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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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Lots of people seem upset about the trash on the streets, and justifiably so, yet when I went to the Harsimus Cove street cleanup this weekend it was the same 5 people who are always there.

While the city can do more the residents aren't exactly going out of their way to make is a cleaner city.

Posted on: 2013/4/7 10:58
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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quality of life matters to us residents of jersey city! We are tired of the graffiti and the trash in the steets. Yes, JCPD, we want you to pay attention to these issues!

Posted on: 2013/4/7 0:47
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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I'd like to see the police as part of the community, protecting the peace, using the City's resources effectively and efficiently, being sensitive to the priorities of the residents, and enforcing laws only when other means fail.

"Broken windows" isn't quite the same as "zero tolerance". It's also not about lowering crime stats using "deadbolt-your-door" style tactics. It's about reducing the overall fear and anxiety in the neighborhoods, and improving the overall health of the community. Have a read of the Broken windows article. Steve's plan incorporates a lot of this, and is a big step in the right direction of protecting the peace.

http://www.manhattan-institute.org/pd ... onthly-broken_windows.pdf

Posted on: 2013/4/6 17:29
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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The JCIA has had workers sweeping the streets and cleaning the gutters for the last two weeks. They will be doing this for just a few more weeks till after election so don't get used to it.

Posted on: 2013/4/6 17:00
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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That the city puts such a low priority on effectively dealing with its MAJOR garbage/litter problem is a tacit admission that this place is trash, and it weighs on the minds of its residents. Solving this problem would be a great step toward having some more respect for ourselves.


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CatDog wrote:
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bodhipooh wrote:
Perhaps so, but it is definitely true that the crime drop in NYC was even more radical/marked than in other cities. One basic theory is that the vigilant enforcement of "qualify of life" crimes was a key reason for that. Or, as some people refer to it, the "broken windows" theory.

I happen to agree with that. If the JCPD were to start enforcing basic laws (no double parking blocking traffic, leash and curbing of dogs, loitering, noise and curfew laws) that would have the consequence of putting people on notice that the police is not going to sit idly by and let people misbehave. I think people start to modify their behavior enough to lead to a more civilized environment. One thing is certain, doing nothing, or continuing to do the same as now, will not lead to a better result. As the broken windows theory has been proven: when people assess their surroundings, and determine that they do not need to follow certain rules or behavior, they will do just that.

The basic example, and the one studied over and over, is that of littering. In many studies, when a subject is faced with a choice to litter, or not, that person was significantly more likely to litter when he found himself in an area that was already littered. I think that is part of the endemic problem in JC: many people have already "learned" that littering is OK. I think a massive public campaign targeting quality of life issues, couple with heightened enforcement by the JCPD, is what we need.
that's a compelling argument right there

Posted on: 2013/4/6 16:03
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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Most of the policing has to start at home.


No, family starts at home. Policing picks up where family leaves off. A policing strategy has to take into account the families we have and keep neighborhoods and residents safe by effective law enforcement.

Locating the policing problem in the home takes the administration and police department off the hook for soing a better job with the residents we have.


Posted on: 2013/4/6 5:34
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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bodhipooh wrote:
Perhaps so, but it is definitely true that the crime drop in NYC was even more radical/marked than in other cities. One basic theory is that the vigilant enforcement of "qualify of life" crimes was a key reason for that. Or, as some people refer to it, the "broken windows" theory.

I happen to agree with that. If the JCPD were to start enforcing basic laws (no double parking blocking traffic, leash and curbing of dogs, loitering, noise and curfew laws) that would have the consequence of putting people on notice that the police is not going to sit idly by and let people misbehave. I think people start to modify their behavior enough to lead to a more civilized environment. One thing is certain, doing nothing, or continuing to do the same as now, will not lead to a better result. As the broken windows theory has been proven: when people assess their surroundings, and determine that they do not need to follow certain rules or behavior, they will do just that.

The basic example, and the one studied over and over, is that of littering. In many studies, when a subject is faced with a choice to litter, or not, that person was significantly more likely to litter when he found himself in an area that was already littered. I think that is part of the endemic problem in JC: many people have already "learned" that littering is OK. I think a massive public campaign targeting quality of life issues, couple with heightened enforcement by the JCPD, is what we need.
that's a compelling argument right there

Posted on: 2013/4/5 15:29
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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http://www.theatlanticcities.com/poli ... s-famous-drop-crime/4616/

Greenberg also found no causal connection between officers per capita at the precinct level and reductions in violent crime, or between an increase in misdemeanor arrests and a drop in felonies (as "broken windows" implies might happen).

Posted on: 2013/4/5 15:02
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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Perhaps so, but it is definitely true that the crime drop in NYC was even more radical/marked than in other cities. One basic theory is that the vigilant enforcement of "qualify of life" crimes was a key reason for that. Or, as some people refer to it, the "broken windows" theory.

I happen to agree with that. If the JCPD were to start enforcing basic laws (no double parking blocking traffic, leash and curbing of dogs, loitering, noise and curfew laws) that would have the consequence of putting people on notice that the police is not going to sit idly by and let people misbehave. I think people start to modify their behavior enough to lead to a more civilized environment. One thing is certain, doing nothing, or continuing to do the same as now, will not lead to a better result. As the broken windows theory has been proven: when people assess their surroundings, and determine that they do not need to follow certain rules or behavior, they will do just that.

The basic example, and the one studied over and over, is that of littering. In many studies, when a subject is faced with a choice to litter, or not, that person was significantly more likely to litter when he found himself in an area that was already littered. I think that is part of the endemic problem in JC: many people have already "learned" that littering is OK. I think a massive public campaign targeting quality of life issues, couple with heightened enforcement by the JCPD, is what we need.

Posted on: 2013/4/5 13:20
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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To address the crime problem, we have to call on the best and brightest resources to fix the problem. Steve Fulop should immediately form a task force of experts led by Charles Mainor, our Assemblyman, a police detective, and one of the most dignified and classy persons in the Hudson County delegation. I hear he researches street violence assiduously every day, using the latest social media techniques to see exactly what is going on on our concrete jungle.

Posted on: 2013/4/5 13:15
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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user1111 wrote:
This city needs a Giuliani like mayor if its going to get serious about crime. I am not even sure Fulop is going to be as tough as Rudy.


A Giuliani-like mayor would be a shameless egoist who takes disproportionate credit for phenomenon that he has little to do with. The same encouraging improvements we saw in New York City's criminal landscape during the 1990’s occurred throughout the nation, and it’s not like every city had a tough guy in a dress at the helm.

Posted on: 2013/4/4 20:05
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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beam4972 wrote:
How can any Mayor bring crime down when it seems like it is a family tradition? When these youngsters are arrested or brought home by police their gaurdian will frequently blame police or cry harrasment. Police are arresting generation after generation in the same family. How can any Mayor force the element that has taken over much of our city out?

The same way Bayonne does. Downtown Bayonne 8th street has projects and many poorer residents and you don't see all the nonsense you see here.

This city needs a Giuliani like mayor if its going to get serious about crime. I am not even sure Fulop is going to be as tough as Rudy.

Guliani clean up the LES within a year in office. Jersey City is still the same 9 years later, and we can not keep saying well downtown is safer, then we are just a ghetto city with a nice waterfront.

Posted on: 2013/4/4 18:27
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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How can any Mayor bring crime down when it seems like it is a family tradition? When these youngsters are arrested or brought home by police their gaurdian will frequently blame police or cry harrasment. Police are arresting generation after generation in the same family. How can any Mayor force the element that has taken over much of our city out?

Posted on: 2013/4/4 17:47
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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beam4972 wrote:
Why doesn't either Fulop or Healy have the balls to say it like it is? Most of the policing has to start at home. Why are kids 13 or 15 out at 1AM? They aren't on the way to school unless juvie is their starter school. Without parenting no amount of cops will will able to ensure these little ones are not roaming the streets looking for trouble.


We have curfew laws, the police should enforce them. Kids are known to break curfew everywhere in this country, but in JC its not enforced by this administration. JC is lazy when it comes to enforcing laws from curfew, loitering, double parking, littering to not picking up dog shit. The police and Healy have failed all of Jersey City.

The only people that have thrived under this administration are the drug dealers, they have been standing on the same corners since 2009 and business is good.

Posted on: 2013/4/4 16:30
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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Dahood wrote:
Completely agree with you.

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Why doesn't either Fulop or Healy have the balls to say it like it is? Most of the policing has to start at home. Why are kids 13 or 15 out at 1AM? They aren't on the way to school unless juvie is their starter school. Without parenting no amount of cops will will able to ensure these little ones are not roaming the streets looking for trouble.


OK, so what exactly would you have the mayor do? Do you think if the mayor scolds parents that this will have any noticeable effect? What exactly can a mayor do to influence parents to be responsible in their child rearing?

You seem to have this figured out ("keep the kids home and not wandering the streets"), which I think everyone would agree with. But, how exactly how would this be implemented? Truant officers?


Posted on: 2013/4/4 16:21
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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Completely agree with you.

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Why doesn't either Fulop or Healy have the balls to say it like it is? Most of the policing has to start at home. Why are kids 13 or 15 out at 1AM? They aren't on the way to school unless juvie is their starter school. Without parenting no amount of cops will will able to ensure these little ones are not roaming the streets looking for trouble.

Posted on: 2013/4/4 16:02
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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Why doesn't either Fulop or Healy have the balls to say it like it is? Most of the policing has to start at home. Why are kids 13 or 15 out at 1AM? They aren't on the way to school unless juvie is their starter school. Without parenting no amount of cops will will able to ensure these little ones are not roaming the streets looking for trouble.

Posted on: 2013/4/4 15:45
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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JCPD is one of the top notch departments in the Country? Wow. Could have fooled me.

I am certainly not anti-cop by any means, but lets have a little clarity here. There is a crime problem in this city. There is a quality of life problem in this city. People move ot of this City because they don't feel safe raising their children here. JCPD certainly needs changes. We should always seek to improve and innovate. THe people of this City are TELLING you that we need changes. When JCPD refuses to listen and do some self reflection, then there is a real problem.

Don't even get me started about the Police Union actually throwing it's support behind the highly pressurized massive Spectra gas pipeline. Was this in the interest of public safety? No, but it certainly would provide lots of cops extra hours to pad their overtime....

Posted on: 2013/4/4 15:07
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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Healy and Fulop have been trading claims about crime, Healy in particular has pushed the notion that crime (especially murder) is down.

Thurman Hart's NJ Voices blog post "The case against Jerramiah Healy, part 1" puts some of those claims on the table for exmination.

Mr. Hart writes:

While I have never been a fan of Mayor Jerramiah Healy, I thought he did a decent job of presenting his case for why he should be re-elected. He hit most, if not all, of the talking points he presents on his website.

I just don't think his website is giving an accurate portrayal of his time in office....

If you listen to the audio link at the beginning of this post, Mayor Healy very openly claims that there were fewer murders in Jersey City in 2011 than in any year since records were kept. But according to the FBI, there were only 15 homicides in 1999 and 17 in 2000. That means that Healy's claim of being "the best ever" cannot even be claimed to be misleading. It is an outright lie.

Adding 2011 into the analysis does change the statistics, though. Over 27 years, there were 663 homicides in Jersey City, making the average 24.6. The total during Healy's time in office is 177, with an average of 25.3. This means that, even including the best year on Healy's watch, the number of murders was up, not down.

If we include 2011 in our murder rate numbers, then the average muder rate is 10.4. During Healy's terms in office, it has been 10.4. In other words, it has been average.

Healy's claim that murders were down in 2011 is true. But it is misleading. It's the kind of sleazy manipulation of the truth that makes people sick of politics.

For more of the stats, see the full article: "The case against Jerramiah Healy, part 1"

Posted on: 2013/4/4 13:53
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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DanL wrote:
what additional police jobs can be done by civilians? I attend the monthly captains meetings on a semi-regular basis


Sounds like you haven't spent much time in police stations or talking to cops. You and Healy just keep chanting more police, yet Jersey City has a much higher police/population ration than cities of comparable size, and cities in our region. And the JCPD has a much lower percentage of cops on the street than comparable departments. That is evidence that our force is poorly-deployed, with trained police officers doing work without much benefit or directly related to their training.

For starters, every precinct has detectives doing clerical work. For starters, the police department has a culture which does not value patrol and "on the beat" policing. talk to cops and they will tell you - privately - that promotions and sweet jobs come not from good policing, but from being "connected" and taking care of business inside the department, not on the street.

Fulop is talking about changing the department's orientation away from HQ and City Hall, and towards our streets and our neighborhoods.

As to your and you buddy crazyforjc's notion that changing the department is too hard, that reflects a lack of vision and lack of cojones. Healy hasn't dared to try Class 2 officers because he doesn't have the guts to take on any controversy that's not forced upon him (like Operation Bid Rig). He would not even think about taking on the union, because his support is so fragile. We've seen this with the financial tricks he pulled to avoid layoffs, without getting anything in return.

Class 2 officers are legal, allowed by state law, and are being used successfully in Newark, Union City, and Hoboken. Fulop is smart enough to have studied this and is clear that the Class 2 officers will not come into town to take highly coveted overtime gigs away from existing officers.

But your position seems to be "let's not try anything because nothing will work." Another Team Healy talking point.

Posted on: 2013/2/17 16:00
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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A number of police officers and mid-level brass that I know have told me that policing could be better organized in this city. Who or you, or I, to argue with them?

Posted on: 2013/2/15 18:17
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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Voters should take crazyforjc's advice and read the plan. There is a lot more to it than the issues he has raised.

http://stevenfulop.com/sites/default/ ... op_public_safety_plan.pdf

Posted on: 2013/2/15 17:29
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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The re entry program Fulop is proposing is right on point.
Even if he gets 25% of what this platform says done its better than the last 50 years of JC government!

Take a look at Ward F. There has been little change for at least 35 years. It's time for someone to give us some attention. Diane Coleman needs to know that most of us are backing her.

fulop 2013!!

Posted on: 2013/2/15 17:26
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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crazyforjc--You keep repeating "It can't work" like a mantra but the only actual obstacle you have raised relates to police union intransigence. I defer to your superior knowledge when it comes to this, but even unpopular changes can be made to union contracts when they are renegotiated.

With respect to community policing you say it can't work because it hasn't worked elsewhere or didn't work in the past. Surely we can all agree that a lot depends on the details of the plan and the commitment the city has to the policy.

For me, the worst effect of crime is that it instills fear and a sense of hopelessness in the communities most affected. If these communities have more confidence in the police and do not feel neglected by the city, that is an important accomplishment. A sense of forward momentum is a key component of the will to work for improvement.

Your attitude is a reflection of a core issue in this campaign: Do we want the familiar Hudson County status quo or do we want fresh ideas and energy? Even if you ignore the clear signs of corruption and admire Mayor Healy's tenure, would a fourth term be what's best for Jersey City?

Posted on: 2013/2/15 17:17
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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Quote:

StevenFulop wrote:
I can appreciate the negativity from trolls as it is campaign season. It is easy for people to ridicule when there is no other recommendation on the table other than the status quo which has not been effective.

It is important to note that every aspect of this was explained in detail to editorial boards on how they would function / why they would. Not to mention that this police plan had a ton of senior people in the Jcpd input and not to mention Gajewski himself our ward a candidate who does have credentials on this as he is in the Policing Hall of Fame.


I get the negative comments as that is what people do but they are just not rooted in fact.



With all due respect, Councilman..there are trolls from ALL sides.

Posted on: 2013/2/15 17:13
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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I can appreciate the negativity from trolls as it is campaign season. It is easy for people to ridicule when there is no other recommendation on the table other than the status quo which has not been effective.

It is important to note that every aspect of this was explained in detail to editorial boards on how they would function / why they would. Not to mention that this police plan had a ton of senior people in the Jcpd input and not to mention Gajewski himself our ward a candidate who does have credentials on this as he is in the Policing Hall of Fame.

I get the negative comments as that is what people do but they are just not rooted in fact.


Posted on: 2013/2/15 17:07
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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I am not a jc cop. I am involved in law but on the legal side. Not a lawyer. U cancall me a troll but call me correct. This grand plan is never happening.

Im sure the person who drew it up thinks it will work, of course they would. Any politician will say what's necessary to make you think they are new, different and effective. Does anyone realize that fulops team is a recycled group from when hefirst came out. If he showed up with a new crew and said this is my team to run the pd, id maybe see it differently, but he is not. He is recycling guys from years past, some of which you same people mocked when you heard some of tueir antics during elections past

 as for police first class, its not recognized by civil service, therefore there is no test. It would be politically appointed, but will never happen. It would have to be added to the collective bbargaining contract, in which one is already in effect for a few more years I believe. Things like that cannot be forced down a unions throat. It also adds more to the pension responsibility of the taxpayer in the longrun because any increase in base is pensionable.

So then you will have two politically appointed positions. Good job, just more room for nepotism.

Posted on: 2013/2/15 16:54
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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What is the benefit of being "Police - First Class" Higher pay grade? Pick of the cooler guns? Perhaps an ability to pick a title that doesn't sound as dorky as "Police - First Class?"

Will a civil service exam be administered for this? Or Is the title broadbanded with the regular patrol officer title, if so how are promotions determined?

Crazyforjc may be a troll, but some of the criticisms are on point. This has to be thought out a lot better.

I'll be reading about jobs and re-entry next.

Posted on: 2013/2/15 16:33
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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crazyforjc - you say you aren't a cop and yet you say with absolute certainty that the plan can't be implemented. I will tell you there has been significant input into the paper from retired police who are quite confident that the plan can not only be implemented but will succeed.

DanL - Steve's comment about "no significant tax increase" pertained to the policing policy only. The idea being that there are a lot of improvements that can be made on an essentially cost-neutral basis. The entirety of his proposals (not just policing) will not raise taxes. Just wanted to clear that up lest you continue to lead people down the road of "see - my guy raised taxers, but the other guy will too." - consistent with everything else I hear coming out of your camp. Too bad you can't get your guy to engage in a conversation of ideas and he leaves you out here to flounder about on your own.

Posted on: 2013/2/15 16:31
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Re: Steve Fulop candidate for Jersey City Mayor announces anti-crime plan
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I imagine this is as detailed as you are going to get during an election campaign. However, I agree that the radio room people often suck. I've had horrible experiences with them. There should at least be some kind of reporting system where by the public can give their experience and an officer can review to weed out the terrible operators.

I doubt very much though that this plan was created in a vacuum. This was probably created with officers on the inside or retired officers that have a lot of knowledge and experience. I felt horrible for the West side police that looked at me sadly and told me the story about a man coming in and shooting up the place and that the broken safety glass (just bullet holes, not shattered) hadn't been replaced in years. They felt like the City just didn't care that they put their lives on the line. So there are the officers with their boots on the ground that feel the top heavy JCPD doesn't offer them much support in an ever decreasing PD force.

I hope whatever happens in this election that there is a change for the better for those who risk their lives and for those that feel they live in unsafe neighborhoods. I think the two go hand in hand.

The argument I have heard against foot patrols is that it lengthens the time for a police officer to get back to their patrol car in the case they have to respond to an emergency call.

I would hope that whatever plan is implemented that it is done with a lot of the buy in from our police department. Fire and Police are the lion's share of the budget so even if you can't reduce the ballooning costs hopefully you can get efficient and lean departments that improve the safety of the officers/fighters and increase the quality of life for the residents. Way too top heavy.

Quote:

JPhurst wrote:
More details are needed. What functions will be turned over to civilians? I remember back in the Schundler administration there was a lot of controversy over the civilianization of the radio room. Schundler insisted that these were not law enforcement jobs and that civilians could perform the work, while cops insisted that at least some law enforcement personnel with proper training and familiarity needed to be there to oversee dispatch. Saying "get cops out of desk jobs" sounds good, but figuring out what constitutes a desk job isn't as easy as it sounds.

Posted on: 2013/2/15 16:00
soshin: Mention guns and bd pops up through a hole in the ground like a heavily armed meercat
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