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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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[quote]Because President McCain would have been SOOO much better and totally gotten rid of that pesky spying? You've got to take the good (Kagan, Sotomayor, Healthcare) and balance it against the bad. There's nothing wrong with not supporting everything someone does, we're not AIPAC! I already disagree vehemently with an action of Mayor Fulop's, but I don't regret voting for him. The bar to be better than Healy is insanely low.[/quote


Careful Brewster Aipac, ADL might consider you an anti-semite.....or if your a member of the tribe....a self-hating jew.

Posted on: 2013/7/16 1:24
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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and what history is that...

Posted on: 2013/7/15 19:31
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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considering the history between fulop and donnelly, perhaps fulop follows the old maxim: keep your friends close, but keep your enemies closer?

Posted on: 2013/7/10 1:01
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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rescuelife wrote:
Fletcher Gensamer is simply going to be anti-Fulop/Candice for the next 4 years NO MATTER WHAT.

Enlighten us Fletch, why is Donnelly not suitable for this role? Do you think he is incompetent in terms of large project management? What if he ends up managing these huge projects extremely well?

We all know you are posturing for your next attempt at office. Forget Ward E, I think you should run for Mayor in 2017!


How is he suitable and qualified for this role? Better yet, why is this role needed in the first place? Fulop chose him, so the burden of proof is on him.

Even if Fletch is a hater, it doesn't automatically prove that Donnelly is the person for this role or that this role should exist.

Posted on: 2013/7/9 22:36
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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brewster wrote:
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trucker wrote:
Ha, ha. You voted for Obama


...There's nothing wrong with not supporting everything someone does, we're not AIPAC! I already disagree vehemently with an action of Mayor Fulop's, but I don't regret voting for him. The bar to be better than Healy is insanely low.

+10

Posted on: 2013/7/9 22:02
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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Fletcher Gensamer is simply going to be anti-Fulop/Candice for the next 4 years NO MATTER WHAT.

Enlighten us Fletch, why is Donnelly not suitable for this role? Do you think he is incompetent in terms of large project management? What if he ends up managing these huge projects extremely well?

We all know you are posturing for your next attempt at office. Forget Ward E, I think you should run for Mayor in 2017!

Posted on: 2013/7/9 21:34
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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trucker wrote:
Ha, ha. You voted for Obama


Because President McCain would have been SOOO much better and totally gotten rid of that pesky spying? You've got to take the good (Kagan, Sotomayor, Healthcare) and balance it against the bad. There's nothing wrong with not supporting everything someone does, we're not AIPAC! I already disagree vehemently with an action of Mayor Fulop's, but I don't regret voting for him. The bar to be better than Healy is insanely low.

Posted on: 2013/7/9 20:13
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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duh wrote:
What I find most disheartening is the dismissive nature of responses to Fletch. I didn?t vote for Fletch, and I did vote for Fulop, but I appreciate the point he has raised. Forgive this generalization, but the tone on this site has been blindly anti-Healy and pro-Fulop with little critical thought or analysis (I always thought Healy cared deeply for the city, but was too entrenched with friends and politicians he felt indebted to, which could never have done anything to uplift this poor place). There were plenty of things wrong with the Healy administration, which is why we voted him out. But it?s crazy to me that if you even suggest we scrutinize the decisions Fulop is making, you?re accused of having ?sour grapes,? told that the people being chosen are more qualified than anyone under Healy was, will do a better job, etc (as a blanket response). I know a lot of people whom had ranted and raved about Healy appointing friends and cronies, who now, after having campaigned for Fulop, are the beneficiaries of the positions they were dismayed at others holding. Perhaps these people, and their self-interest, will produce better results, but I?m concerned it will be business as usual. I guess after having voted for Obama and feeling duped, I have my guard up. I worry that like Obama, Fulop may just be a more polished version of the same variety of bad politics.


Ha, ha. You voted for Obama

Posted on: 2013/7/9 19:50
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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fulop doesn't walk on water ... and if the general expectation is that he does in fact walk on water, the disappointments will be sizeable ...

fulop is a relative political outsider ... and, unless something fundamentally changes about his political abilities, he will succeed in dealing with some of the embedded cronyism, corruption, and partonage in the city ... as well as the crime, quality of living, and development problems

will he be successful? i certainly hope that he will succeed with - parts of - his agenda ... i expect this city be better off in 4 years due to his leadership ... but, how much better off the city will be, i cannot tell ...

Posted on: 2013/7/9 17:01
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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As someone who lives in the "Land of Donnelly" - can't say that I'm happy about this appointment. Definitely a Fulop supporter, but as a Ward B resident (so I know whereof I speak!!) this is very disappointing. It smells of patronage to me.

Posted on: 2013/7/9 16:51
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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What I find most disheartening is the dismissive nature of responses to Fletch.


The reason for the dismissive tone to anything Feltch writes is that he has never written anything supportive. It is always bitching (you need look no further than the title of this thread). Mayor Fulop has been in office less than two weeks and it is bitch bitch bitch.

When and if he ever writes anything positive or does anything positive for the city (other than garnering more votes than that loser Malik), then we might take something other than a deserved dismissive tone.



Posted on: 2013/7/9 16:33
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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duh wrote:
What I find most disheartening is the dismissive nature of responses to Fletch. I didn?t vote for Fletch, and I did vote for Fulop, but I appreciate the point he has raised. Forgive this generalization, but the tone on this site has been blindly anti-Healy and pro-Fulop with little critical thought or analysis (I always thought Healy cared deeply for the city, but was too entrenched with friends and politicians he felt indebted to, which could never have done anything to uplift this poor place). There were plenty of things wrong with the Healy administration, which is why we voted him out. But it?s crazy to me that if you even suggest we scrutinize the decisions Fulop is making, you?re accused of having ?sour grapes,? told that the people being chosen are more qualified than anyone under Healy was, will do a better job, etc (as a blanket response). I know a lot of people whom had ranted and raved about Healy appointing friends and cronies, who now, after having campaigned for Fulop, are the beneficiaries of the positions they were dismayed at others holding. Perhaps these people, and their self-interest, will produce better results, but I?m concerned it will be business as usual. I guess after having voted for Obama and feeling duped, I have my guard up. I worry that like Obama, Fulop may just be a more polished version of the same variety of bad politics.


THIS THIS THIS!

I thought Fulop was a better option than Healy too, but it's in our best interest to have healthy skepticism of our politicians' actions - especially when they appear sketchy.

If Fulop wants to eliminate the confusion around this appointment, he can give further details on why Donnelly is the BEST person for this job.

Posted on: 2013/7/9 15:54
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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What I find most disheartening is the dismissive nature of responses to Fletch. I didn?t vote for Fletch, and I did vote for Fulop, but I appreciate the point he has raised. Forgive this generalization, but the tone on this site has been blindly anti-Healy and pro-Fulop with little critical thought or analysis (I always thought Healy cared deeply for the city, but was too entrenched with friends and politicians he felt indebted to, which could never have done anything to uplift this poor place). There were plenty of things wrong with the Healy administration, which is why we voted him out. But it?s crazy to me that if you even suggest we scrutinize the decisions Fulop is making, you?re accused of having ?sour grapes,? told that the people being chosen are more qualified than anyone under Healy was, will do a better job, etc (as a blanket response). I know a lot of people whom had ranted and raved about Healy appointing friends and cronies, who now, after having campaigned for Fulop, are the beneficiaries of the positions they were dismayed at others holding. Perhaps these people, and their self-interest, will produce better results, but I?m concerned it will be business as usual. I guess after having voted for Obama and feeling duped, I have my guard up. I worry that like Obama, Fulop may just be a more polished version of the same variety of bad politics.

Posted on: 2013/7/9 15:29
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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To me cronyism is giving your friends multiple city jobs as they pad their pensions and show up only one hour a week for work. As long as they are actually working and doing the job, I wouldn't cared if he hired Healy.

Posted on: 2013/7/9 14:32
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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bodhipooh would mte:
Ha, ha, ha!! Didn't graduate from college?! Gasp! You must be quivering. I take it you have never heard of these people:

- Steve Jobs
- Bill Gates
- Larry Ellison
- Mark Zuckerberg
- David H. Murdock
- Kirk Kerkorian
- Ralph Lauren
- Ted Turner

All obscenely rich,youibly successful Americans who dropped out, were expelled, or simply didn't attend colleg. Not saying this Strother character is in the same league as these success stories, but to highlight the lack of a college degree as an impediment to do a job doesn't say much to me. I would take an employee without a degree, but strong work ethic and high drive, over one with a college degree and not much more. Some of the smartest people I have worked with in the past are college dropouts, or guys who left after some time.


I figured someone would make that argument and mention those people. Yes, they are all successful and not college graduates. But for every one ofthem, there are 10 people or more pumping gas for a lliving or doing some other menial job and barely getting by. They just don't make for a good story so you never hear of them. They are definitely amazing but more the exception than the rule. Also not one of them ever served in government. Sure, a college education isn't the answer to everything and doesn't guarantee anything. But I think in a city of JC's size, people in high level appointed positions should be college educated. I believe a previous police chief in NYC never went to college- Bernard Keric (sp.?) or something - look how that turned out. He clearly was not a good leader nor could make the right decisions. While college graduates can screw up too, I think they are in a better position to lead by example and make more informed decisions.

Posted on: 2013/7/9 12:56
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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bodhipooh wrote:
Ha, ha, ha!! Didn't graduate from college?! Gasp! You must be quivering. I take it you have never heard of these people:

- Steve Jobs
- Bill Gates
- Larry Ellison
- Mark Zuckerberg
- David H. Murdock
- Kirk Kerkorian
- Ralph Lauren
- Ted Turner

All obscenely rich, incredibly successful Americans who dropped out, were expelled, or simply didn't attend college. Not saying this Strother character is in the same league as these success stories, but to highlight the lack of a college degree as an impediment to do a job doesn't say much to me. I would take an employee without a degree, but strong work ethic and high drive, over one with a college degree and not much more. Some of the smartest people I have worked with in the past are college dropouts, or guys who left after some time.


Those are great names, but they are no Chico.

Posted on: 2013/7/9 12:22
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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Ha, ha, ha!! Didn't graduate from college?! Gasp! You must be quivering. I take it you have never heard of these people:

- Steve Jobs
- Bill Gates
- Larry Ellison
- Mark Zuckerberg
- David H. Murdock
- Kirk Kerkorian
- Ralph Lauren
- Ted Turner

All obscenely rich, incredibly successful Americans who dropped out, were expelled, or simply didn't attend college. Not saying this Strother character is in the same league as these success stories, but to highlight the lack of a college degree as an impediment to do a job doesn't say much to me. I would take an employee without a degree, but strong work ethic and high drive, over one with a college degree and not much more. Some of the smartest people I have worked with in the past are college dropouts, or guys who left after some time.

Posted on: 2013/7/9 12:09
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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caj11 wrote:
...nt to the Department of Recreation, Ryan Strother. If I heard correctly, he is not a college graduate and has little management experience, as I believe was working some run-of-the-mill factory job just a few years ago. I...


I don't know what Strother was doing a few years ago, but he's been managing real estate (residential and commercial) at the MLK hub for the past several years. He's got management experience.

As for a college education, that's a tricky one. There's the kind of college experience that's mostly marking time since high school while you crack a keg every weekend. That'll get you a credential you can stick on your resume and a network of drinking buddies. That's one thing.

And then there's the college education that gets you real knowledge, teaches you to think critically, gives you a deeper sense of your place in the world, gives you some sophisticated job skills (say in data analysis or city planning), and teaches you how to learn so you can bootstrap your way to deeper knowledge in any situation. And maybe you only crack a keg once every few weeks and, while you have drinking buddies, you also have buddies you picked up while volunteering in an after-school tutoring program.

So Strother doesn't have either of those college educations. Question is: has he learned how to learn all on his own? Has he been bootstrapping for the last decade? If so. then take that and his management experience and maybe he'll do OK managing recreation.


Posted on: 2013/7/9 9:54
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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I gotta chime in here - while I am still happy about Fulop's victory and definitely regard him as a huge improvement over Healy, I am sorely disappointed about his appointment to the Department of Recreation, Ryan Strother. If I heard correctly, he is not a college graduate and has little management experience, as I believe was working some run-of-the-mill factory job just a few years ago. It just doesn't make sense to me.

Posted on: 2013/7/9 5:17
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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Not sour grapes and I'm over it. The election was in May and well, I didn't win. But did great with no backing, beating two mayoral candidates in Ward E, and in JC overall, one mayoral candidate and 6 other independents in total number of votes.

However, Team Fulop ran under reform, and what have we gotten so far?

Nepotism by Waterman (since withdrawn), and now $80K to a former Healy turncoat for something he is not qualified for? Seriously? That is Patronage and payback at the tax payers expense. And other Healy allies still on the payroll?

And a lot of spending already. Yet we are $21 Million over budget. Doesn't anyone care about the numbers? I do.

And Candice Osborne said Tax Hikes are coming just tonight at the Harsimus Cove Neighborhood Association Meeting.

So much for Team Fulop.

Fletch

P.S. And I will be watching because I too was once a Fulop supporter and die hard. Until I really looked at his positions during the campaign. I'm just waiting for the first tax abatement to hit for yet another downtown development that doesn't need it.


Posted on: 2013/7/9 3:48
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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From JJ comments:

Quote:
I could see why the Healy goons are seeing red over the Donnelly appointment. After all Donnelly hammered the first nail into Healy?s long over due political coffin. If you recall (no pun intended Jerry) Mayor Fulop?s first big campaign announcement in May 2012 was that Councilman Donnelly was switching sides. Going from a trusted Healy aide and Healy handpicked Councilman to a Team Fulop candidate for the May 2013 election. A big political risk. I would have loved to be a fly on the wall of Healy?s bar (or some other bar I?m sure) when Donnelly broke the news to Healy. Priceless!
.
I know it may be hard too take for some of the Mayor Fulop supporters. But I bet there are still going to be some political maneuvers under Mayor Fulop. (that?s life especially in Hudson County) My hope is that Mayor Fulop plays the game so well that he topples County Executive Tom ?do nothing? DeGise and stream lines Hudson County government. In my opinion if anyone deserves a job it is Donnelly for sticking the first banderilleros in the old bull Healy?s political hide. Olay!
.
This (among other things) was the start of his Healy?s downfall and the rise of Mayor Fulop.
.
JJ May 9, 2012: Jersey City Ward E Councilman Fulop lines up first three members of his slate for 2013 election.

http://www.nj.com/jjournal-news/index ... _ward_e_councilman_1.html
.
I feel sorry for the bull in this video, can?t say I do for loser Healy.
.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y5SCcDLJR_E
.


Posted on: 2013/7/9 3:21
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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In terms of severity of political patronage this is about as small as it gets.

Posted on: 2013/7/9 2:40
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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Lima17 wrote:
Quote:

FGJCNJ1970 wrote:
Read about David Donnelly's new Project Manager position making $80K a year to oversee implementation of a 311 system that cost the city big money that we simply cannot afford.


$80K/year you MIGHT be able to hire a junior IT project manager in JC/NYC. He's probably on the project, but I doubt he's leading it.
+1

haha ... sour grapes, fletch ... sour grapes

Posted on: 2013/7/9 1:28
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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WhoElseCouldIBe wrote:
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SteveWilson29 wrote:
Not looking forward to at least four years of Fletch's lunatic ranting.


Hmm, this comment isn't really addressing the issue of how this does look like political cronyism.


I don't remember having an obligation to address it.


That's because I didn't obligate you to do anything. My point is that this appears to be political cronyism.

Posted on: 2013/7/9 0:58
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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WhoElseCouldIBe wrote:
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SteveWilson29 wrote:
Not looking forward to at least four years of Fletch's lunatic ranting.


Hmm, this comment isn't really addressing the issue of how this does look like political cronyism.


I don't remember having an obligation to address it.

Posted on: 2013/7/9 0:50
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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FGJCNJ1970 wrote:
Read about David Donnelly's new Project Manager position making $80K a year to oversee implementation of a 311 system that cost the city big money that we simply cannot afford.


$80K/year you MIGHT be able to hire a junior IT project manager in JC/NYC. He's probably on the project, but I doubt he's leading it.

Posted on: 2013/7/9 0:46
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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SteveWilson29 wrote:
Not looking forward to at least four years of Fletch's lunatic ranting.


Hmm, this comment isn't really addressing the issue of how this does look like political cronyism.

Posted on: 2013/7/9 0:10
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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Not looking forward to at least four years of Fletch's lunatic ranting.


+1

Posted on: 2013/7/8 21:39
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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I_heart_JC wrote:
Quote:

FGJCNJ1970 wrote:
Read about David Donnelly's new Project Manager position making $80K a year to oversee implementation of a 311 system that cost the city big money that we simply cannot afford.

http://www.nj.com/hudson/index.ssf/20 ... k_as_project_manager.html

Here is the definition of Patronage from Miram Webster's dictionary:

a : the power to make appointments to government jobs especially for political advantage
b : the distribution of jobs on the basis of patronage
c : jobs distributed by patronage

and from wikipedia:

The term may refer to a type of corruption or favoritism in which a party in power rewards groups, families, ethnicities for their electoral support using illegal gifts or fraudulently awarded appointments or government contracts.

I can't believe JC is going to be keeping this HACK on the payroll. He doesn't have the IT, CRM and other technology background to implement a 311 system.

Good Grief Team Fulop.


enlighten me: what does Fulop owe Donnelly?

For not running in the first place, This looks bad on all levels.

Posted on: 2013/7/8 21:07
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Re: Political Patronage Alive and Well under Fulop Administration
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Not looking forward to at least four years of Fletch's lunatic ranting.

Posted on: 2013/7/8 20:50
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