over a decade, when the law stipulates that every homeowner should pay the same effective rate.

Also, it is disingenuous to try and cast gentrification as a whites-only "attack" on a "native" population. Cities continually evolve, and surely anyone would agree that the JC newcomers are not a monolith mass of white people. To claim that is silly, and a distraction to this conversation. Heck, if anything, you could claim that a large amount of the JC newcomers of the past decade are non-white: Indians, Chinese, blacks, hispanics, etc. Anyone claiming otherwise is blind to obvious facts.


I generally agree with your sentiment, but must highlight the irony that you've already made it a point several times in this thread to say "the liberals" this and "the liberals" that. It adds nothing of value to the conversation.

Posted on: 2/27 12:31
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I love seeing the people on NextDoor who call it a "Middle Class Gentrification".
Natives like myself have been speaking of the gentrification of Jersey City for a decade now. Many poor Jersey City families have had to move out because they could not afford it anymore. Most were POC but poor is poor and knows no racial boundaries. My family was originally from DT, and now most don't even live in JC anymore. Anytime I raised these concerns online or in a group setting, I was always told variations of "oh well, the city is more safe now and theres more places to eat so the gentrification was a good thing". Twitter (usually on Fulops tweets), NextDoor, Reddit it was always the same story. Now that the bill has come for those who benefited, we're seeing protests and media coverage. People in this thread and other places have been making the argument that "Old lady Sally has lived here her whole life, why should she have to sell her house". I made similar arguments for years. But in my case "Old Lady Sally" was "My Puerto Rican Aunt", and my argument fell on deaf ears.

Because of this, I'm finding it very hard to feel sympathy for the DT owners. The NIMBYS of DT have demanded so much from their politicians. Bike lanes, revamped parks, additional policing, festival after festival, road work. It has always seemed like a major portion of the city's expenditures have been centered Downtown. And the rest of the city has footed the bill. Not anymore.


I think it is simplistic, and not at all helpful, to try and cast this situation as a matter of race, or to pit competing narratives of a "puerto rican aunt" versus "old lady Sally". Sticking to the facts is simple enough, and tells anyone willing to listen the plain truth: the reval is a matter of fairness. Poorer areas of JC have subsidized DTJC by paying higher effective rates for well over a decade, when the law stipulates that every homeowner should pay the same effective rate.

Also, it is disingenuous to try and cast gentrification as a whites-only "attack" on a "native" population. Cities continually evolve, and surely anyone would agree that the JC newcomers are not a monolith mass of white people. To claim that is silly, and a distraction to this conversation. Heck, if anything, you could claim that a large amount of the JC newcomers of the past decade are non-white: Indians, Chinese, blacks, hispanics, etc. Anyone claiming otherwise is blind to obvious facts.

Posted on: 2/27 12:13
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I love seeing the people on NextDoor who call it a "Middle Class Gentrification".
Natives like myself have been speaking of the gentrification of Jersey City for a decade now. Many poor Jersey City families have had to move out because they could not afford it anymore. Most were POC but poor is poor and knows no racial boundaries. My family was originally from DT, and now most don't even live in JC anymore. Anytime I raised these concerns online or in a group setting, I was always told variations of "oh well, the city is more safe now and theres more places to eat so the gentrification was a good thing". Twitter (usually on Fulops tweets), NextDoor, Reddit it was always the same story. Now that the bill has come for those who benefited, we're seeing protests and media coverage. People in this thread and other places have been making the argument that "Old lady Sally has lived here her whole life, why should she have to sell her house". I made similar arguments for years. But in my case "Old Lady Sally" was "My Puerto Rican Aunt", and my argument fell on deaf ears.

Because of this, I'm finding it very hard to feel sympathy for the DT owners. The NIMBYS of DT have demanded so much from their politicians. Bike lanes, revamped parks, additional policing, festival after festival, road work. It has always seemed like a major portion of the city's expenditures have been centered Downtown. And the rest of the city has footed the bill. Not anymore.


agreed 100%.

Posted on: 2/27 11:17
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The former homeowners were paying 2018 level taxes for the last 30 years. WTF


Are you sure it wasn't reassessed at some point?


That is certainly a possibility, but I'm not sure. I do know that my neighbors on both sides were paying very high taxes, as both of theirs went down. One neighbor did a gut renovation prior to her inspection, and her taxes still went down.

Posted on: 2/27 11:12
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I love seeing the people on NextDoor who call it a "Middle Class Gentrification".
Natives like myself have been speaking of the gentrification of Jersey City for a decade now. Many poor Jersey City families have had to move out because they could not afford it anymore. Most were POC but poor is poor and knows no racial boundaries. My family was originally from DT, and now most don't even live in JC anymore. Anytime I raised these concerns online or in a group setting, I was always told variations of "oh well, the city is more safe now and theres more places to eat so the gentrification was a good thing". Twitter (usually on Fulops tweets), NextDoor, Reddit it was always the same story. Now that the bill has come for those who benefited, we're seeing protests and media coverage. People in this thread and other places have been making the argument that "Old lady Sally has lived here her whole life, why should she have to sell her house". I made similar arguments for years. But in my case "Old Lady Sally" was "My Puerto Rican Aunt", and my argument fell on deaf ears.

Because of this, I'm finding it very hard to feel sympathy for the DT owners. The NIMBYS of DT have demanded so much from their politicians. Bike lanes, revamped parks, additional policing, festival after festival, road work. It has always seemed like a major portion of the city's expenditures have been centered Downtown. And the rest of the city has footed the bill. Not anymore.

Posted on: 2/27 11:07
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The former homeowners were paying 2018 level taxes for the last 30 years. WTF


Are you sure it wasn't reassessed at some point?

Posted on: 2/27 10:45
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Got my letter in the mail yesterday. I'm over by Lincoln Park. I was not surprised to see my taxes go up (only $200 for the year), but the surprising part was the small increase over the previous assessed value. The $200 per year increase also came with a +$400k increase in the assessed value. The former homeowners were paying 2018 level taxes for the last 30 years. WTF

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...People hoping for some relief in a second reval should be very wary.


You make a good point - with all the new building going on - the western area of Downtown, Journal Square and some of the Heights might all see higher taxes in a second Reval.

Posted on: 2/27 9:47
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Wasn't ASI supposed to be done notifying homeowners of their new assessed values by 2/19? My entire block still isn't in the spreadsheet (last updated on Friday 2/23), and I haven't gotten my letter yet.

Posted on: 2/27 9:45
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I also do wonder if all those DTJC homeowners getting excited (and, feeling hopeful for a reprieve) after Fulop announced his intentions to hold a second reval even realize that such an undertaking could actually backfire and yield even higher taxes for them. If things play out as some think, and the tax increases do nothing to home valuations due to the pent up demand and limited inventory, you could very well end up seeing a relative uptick in DTJC values. After all, the same factors that can impact valuation due to the new 2018 tax plan will apply to all real estate across the region. All things being equal, DTJC will continue to attract more newcomers, so even if values were impacted negatively in DTJC, the same will likely be true of other areas in town.

People hoping for some relief in a second reval should be very wary.

Posted on: 2/27 9:33
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But bodhi, the ratables!!!! Hahahaha

Posted on: 2/27 9:04
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Your tax bill went up? Well cry me a river. Life ain't fare. No one cares.


Yes, except the reval is actually the epitome of fairness. They're upset that everything is fair now lol.


100% agreed.

I have said it before, there is some real irony in seeing so many unabashed liberals previously demanding more and bigger government, suddenly clamoring for fiscal restraint and smaller government when it finally came to them having to foot the bill.

While that may seem like a cheap political potshot, the truth is that most of these DTJC homeowners complaining about their tax increase got away with underpaying for a LONG time. A lot of them were simply in denial about what was coming, even when told directly to their faces. A quick search through this site would yield oodles of threads about what the reval would mean for DTJC, and claiming ignorance now is simply disingenuous. Even if you didn't participate in those threads, or this forum, you could have easily determined what to expect from the reval by doing a tiny amount of research.

Posted on: 2/27 8:12
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Your tax bill went up? Well cry me a river. Life ain't fare. No one cares.


Yes, except the reval is actually the epitome of fairness. They're upset that everything is fair now lol.

Posted on: 2/27 7:56
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When it comes to Yvonne, I think The Simpsons said it best




Posted on: 2/27 7:39
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Re: New Tax Rate is Insane!
Home away from home
Home away from home


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I hereby sentence you to seven more years of MAGA for that comment!

Posted on: 2/27 5:08
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Re: New Tax Rate is Insane!
Home away from home
Home away from home


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From somewhere else
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Quote:

JadedJC wrote:

And there's a special place for those who lie repeatedly.


Yeah. The White House.

Posted on: 2/27 0:33
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Re: New Tax Rate is Insane!
Just can't stay away
Just can't stay away


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From Heights
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In reading this thread all I see is a lot of energy being spent arguing for/against something that isn't going to change.

Your tax bill went up? Well cry me a river. Life ain't fare. No one cares. Deal with it.

How's the saying go?? Nothing in life is guaranteed except death and taxes. Just be glad you're dealing with the latter and not the former.

Posted on: 2/27 0:09
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