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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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The S&P index linked is not inflation indexed according to the FAQ on the site. FAQ
So......Using the handy CPI calculator http://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl

85 in 1988 would be worth 62.05 in 1998, a 27% loss due to inflation while regaining the same price. Since this is regional data, we can assume that in JC the losses easily exceeded 30%.

Further playing with the CPI calculator shows that I remembered correctly, that in real value prices did not recover till 2001, when 130 was worth what 85 was in 1988.

Crazy_Chester, throwing around statistics is like playing with matches, they might burn you.

Posted on: 2007/12/20 2:43
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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I think I may have said this on JCList before, but at New Years eve 2000 I had a long argument with a friend who was an "financial advisor" who took the "stock are better" position. He lost his shirt that year as the tech stock bubble burst as the value of my property started to soar.

The argument always fails to take full account of the power of leverage and the benefit of shelter. Harlan Larson at the end of the article didn't buy the house for $32,500 in 1965, he likely paid 20%, $6k, and then got to live in it. The risk inherent in leverage is almost always consumed over the long term. That's why I would never advise someone to buy RE if they couldn't hold it 10 years.

Can we assume that S&P spreadsheet inflation adjusted? I had heard a while back that the high in real dollars wasn't recovered until 2001. Maybe that was more local.

El Groucho, buying rental property that covers it's nut became nearly impossible in in JC in the last few years, Downtown years before that. We bought a 3 family that did it in the Heights in 04, I don't think you can do it today. It's just one more sign of an out of balance market. I have friends who bought a 4 unit in Brooklyn in 04 with a P/E of 17. That's just nuts. We bought Downtown in 97 with a P/E of under 5.

Posted on: 2007/12/20 0:59
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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Thats why I said the rent roll should cover the monthly nut, so if you have to rent it out for whatever reason, you can still have someone pay your mortgage ( principle too) for you. At least for a couple of years until the market turns again. It will always be worth more in the long run. I dont know in my mind it doesnt seem as risky, you just might be stuck in it a little longer than you would like. It seems more like a savings account in that scenario. What I would try to do is save another 10 K to buy another place to cost average down my initial terrible investment choice.


but if youu need the money then your S.O.L.


so you have a point. and stocks definitely have a higher return. I just dont want to waste my time trading stocks, until I have a serious bankroll to make some coin. Even If I am diversified in a brokerage account , I am not going to borrow money to buy a pieces of paper . Although, I would borrow money to buy a house. Thats JMO , but I look at pictures all day long at work , I am not a financial guy at all, so dont listen to me.

Posted on: 2007/12/19 23:16
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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http://www.nytimes.com/2005/08/19/realestate/19real.html

In the Long Run, Sleep at Home and Invest in the Stock Market
by MOTOKO RICH and DAVID LEONHARDT
Published: August 19, 2005

The housing boom of the last five years has made many homeowners feel like very, very smart investors.

As the value of real estate has skyrocketed, owners have become enamored of the wealth their homes are creating, with many concluding that real estate is now a safer and better investment than stocks. It turns out, though, that the last five years - when homes in some hot markets like Manhattan and Las Vegas have outperformed stocks - has been a highly unusual period.

In fact, by a wide margin over time, stock prices have risen more quickly than home values, even on the East and West Coasts, where home values have appreciated most.

When Marti and Ray Jacobs sold the five-bedroom colonial house in Harrington Park, N.J., where they had lived since 1970, they made what looked like a typically impressive profit. They had paid $110,000 to have the house built and sold it in July for $900,000.

But the truth is that much of the gain came from simple price inflation, the same force that has made a gallon of milk more expensive today than it was three decades ago. The Jacobses also invested tens of thousands of dollars in a new master bathroom, with marble floors, a Jacuzzi bathtub and vanity cabinets.

Add it all up, and they ended up making an inflation-adjusted profit of less than 10 percent over the 35 years.

That return does not come close to the gains of the stock market over the same period. The Standard & Poor's 500-stock index has increased almost 200 percent since 1970, even after accounting for inflation.

Yet investment advisers worry that this reality is getting lost in today's enthusiasm for houses, even as some economists say the housing market has peaked. People are buying homes purely on speculation, trading real estate almost as if it were a stock. Surveys show that a large majority of Americans consider real estate to be a safer investment than stocks.

"With how strong the real estate market has performed, there is the urge for people to chase returns," said Jeff A. Weiand, executive vice president of RTD Financial Advisors in Philadelphia. "But it's very difficult to beat the long-term historical record of stocks."

Since 1980, for example, money invested in the Standard & Poor's 500 has delivered a return of 10 percent a year on average. Including dividends, the return on the S.& P. 500 rises to 12 percent a year. Even in New York and San Francisco, homes have risen in value only about 7 percent a year over the same span.

That does not mean real estate is a bad investment. It is often an important source of wealth for families. But its main benefit is what it has always been: you can live in the house you own.

"The biggest value of the house is the shelter it provides," said Thomas Z. Lys, an accounting professor at the Kellogg School of Management at Northwestern University. "Too many people are fixated on speculation whereas most of the benefit really comes from usage."

Despite the fact that home values usually appreciate over time, most of the value of a house actually comes from the ability to use it. In this way, it is more like a car, albeit one that does not become less valuable over time, than it is like a stock. Whenever people sell one house, they must immediately pay to live elsewhere, meaning that they can never wholly cash out of a home's value.

Including the value of living in a house - that is, the rent that a family would have to pay to live in an equivalent house elsewhere - homes in New York have returned more than 15 percent a year since 1980, according to an analysis by Mr. Lys.

But only five percentage points of this return comes from sheer price appreciation, as opposed to the value of shelter. Mr. Lys accounted for property taxes, spending on renovations, interest payments and the tax deductions on those payments, and the fact that most house purchases are made with mortgages.

When the sale of a house brings in a cash windfall, homeowners tend to focus on the fact that they made a down payment that was just a fraction of their house's value, lifting their return. But many forget just how much money they spent on property taxes, a new roof and the mortgage interest.

Add to all these factors the corrosive effect of inflation, and the returns are even lower.

The Jacobses - she is an administrator for a magazine and he a lawyer - were quite pleased with the sale of their house in New Jersey. To them, it was a place to raise their two children more than it was an investment.

When the couple spent about $100,000 to redo their master bathroom, install a walk-in closet and build a deck in the mid-1980's, Mr. Jacobs recalled saying to his wife, "We'll never get the money out that we put into this, but at least we'll enjoy it for 15 years or so."

Told of the comparative returns on his house and the stock market, Mr. Jacobs said, "Of course I couldn't live in the portfolio."

Today, however, he has come to see the advantages of the stock market. The Jacobses now rent an apartment on the Upper West Side for more than $4,000 a month and have invested the proceeds from the house sale in the stock market, making it easier for them to raise cash by selling shares.

"I didn't want to take the money that we pulled out of the house and have all that money tied up in an apartment where I still have expenses of maintenance fees," Mr. Jacobs said.

But many people seem to be going in the opposite direction from the Jacobses. Eighty percent of Americans deemed real estate a safer investment than stocks in an NBC News/Wall Street Journal poll done this spring, while only 13 percent said stocks were safer.

Part of that sentiment is driven by the recent memory of the stock market collapse in 2000. Many homeowners seem to have forgotten that less than 15 years ago house prices in the Northeast and California fell, but the money they lost on technology stocks is still fresh in their minds.

Stocks are also more volatile, and their price changes can be viewed every day. "The news doesn't report to you daily that your house price might have gone up or down," Mr. Lys said. "So you think your house price is more stable than it really is because you don't observe these minute-by-minute gyrations."

Economists caution that any comparison between real estate and stocks is tricky, because real estate is typically a leveraged investment, in which a home buyer makes a down payment equal to only a fraction of a house's value and borrows to finance the rest. While it is possible to borrow money from a brokerage firm to buy stocks, most individual investors simply buy the shares outright.

When home prices are rising, the leverage from a mortgage lifts real estate returns in the short term. Someone putting down $100,000 to buy a $500,000 home can feel as if the investment doubled when told that the house is now worth $600,000.

But the power of leverage vanishes as homeowners pay off the mortgage, as the Jacobses have. Leverage also creates more short-term risk, especially for those who have stretched to afford their house.

"If the home went down by 30 percent, you'd probably be sitting with a bankruptcy attorney," said Jonathan Golub, United States equity strategist at J. P. Morgan Asset Management in New York. "If your I.B.M. stock goes down by 30 percent, no big deal. So you had $100,000, now you have $70,000. You don't declare bankruptcy; you just don't go out to the movies as much, or you retire a year later."

But such risks are hard to imagine when many markets are still enjoying double-digit percentage increases every year. The number of people buying houses they do not plan to live in has surged. There are also Internet exchanges where investors can trade yet-to-be-built condominiums or futures contracts tied to average home prices in big metropolitan areas.

But economists and investment advisers say that most of the value from real estate comes not from anything that can be captured by flipping it, but from the safety net it provides in bad times. Even if the market shifts downward, "you have a roof over your head," said Jonathan Miller, a real estate appraiser in Manhattan.

Beyond the shelter it provides, the biggest advantage of real estate might be that it protects people from their worst investment instincts. Most people do not sell their house out of frustration after a few months of declining values, as they might with a stock. Instead, they are almost forced to be long-run investors who do not try to time the market.

Harlan Larson, a retired manager of car dealerships near Minneapolis, still regrets having bought Northwest Airlines stock at $25 a share a few years ago. It is now trading at less than $5.

By comparison, he views the four-bedroom home he bought for $32,500 in 1965 - or about $200,000 in today's dollars - as a money tree. He and his wife recently listed it for $413,000. That would translate into an annual return of 1.2 percent, taking into account inflation and the cost of two new decks and an extra room.

They plan to move to Texas after it has sold. "I wish I'd bought more real estate," Mr. Larson said.

Posted on: 2007/12/19 22:41
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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hero69 wrote:
does your analysis include the tax benefits of owning real estate?


Admittedly, no my analysis does not include this. Nor does it include the costs of financing (closing costs, RE Broker fees, etc.), interest on the debt to purchase the home, etc. I was simplifying the problem and only looking at capital gains and cash income (dividends). Obviously, if you had a particular property in mind, you would look at all of these factors over the estimated life of the investment and discount it back to present. If anyone can show me a chart that demonstrates RE beating the stock market with all these factors considered, over any appreciable length of time, I'd love to see it.

El G - you are right in saying that RE is the most accessible (or at least was the most accessible, until Paulson decided to "fix" the market) way for the average investor to buy into a leveraged investment. However, your commentary assumes a market that is appreciating faster than inflation. The fact that the investment is leveraged means that in a declining market, you could end up owing the bank more than the asset is worth, as we're seeing today. I'll agree, that for the average homebuyer, planning to live there for 20+ years, this is much less of a risk, but it's a riskier than equities precisely because it's leveraged, and nondiversified.

Posted on: 2007/12/19 22:33
I'd go over 12 percent for that
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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Well, it should also include the money not spent on rent (a positive), and also the money spent on other home ownership costs (a negative).

I'm not financially well-schooled enough to do this kind of comparison/analysis in depth. My gut tells me that when real estate prices continue to rise much faster than income for a prolonged period of time, something is either wrong or there are unusual, exceptional factors. Manhattan has some unusual, exceptional factors but I wouldn't call all of them inevitables or constants.

Posted on: 2007/12/19 21:36
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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JSalt wrote:
BTW check your math, that's a 14% decline, not a 4% decline.


JSalt,

I agree with general argument, though I think there's a better way to make your point. All markets go up over the long term in general, as long as there is still a positive relationship between demand and supply of whatever the market is selling. However, using the price data supplied for the NY RE market, it shows a 10.58% CAGR from sept 87 to sept 2007. Over roughly that same period of time (I couldn't line up the dates exactly) the S&P500 returned about 9.5%. This only includes prices, not dividends, so realistically, the stock market should be closer to 11-12% in TSR. Also, RE is a leveraged, nondiversifiable asset, meaning its inherent risk is higher than an indexed market fund. Over that period of time, though you might have made money in either market, you would probably have done better in stocks.

JSalt, maybe your explanation was simpler.





Although I acknowledge the fact stocks historically do better than real estate over the long term, for the average struggling middle class person like myself , real estate is still the better investment. ( only with 30 yr fixed mortgages around 7 %) This why is think so

1. you are making money on borrowed money. Although you are paying interest on the borrowed money, if it is your primary residence , you are not spending money on rent and gettiing a tax shelter in the interim.

2. If it is an investment property and if ( and only if ) the rent roll covers or comes close to covering all of your expenses, you are collecting the equity growth and paying down your mortgage at the same time. (different tax laws that you have to navigate through tho)

lets say you have 10 K to use as a down payment on a 100K property ( i know they dont exist I am just making it easy ) or 10 K to buy stocks . If you make 10% on 100K property thats = 10,000 dollars . If you take that same 10 K and make 20 % in stock investments, over the same period of time as buying and selling the house, you have only made 2,000 dollars on the 10 K.

The only variable is if you do a little homework, anyone can beat the S&P or most mutual funds. It all depends how much work you want to put into investing.

Posted on: 2007/12/19 21:34
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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does your analysis include the tax benefits of owning real estate?

Posted on: 2007/12/19 20:44
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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JSalt wrote:
BTW check your math, that's a 14% decline, not a 4% decline.


JSalt,

I agree with general argument, though I think there's a better way to make your point. All markets go up over the long term in general, as long as there is still a positive relationship between demand and supply of whatever the market is selling. However, using the price data supplied for the NY RE market, it shows a 10.58% CAGR from sept 87 to sept 2007. Over roughly that same period of time (I couldn't line up the dates exactly) the S&P500 returned about 9.5%. This only includes prices, not dividends, so realistically, the stock market should be closer to 11-12% in TSR. Also, RE is a leveraged, nondiversifiable asset, meaning its inherent risk is higher than an indexed market fund. Over that period of time, though you might have made money in either market, you would probably have done better in stocks.

JSalt, maybe your explanation was simpler.

Posted on: 2007/12/19 20:20
I'd go over 12 percent for that
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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Crazy_Chester wrote:
Yes, I know. In a 2.5 year period (not 3) within a 20 year period, you found a 4% total decline. Oh, the horror. Then prices rose slowly, but surely, until May 1988 for a 17% total increase during this period. Not a boom by any measure, but a long and steady uptrend. Thanks for supporting my point. Where is the data that shows housing values, as wibbit says, "always eventually decline"? Where is the data that would make wibbit's advice to wait for a 30% decline a good idea? Where is the data that shows that someone should have wibbit's 10 year outlook to make money on a new home purchase?


You need to learn how to read. Stop misquoting me.

I did not say wait until there is a 30% drop before you buy. What i said was *NOW* is not the time to buy due to market conditions and flat to declining home prices in the next few years. Buy now if you plan to live as primary residence for a while (ride out the cycle) or if there is a really good deal (ie: 30% below current asking price).

Once the subprime mess is sorted out (and it will) and RE market recovers in the next 3-5 years, then that's a better time to buy, the price could be 30% lower, or 10% lower, doesnt matter.

The point is you should buy while the RE market is going up, not when it was going down unless you find a really good deal.

Posted on: 2007/12/19 20:11
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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LOL, you can't argue with a crazy person!

Posted on: 2007/12/19 19:07
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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BTW check your math, that's a 14% decline, not a 4% decline.

Posted on: 2007/12/19 18:56
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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It's right there in your list! A person who bought in NYC 1987 would have had to wait about ten years to see an increase in value on their property!

Obviously saying any market "always" does anything is ridiculous. The NYC market MAY be insulated some from the sub-prime crisis fallout, but even the magical Manhattan market will be affected by numerous unpredictable variables including the performance of the major finance industry companies and their hiring increases/decreases/cutbacks and bonus paayments, the performance of the dollar internationally, the strength/weakness of the overall economy, the trend in crime in the city, etc. I don't think Jersey City is DIRECTLY correlated to the Manhattan market, but there are certainly links.

Posted on: 2007/12/19 18:53
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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Yes, I know. In a 2.5 year period (not 3) within a 20 year period, you found a 4% total decline. Oh, the horror. Then prices rose slowly, but surely, until May 1988 for a 17% total increase during this period. Not a boom by any measure, but a long and steady uptrend. Thanks for supporting my point. Where is the data that shows housing values, as wibbit says, "always eventually decline"? Where is the data that would make wibbit's advice to wait for a 30% decline a good idea? Where is the data that shows that someone should have wibbit's 10 year outlook to make money on a new home purchase?

Posted on: 2007/12/19 18:21
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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Apparently you can't read your own chart. Prices in NYC fell consistently from October 1988 through April 1991 and then took until May 1998 to re-claim the 1988 high.

Posted on: 2007/12/19 17:32
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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Instead of referring to a lame blog of newspaper clippings, I have the numbers here:

http://www2.standardandpoors.com/spf/ ... ePrice_History_112766.xls

Year to year you may find price drops. Too bad for the flippers. But over any historical period of, say, 3 years or more, NYC area home prices have only gone up. To say that prices "always" fall eventually is ridiculous. Does anyone actually believe this? Almost as ridiculous as advising someone to wait for a 30% price drop because realtors are "stubborn". Keep waiting. You say stubborn because they will not lower prices to your affordability level. When the disconnect between jumbo and conforming mortgage rates is fixed, those "stubborn" realtors will look wise. This ain't Akron, Ohio.

Posted on: 2007/12/19 17:25
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NYC Financial District rents falling - Wall Street now has 46,000 residents, only had 27,000 in 2002
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Financial district rents falling

By David Freedlander, amNewYork Staff Writer
dfreedlander@am-ny.com

December 19, 2007

Efforts to turn Wall Street into Main Street may be slackening.

A new report by The Real Estate Group of New York released Tuesday found that rents in the financial district in lower Manhattan have been steadily declining this year, with a particularly dramatic drop-off last month.

"The city and property owners have done a tremendous job in bringing back vibrancy to that neighborhood after 9/11 but they may have gone too far," said Daniel Baum, chief operating officer of the organization. "There was a little bit too much exuberance and too many tax advantages to get people to build down there."

The report showed that Financial District asking rents dropped by an average of 5 percent since last month, with studio apartments in doorman buildings falling 16 percent, down to an average of $2,559 a month. One bedrooms in July were averaging just shy of $3,500, and are now down to around $3,000, the report said.

The city has been trying to remake the Financial District into a residential area since 1995, when it launched an ambitious tax-incentive plan to lure people there. Residents and stakeholders in the neighborhood said they would like the residential transformation of the Financial District to continue.

"Reports of the death of this neighborhood have been greatly exaggerated," said Liz Berger, president of the Downtown Alliance, an area business improvement group. "The only thing that fell was a very specific sector of the market at time of year when there is usually a slow down," referring to doorman buildings and other specific points raises in the report.

She added that the credit crunch and uncertainties in the economy likely contributed to fall-off.

"We have 46,000 residents and we had 27,000 in 2002," Berger said. "People are making longer-term commitments to lower Manhattan."

Julie Menin, chairman of the community board and founder of Wall Street Rising, which is trying to revitalize the area, said she just hoped that businesses would continue to move downtown.

"There is a tremendous amount of interest in people moving down here. We need to make sure the services of the neighborhood keep pace with the development."

Posted on: 2007/12/19 2:27
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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Ok i meant the builders mostly, not agents, that are trying to keep the price up there and offer other incentives that does not get recorded as the sale price.

Crazy_Chester, so you believe the JC real estate market will continue to go up then in the next few years? why dont you try to backup your 1 liner, otherwise you are just trolling /shrug





Quote:

brewster wrote:
Quote:

Crazy_Chester wrote:
To the OP - To answer what I think was your question, I would read wibbit's response and then take the exact opposite view. It is stunning in its misinformation.


The only error in Wibbits post is that agents aren't the ones holding up the prices, they make money on deals not stalemate like we have now.

The following document of exerpts from the NYTimes from 83 to 95 should be required reading to post on this thread. It shows the same talk 17 years ago as now. See the header "1990 - Bank Failures And Foreclosure" to see where we are in the cycle. Unfortunately the graph of real values is down, what it showed was a steep drop from 89 to 92, then a long tail drop till aslow upturn in 97. Yes, the market fell in real value till 97, much of that not "prices" but inflation losses while prices held steady. http://njrereport.com/ is a great site for local market info.


Home Prices Do Fall
A Look At The Collapse Of The 1980's Real Estate Bubble
Through The Eyes Of The New York Times

Home Prices Do Fall

Posted on: 2007/12/19 1:57
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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Crazy_Chester wrote:
To the OP - To answer what I think was your question, I would read wibbit's response and then take the exact opposite view. It is stunning in its misinformation.


The only error in Wibbits post is that agents aren't the ones holding up the prices, they make money on deals not stalemate like we have now.

The following document of exerpts from the NYTimes from 83 to 95 should be required reading to post on this thread. It shows the same talk 17 years ago as now. See the header "1990 - Bank Failures And Foreclosure" to see where we are in the cycle. Unfortunately the graph of real values is down, what it showed was a steep drop from 89 to 92, then a long tail drop till aslow upturn in 97. Yes, the market fell in real value till 97, much of that not "prices" but inflation losses while prices held steady. http://njrereport.com/ is a great site for local market info.


Home Prices Do Fall
A Look At The Collapse Of The 1980's Real Estate Bubble
Through The Eyes Of The New York Times

Home Prices Do Fall

Posted on: 2007/12/19 1:21
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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- To me, the range of prices in the original post seems narrow. A rundown, ugly 1,00-square-foot house in the zone for a bad school is bound to sell for a lot less than a well-maintained, attractively decorated 1,000-square-foot house in a good school zone, even if both houses are the same size.

- Of course, if prices are actually down a bunch here, AND they've stabilized, this is a good time to buy. Buy low, sell high.

- My guess would be that whatever forces are pushing prices down this year will probably push down for 2 or 3 more years, so, all other things being equal, 2008 or 2009 might be a better year to buy a house.

- It's not clear to me that bonuses will be that terrible this year. The people involved with mortgages may be in trouble, but stocks have done OK. Maybe the people who are involved with stocks will get decent bonuses.

- My suspicion is that Wall Street bonuses affect certain types of people who buy homes in Newport, Paulus Hook and occasionally in other parts of Jersey City, but that, for most buyers, the state of the mortgage market is a bigger concern. All other things being equal, homes here that cost less than $400,000 will probably do better than homes for about $400,000 to, say, $800,000, because the market for jumbo mortgages is frozen while the market for small mortgages is OK. People who buy $1 million houses, might not sweat over a little ice in the mortgage market, but most people who buy $600,000 houses around here probably need a really good deal on a mortgage.

- On the other hand: one thing that's bound to support the market here and in New York is that, because prices are so high, there are tons of gainfully employed people with decent credit who are living with roommates. If prices ever start to fall a whole bunch, roommates will break up and find their own places, and that will put a floor on how low prices can really fall.

- I'm starting to think that all of the downtown grade schools are actually very good. I was just at an event at my daughter's school, which is not one of the ones that "the yuppies have discovered" in a big way, and all of the children, parents and teachers were lovely. The test scores are actually a lot better than in many of the suburban schools.

If it's true that the downtown grade schools are good, and if New Jersey figures out some way to hold funding steady when it passes control back to the city, then the fact that the schools are good could start to lead to increases in prices, even if the overall New York-Newark market is weak.

Along the same lines: my impression is that a lot of the Heights schools and many of the West Side schools are as good as the downtown schools. So, it could be that a lot of neighborhoods are going to benefit from the good school effect.

Keep in mind that, for a parent with 2 school age children who wants to avoid using Catholic parochial schools, living in a good public school zone means that the parent may be able pay about $200,000 to $500,000 more than the parent could afford to pay for a similar house in a crummy school zone.

Posted on: 2007/12/18 23:54
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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To the OP - To answer what I think was your question, I would read wibbit's response and then take the exact opposite view. It is stunning in its misinformation.

Posted on: 2007/12/18 20:44
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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Quote:

fasteddie wrote:
Quote:

JadedJC wrote:
Eeeeeeeeek! It's like someone typed it up the post in another language and then ran the text through one of those online translators...

I ran this through a few online translators using a different service for each translation. Hope this helps.

Original Post
What Is The Real Estate Market Trend In Jersey City Nj Because In Some Areas Sellers Are Holding The Houses...because Of The Buyers Market Buyers Are Bargaining...i Searched Few Houses In One Area There The Same App. Sq Ft Houses Differ In Their Prices Like Few Are 339k,355k,360k,370k, I Dont Know What The Sellers Opinion, Even Their House Is On Market For More Than 2 Months They Just Holding.... The Trend I Saw From Past 6th Months They Are Reducing 5%...but 339k Seller Is Desperate May Be He Even Reduces If No Buyer Buys He May Even Reduces In That Way The Other Houses May Compulsory They Have To Reduce Or They Have To Hold Where This Market Leads To In 2008..... I Think Buyer Also So Confused Whether To Buy Or Not Because If He Buy May Be After 2 To 3 Months The Next House May Sell Below Price What They Bought This Way Buyers Also Not Rushing.........
Give Your Opinions Of This Market Especially In Jersey And Newark Areas Because The Market Is Slow Compare To Other Areas..

Original to German
Was Die Immobilienmarkttendenz In Jersey Stadt Nj Ist, Weil In Einigen Gebietenverk?ufern Die H?user Halten. ..because Von Den K?ufern auf den Markt Bringt K?ufer Handeln. ..i Hat Gesucht Wenige H?user In Einem Gebiet Dort Die Gleiche Anwendung. Sq Weichen Ft H?user In Ihren Preisen Ab, Wie Wenig 339k,355k,360k,370k, ich Dont Wei? Sind, Was Die Verk?ufermeinung, Ist Sogar Ihr Haus Auf Markt F?r Mehr Als 2 Monate Sie Nur Besitz. ... Die Tendenz die ich Habe Gesehen Von Vergangenen 6. Monaten, dass Sie 5%...but 339k Verk?ufer Verringern, Ist Verzweifelt Darf Sein Er Sogar Verringert, Wenn Kein K?ufer Er Mai Sogar Kauft, Verringert In so Den Anderen H?usern Mai Obligatorisch Sie Verringern M?ssen Oder Sie M?ssen Halten Wo Diese M?rktebleie Zu In 2008.... Ich Denke, dass K?ufer Auch So Verwirrt Hat, Ob Zu Kaufen, Oder Nicht Weil Wenn Er Kauft, Nachdem 2 Zu 3 Monate Das N?chste Haus Unter Preis Verkaufen Darf, Was Sie Diesen Wegenk?ufer Auch Nicht Eilen Gekauft Haben Darf Sein. ........ Geben Sie Ihre Meinungen Von Diesem Markt Besonders In Jersey Und Newark Gebieten, Weil Der Markt Ist Langsam Zu Anderem Areas. Vergleicht.

German back to English
Which the property market tendency is in jersey city Nj, because in uniting area salesmen the houses stops. ..because of the buyers on the market brings buyers to acting. ..i there the same application looked for few houses in an area. Sq switches Ft of houses in your prices off, like few 339k, 355k, 360k, 370k, I Dont white are, which the salesman opinion, even your house on market is for more than 2 months you only possession... The tendency which I property seen of passing 6. Months that you 5%... but 339k salesman reducing is, desperately may be it even reduced, if no buyer he even buys May reduced in so the other houses May mandatory you reducing having or you having stops where this Maerktebleie too in 2008.... I think that buyer confused also in such a way, whether to purchase, or not because if he buys, after 2 to 3 months the next house under price selling may do, which you this way buyer also hurrying may not be bought credit........ Particularly give your opinions of this market in jersey and Newark to areas, because the market is slow to other AREAS. Compares.

Above result to Italian
Quale la tendenza del mercato immobiliare ? nella citt? di Jersey Nj, perch? nei commessi d'unificazione di zona le case si arresta. .because of i compratori sul mercato porta i compratori a comportarsi. .i l? la stessa applicazione ha cercato poche case in una zona. Interruttori quadrati Ft delle case nei vostri prezzi fuori da, come poco 339k, 355k, 360k, 370k, non faccio bianco sono, che l'opinione del commesso, persino la vostra casa sul mercato ? per pi? di 2 mesi voi soltanto possesso? La tendenza che la propriet? di I veduta di passare 6. mesi che 5%? ma riduzione del commesso 339k siete, pu? disperatamente sia persino riduttore, se nessun compratore lui persino compra maggio riduttore in in modo da l'altro mandatario di maggio delle case voi che riducete avere o voi che avete arresti dove questo Maerktebleie ugualmente in 2008?. Penso quel compratore sconcertante anche in tale maniera, se comprare, o non perch? se compra, dopo che 2 - 3 mesi la casa seguente nell'ambito della vendita di prezzi pu? fare, che questo compratore di senso anche che affretta non potete essere comprati accreditamento ........ Esprimere specialmente i vostri pareri di questo mercato a in Jersey e Newark alle zone, perch? il mercato ? lento ad altre ZONE. Confronta.

Italian back to English
As the trend of real estate is in the city of Jersey Nj, committed because of the unification of the houses zone stops. . Buyers because of market leads buyers to behave. . Across the the same application has tried a few houses in the area. Square Ft switches in your house prices outside as little 339k, 355k, 360k, 370k, do not have white, that the views of committed, even your house is on the market for more than 2 months you? The only possession trend ownership I view moving 6. Months 5% reduction? but committed 339k you can be desperately reducer even if no buyer even buy him in May gear to the other agent in May of houses that you reduce that you have or where you arrest this Maerktebleie also in 2008?. I think that buyer also disconcerting in this way, whether buying or not buying because if, after 2 - 3 months in the house following the sale price can be done, that this buyer sense that hastens can not be bought accreditation ........ Expressing especially your opinions of this market in Newark and Jersey areas, because the market is slow in other areas. Compare


LMAO

Posted on: 2007/12/18 20:35
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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Jersey city's real estate market is closely linked with the NYC market which depends heavily on wall street. This year's bonus overall will be bad (except goldman). And next year will most likely be even worse.

So now is not the time to buy unless you can find an excellent deal 30% below market or plan to live as primary residence for 10+ years.

The prices in JC (downtown, newport etc..) hasnt really dropped too much, i dont think there are a lot of buying going on but the sellers/agents are stubbornly holding onto their asking prices established during the RE boom for now.

Historically speaking, the prices will always drop eventually, unless the market makes a recovery which is high unlikely in the next 4 years.

Also i hate grammar police on boards, they are worse than trolls. But You Really need To use Caps Correctly, or It makes Reading Very difficult.

Quote:

lal_1793 wrote:
What Is The Real Estate Market Trend In Jersey City Nj Because In Some Areas Sellers Are Holding The Houses...because Of The Buyers Market Buyers Are Bargaining...i Searched Few Houses In One Area There The Same App. Sq Ft Houses Differ In Their Prices Like Few Are 339k,355k,360k,370k, I Dont Know What The Sellers Opinion, Even Their House Is On Market For More Than 2 Months They Just Holding.... The Trend I Saw From Past 6th Months They Are Reducing 5%...but 339k Seller Is Desperate May Be He Even Reduces If No Buyer Buys He May Even Reduces In That Way The Other Houses May Compulsory They Have To Reduce Or They Have To Hold Where This Market Leads To In 2008..... I Think Buyer Also So Confused Whether To Buy Or Not Because If He Buy May Be After 2 To 3 Months The Next House May Sell Below Price What They Bought This Way Buyers Also Not Rushing.........
Give Your Opinions Of This Market Especially In Jersey And Newark Areas Because The Market Is Slow Compare To Other Areas..

Posted on: 2007/12/18 19:24
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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Madeline: I'm sorry, who are you again?
Fletch: I'm Frieda's boss.
Madeline: Who's Frieda?
Fletch: My secretary.

Posted on: 2007/12/18 18:39
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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Fasteddie, you just made my day! LOL!! I actually think the German permutation makes more sense than the original one....Can we get a translation in Klingon?

Posted on: 2007/12/18 17:18
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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Quote:

lal_1793 wrote:
this is just a forum if u getting headache u better dont give replies this not a school to learn grammar ..... ppl giving their views and doubts if u understand give or leave it comment others grammar


I still don't understand what you're saying.

Posted on: 2007/12/18 16:53
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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is the OP 9 or retarded.

Posted on: 2007/12/18 16:52
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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Quote:

JadedJC wrote:
Eeeeeeeeek! It's like someone typed it up the post in another language and then ran the text through one of those online translators...

I ran this through a few online translators using a different service for each translation. Hope this helps.

Original Post
What Is The Real Estate Market Trend In Jersey City Nj Because In Some Areas Sellers Are Holding The Houses...because Of The Buyers Market Buyers Are Bargaining...i Searched Few Houses In One Area There The Same App. Sq Ft Houses Differ In Their Prices Like Few Are 339k,355k,360k,370k, I Dont Know What The Sellers Opinion, Even Their House Is On Market For More Than 2 Months They Just Holding.... The Trend I Saw From Past 6th Months They Are Reducing 5%...but 339k Seller Is Desperate May Be He Even Reduces If No Buyer Buys He May Even Reduces In That Way The Other Houses May Compulsory They Have To Reduce Or They Have To Hold Where This Market Leads To In 2008..... I Think Buyer Also So Confused Whether To Buy Or Not Because If He Buy May Be After 2 To 3 Months The Next House May Sell Below Price What They Bought This Way Buyers Also Not Rushing.........
Give Your Opinions Of This Market Especially In Jersey And Newark Areas Because The Market Is Slow Compare To Other Areas..

Original to German
Was Die Immobilienmarkttendenz In Jersey Stadt Nj Ist, Weil In Einigen Gebietenverk?ufern Die H?user Halten. ..because Von Den K?ufern auf den Markt Bringt K?ufer Handeln. ..i Hat Gesucht Wenige H?user In Einem Gebiet Dort Die Gleiche Anwendung. Sq Weichen Ft H?user In Ihren Preisen Ab, Wie Wenig 339k,355k,360k,370k, ich Dont Wei? Sind, Was Die Verk?ufermeinung, Ist Sogar Ihr Haus Auf Markt F?r Mehr Als 2 Monate Sie Nur Besitz. ... Die Tendenz die ich Habe Gesehen Von Vergangenen 6. Monaten, dass Sie 5%...but 339k Verk?ufer Verringern, Ist Verzweifelt Darf Sein Er Sogar Verringert, Wenn Kein K?ufer Er Mai Sogar Kauft, Verringert In so Den Anderen H?usern Mai Obligatorisch Sie Verringern M?ssen Oder Sie M?ssen Halten Wo Diese M?rktebleie Zu In 2008.... Ich Denke, dass K?ufer Auch So Verwirrt Hat, Ob Zu Kaufen, Oder Nicht Weil Wenn Er Kauft, Nachdem 2 Zu 3 Monate Das N?chste Haus Unter Preis Verkaufen Darf, Was Sie Diesen Wegenk?ufer Auch Nicht Eilen Gekauft Haben Darf Sein. ........ Geben Sie Ihre Meinungen Von Diesem Markt Besonders In Jersey Und Newark Gebieten, Weil Der Markt Ist Langsam Zu Anderem Areas. Vergleicht.

German back to English
Which the property market tendency is in jersey city Nj, because in uniting area salesmen the houses stops. ..because of the buyers on the market brings buyers to acting. ..i there the same application looked for few houses in an area. Sq switches Ft of houses in your prices off, like few 339k, 355k, 360k, 370k, I Dont white are, which the salesman opinion, even your house on market is for more than 2 months you only possession... The tendency which I property seen of passing 6. Months that you 5%... but 339k salesman reducing is, desperately may be it even reduced, if no buyer he even buys May reduced in so the other houses May mandatory you reducing having or you having stops where this Maerktebleie too in 2008.... I think that buyer confused also in such a way, whether to purchase, or not because if he buys, after 2 to 3 months the next house under price selling may do, which you this way buyer also hurrying may not be bought credit........ Particularly give your opinions of this market in jersey and Newark to areas, because the market is slow to other AREAS. Compares.

Above result to Italian
Quale la tendenza del mercato immobiliare ? nella citt? di Jersey Nj, perch? nei commessi d'unificazione di zona le case si arresta. .because of i compratori sul mercato porta i compratori a comportarsi. .i l? la stessa applicazione ha cercato poche case in una zona. Interruttori quadrati Ft delle case nei vostri prezzi fuori da, come poco 339k, 355k, 360k, 370k, non faccio bianco sono, che l'opinione del commesso, persino la vostra casa sul mercato ? per pi? di 2 mesi voi soltanto possesso? La tendenza che la propriet? di I veduta di passare 6. mesi che 5%? ma riduzione del commesso 339k siete, pu? disperatamente sia persino riduttore, se nessun compratore lui persino compra maggio riduttore in in modo da l'altro mandatario di maggio delle case voi che riducete avere o voi che avete arresti dove questo Maerktebleie ugualmente in 2008?. Penso quel compratore sconcertante anche in tale maniera, se comprare, o non perch? se compra, dopo che 2 - 3 mesi la casa seguente nell'ambito della vendita di prezzi pu? fare, che questo compratore di senso anche che affretta non potete essere comprati accreditamento ........ Esprimere specialmente i vostri pareri di questo mercato a in Jersey e Newark alle zone, perch? il mercato ? lento ad altre ZONE. Confronta.

Italian back to English
As the trend of real estate is in the city of Jersey Nj, committed because of the unification of the houses zone stops. . Buyers because of market leads buyers to behave. . Across the the same application has tried a few houses in the area. Square Ft switches in your house prices outside as little 339k, 355k, 360k, 370k, do not have white, that the views of committed, even your house is on the market for more than 2 months you? The only possession trend ownership I view moving 6. Months 5% reduction? but committed 339k you can be desperately reducer even if no buyer even buy him in May gear to the other agent in May of houses that you reduce that you have or where you arrest this Maerktebleie also in 2008?. I think that buyer also disconcerting in this way, whether buying or not buying because if, after 2 - 3 months in the house following the sale price can be done, that this buyer sense that hastens can not be bought accreditation ........ Expressing especially your opinions of this market in Newark and Jersey areas, because the market is slow in other areas. Compare

Posted on: 2007/12/18 16:49
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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lal_1793 wrote:
this is just a forum if u getting headache u better dont give replies this not a school to learn grammar ..... ppl giving their views and doubts if u understand give or leave it comment others grammar

Nobody is going to "give replies" if they don't know what the heck you are asking.

Posted on: 2007/12/18 16:14
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Re: Real Estate Market trend In Jersey City
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this is just a forum if u getting headache u better dont give replies this not a school to learn grammar ..... ppl giving their views and doubts if u understand give or leave it comment others grammar

Posted on: 2007/12/18 15:55
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