JERSEY CITY LIST - Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor. [NOT Jersey City]

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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I'm not going to get into an argument about this with people who are just fundamentally opposed to a government role in healthcare. But I have an old colleague that lost her very well paid full time job over two years ago and was a fervent supporter of mccain/palin and a staunch opponent of ObamaCare. She is now enthusiastically enrolled her ObamaCare after foregoing health insurance because it was TOOOOOO expensive at the individual level.

Posted on: 2014/1/29 3:35

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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Quote:

hero69 wrote:
our learned Republican senators want to replace ObamaCare with an even worse, more expensive system.
They give tax credits so individuals can go out an buy individual policies. Aren't some individual policies (ie non-group) like 5-6X more expensive than group policies.

Basically, you don't know an answer to this question to begin with. Second, even if "some" individual policies were more expensive than group policies right now, - you can't deduce from there that the prices in the entirely new system would be higher than in the old one.

What you should have said, is, - "oh, I surely hope that Republican plan turned out to be worse and more expensive than Obamacare!!!! Oh, I want it badly!"

Quote:

hero69 wrote:
Also, I think states should start passing laws that bar people from emergency room treatment if they decided to foregoaffordable health insurance...enough with the deadbeats who want to milk the system.

Nice. That's statism distilled. First step, let's make the law that emergency rooms must treat everyone even without means to pay. Second step, let's make the law that would prohibit access to the emergency rooms to people without means to pay.

You could, of course reach the same result by simply abolishing the first law, - but that didn't occur to you.

Double the laws - double the fun!

Posted on: 2014/1/29 3:14

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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Quote:

hero69 wrote:
Also, I think states should start passing laws that bar people from emergency room treatment if they decided to foregoaffordable health insurance...enough with the deadbeats who want to milk the system.

The law requiring emergency care is a Federal law.

Posted on: 2014/1/28 12:00

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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They give tax credits so individuals can go out an buy individual policies. Aren't some individual policies (ie non-group) like 5-6X more expensive than group policies.

No they are not. When you buy 'individual' insurance, you are grouped with other individuals, just like when you buy life insurance, homeowner insurance, and renter insurance. The price of health insurance has been for years dictated by state regulations.

States like VT, NY, NJ did a version of Obamacare (minus making it illegal to not have insurance) decades ago. They became what is known as 'guaranteed issue / community rating states'. The former means you couldn't be turned down for insurance. The latter meant you had to charge everyone the same rates, regardless of factors such as weight, lifestyle, genetic predisposition for certain diseases, etc. NJ somewhat reformed the latter at least allowing rates to be adjusted based on sex and age (women spend a lot more on health than men) and allowing young people to buy very basic plans (now banned under ACA).

You could kind of get out of the state regulation if you ran a business with two more more employees. Then you fell at least in part under the federal regulations. You could get out of some of the state rules that made insurance so expensive. However, in some states, individual plans were still cheaper.

A coworker of mine (past employer) moved to PA. He found he could get a less expensive plan for his family (he had I think 5 kids) than through our employer. He switched to Golden Rule which specialized in individual care. The plan covered much less of the small stuff, but gave him the catastrophic coverage he needed. However, NJ state law requires that if you are offered group coverage, you can't get out of the plan by buying your own. So he ended up back on the company plan that he did not want.

If you want to reduce insurance costs, allow insurance to be sold across state lines. It worked wonders for term health insurance. Today, I can buy $500k in 20 year fixed term insurance at a rate lower than I could 20 years ago as a guy in his mid 20's. The margins on term are very tight. The reason this happened is that I can log onto a number of websites and get competitive quotes. As long as I what I say is true (health screening check) I will get the insurance.

Posted on: 2014/1/28 12:00

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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Also, I think states should start passing laws that bar people from emergency room treatment if they decided to foregoaffordable health insurance...enough with the deadbeats who want to milk the system.

Posted on: 2014/1/28 4:45

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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our learned Republican senators want to replace ObamaCare with an even worse, more expensive system.

They give tax credits so individuals can go out an buy individual policies. Aren't some individual policies (ie non-group) like 5-6X more expensive than group policies.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-01 ... replacement-for-2017.html

Posted on: 2014/1/28 4:40

5 Types of Conservatives Rightwingers To Just Ignore

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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Quote:

Wishful_Thinking wrote:
No, I don't understand. The conversation was - is - about insurance, why it needs to be more widely available as well as effective (i.e., cover overwhelming costs). Your rebuttal makes no sense whatsoever.

And outrage against rightwingers is never wasted - since they are are impervious to any ideas except what they want to hear, it bounces right back! It's warming up in my pocket as I write this.

What's not to understand? it is extremely simple.

I was asked what I plan to do if I incur overwhelming bills. I answered that I plan not to incur those.

You read it, and did not understand. You thought that I claim that I will never incur "catastrophic medical expenses". But this is not the same. This is what insurance is for, - to make sure that one is not overwhelmed by some catastrophic event.

Now I am thinking that the outrage against "rightwingers" that consumes you is not the result of you not understanding my statement, - but rather the reason why you didn't understand.

Posted on: 2014/1/28 3:42

Wishful_Thinking

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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user1111 wrote:
5 Types of Conservatives Rightwingers To Just Ignore

I must be lucky to count reasonably sane conservatives among my family and friends - I didn't even know there were types 1 and 2 out there. We had the Civil War why?

Posted on: 2014/1/24 23:15

user1111

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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Posted on: 2014/1/24 22:04

http://googleitbitch.com/

Wishful_Thinking

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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Quote:

borisp wrote:
Quote:
Wishful_Thinking wrote:
Quote:
borisp wrote:
Quote:
CdeCoincy wrote:
What's your fallback stategy if you incur overwhelming bills?

I do not plan to incur those. I plan to pay my own way. Of course, if something happens that I failed to foresee, I will first sell everything that I have, - and then I will ask for help. I will definitely not force others to pay for me.

In a nutshell, the attitude that necessitates government intervention in health care in the first place... you don't plan to incurr catastrophic medical expenses - are you [censored] kidding me?!

The comment that you chose to respond to, was not talking about "catastrophic medical expenses". It was about "overwhelming bills". These are not the same. It may not be possible to prevent "catastrophic medical expenses", but it is quite possible to make sure they are not overwhelming. For example, one can buy a so called "insurance".

See?

If only you read it carefully, you could have saved yourself one perfectly good outrage, - and now it is wasted.

No, I don't understand. The conversation was - is - about insurance, why it needs to be more widely available as well as effective (i.e., cover overwhelming costs). Your rebuttal makes no sense whatsoever.

And outrage against rightwingers is never wasted - since they are are impervious to any ideas except what they want to hear, it bounces right back! It's warming up in my pocket as I write this.

Posted on: 2014/1/24 22:02

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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I guess ObamaCare is not the worst..... anymore. GOP climbing onboard?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/p ... nce-to-obamacare/?hpid=z2

Posted on: 2014/1/24 21:14

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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Quote:

MDM wrote:
It's simple.

When governments offer health care to its citizens, they are in an incredibly strong position to negotiate rates with hospitals, doctors, labs, pharmaceuticals and so forth.

Three problems with that.

First, it is not enough to claim that it is in a "strong position". One should claim it is stronger, than any consumer has.

Second, it is just a theory, unsupported by any evidence. In fact, every time someone tries to pay cash and starts looking for a cheaper solution, they find something for much, MUCH less than what an insurance would have paid. Also, in all non-regulated areas of the market, consumers are able to drive prices down to very low profit margins.

Third, while that argument doesn't hold much water when we talk about private insurance, remember that private insurance at the very least has huge incentive to drive the costs down, while the government does not.

If you don't think so, allow me to remind you about healthcare.gov - how much did it cost? 600 million dollars and counting? 10 years ago one could have been The Major Google investor for like tens of millions. 13 years in the XXI century, 6 years in the iPhone era, - to pay 600 millions for a piece that would have been considered total junk in 1999?

Some strong position that is!

Posted on: 2014/1/22 17:41

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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Quote:

Wishful_Thinking wrote:
Quote:
borisp wrote:
Quote:
CdeCoincy wrote:
What's your fallback stategy if you incur overwhelming bills?

I do not plan to incur those. I plan to pay my own way. Of course, if something happens that I failed to foresee, I will first sell everything that I have, - and then I will ask for help. I will definitely not force others to pay for me.

In a nutshell, the attitude that necessitates government intervention in health care in the first place... you don't plan to incurr catastrophic medical expenses - are you [censored] kidding me?!

The comment that you chose to respond to, was not talking about "catastrophic medical expenses". It was about "overwhelming bills". These are not the same. It may not be possible to prevent "catastrophic medical expenses", but it is quite possible to make sure they are not overwhelming. For example, one can buy a so called "insurance".

See?

If only you read it carefully, you could have saved yourself one perfectly good outrage, - and now it is wasted.

Posted on: 2014/1/22 17:01

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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It's simple.

When governments offer health care to its citizens, they are in an incredibly strong position to negotiate rates with hospitals, doctors, labs, pharmaceuticals and so forth.

We already did this, starting about 14 years ago. In order to make vaccinations 'affordable' the federal government purchased a vast majority of the vaccines (Vaccines for Children Program). As they were basically the only customer, they dictated the price.

Now vaccines, which should be a wildly profitable mass market item became a marginal good. A majority of the vaccine manufacturers got out of the business. As a result we had vaccine shortages from 2000 going through today.

When I was planning a trip overseas, I had to be put on a long waiting list for a simple tetanus shot. My doctor was only able to locate one dose in all of Hudson county at JC Medical Center in the emergency room. After a couple of months of waiting, I was finally able to get the shot only a few days before leaving on my trip.

My other travel meds which the government didn't purchase were readily available (i.e. Larium, Typhoid).

Back in my wife's home country, there is a hospital that caters mainly to Europeans. The procedures are technically free back in Europe, but the waiting times can take years for something like a knee transplant. So the Euros travel to Asia and pay for it out of pocket.

You can ration products and services either with price or availability. When you do the former (i.e. government imposed monopoly) you will get shortages.

Posted on: 2014/1/22 16:21

dtjcview

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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Perhaps Obamacare isn't the way. But there does need to be a serious rethink on how we tackle social issues, given there are destined to be less opportunities, even in the land of opportunity.

http://motherboard.vice.com/blog/the- ... the-worlds-jobs-disappear

Quote:

Two hugely important statistics concerning the future of employment as we know it made waves recently:

1. 85 people alone command as much wealth as the poorest half of the world.

2. 47 percent of the world's currently existing jobs are likely to be automated over the next two decades.

Combined, those two stats portend a quickly-exacerbating dystopia. As more and more automated machinery (robots, if you like) are brought in to generate efficiency gains for companies, more and more jobs will be displaced, and more and more income will accumulate higher up the corporate ladder. The inequality gulf will widen as jobs grow permanently scarce?there are only so many service sector jobs to replace manufacturing ones as it is?and the latest wave of automation will hijack not just factory workers but accountants, telemarketers, and real estate agents.

That's according to a 2013 Oxford study, which was highlighted in this week's Economist cover story. That study attempted to tally up the number of jobs that were susceptible to automization, and, surprise, a huge number were. Creative and skilled jobs done by humans were the most secure?think pastors, editors, and dentists?but just about any rote task at all is now up for automation. Machinists, typists, even retail jobs, are predicted to disappear.

And, as is historically the case, the capitalists eat the benefits. The Economist explains:

The prosperity unleashed by the digital revolution has gone overwhelmingly to the owners of capital and the highest-skilled workers. Over the past three decades, labour?s share of output has shrunk globally from 64% to 59%. Meanwhile, the share of income going to the top 1% in America has risen from around 9% in the 1970s to 22% today. Unemployment is at alarming levels in much of the rich world, and not just for cyclical reasons. In 2000, 65% of working-age Americans were in work; since then the proportion has fallen, during good years as well as bad, to the current level of 59%.

Those trends aren't just occurring in the US, either. That second stat up there is from an Oxfam report entitled Working for the Few, just out this week. It was launched in tandem with the beginning of the World Economic Forum in Davos, in an effort to get the gazillionaires attending it to consider the gravity of their wealth. It finds that "those richest 85 people across the globe share a combined wealth of ?1 [trillion], as much as the poorest 3.5 billion of the world's population." Yes, you read that correctly: The 85 richest people have $1.64 trillion between them, the same amount of money as 3.5 billion of the world's less fortunate souls.

The trend extends beyond a few handfuls of the planet's most mega-tycoons, of course: "The wealth of the 1% richest people in the world amounts to $110tn (?60.88tn), or 65 times as much as the poorest half of the world." And they and their corporations are building robots that will have the net effect of letting them keep even more of that capital concentrated in their hands.

As the Economist piece notes, there's typically a disruptive cycle when new technologies displace old ones, and replace old jobs with new ones. But this time, that cycle is one-sided?so far, there are a lot fewer jobs being created in the new information-based economy than the old manufacturing-based one: Last year, Google, Apple, Amazon, and Facebook were worth over $1 trillion combined, but employed just 150,000 people.

All of this points towards an uncomfortable prospect: in our globalizing, technologically advanced, and inequality-laden world, we risk becoming the cyber-peasants tending (or loitering on, more likely) the feudal lawn of the machine-owning rich. Oxfam predicts incoming class struggles and social strife, and it's not hard to see why?to ensure that the 99 percent of tomorrow benefit from still-accelerating technology, we're going to have to push for policy adjustments that adapt to our mechanized world. Radical income redistribution is probably in order, even a minimum guaranteed income; ideas unlikely to prove popular to the corporate titans used to reaping outsized rewards.

We already have the agricultural, energy, and consumer technology necessary to recalibrate the world's income scheme and resource distribution to make it more equitable. So as the rich and their robots start vacuuming up the world's jobs, it's social innovation we need now, far more than any technological gain.

Posted on: 2014/1/22 14:00

Dolomiti

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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Quote:

borisp wrote:Oops. There were no insurance companies before Obamacare and nobody sold insurance?

Before the ACA went into effect, individual insurance was very expensive, and hard to get. Insurers would routinely refuse to cover individuals or medical issues based on "pre-existing conditions."

Quote:

As soon as the government gets involved in some industry, - immediately some people declare that this industry exists only because the government is in it.

No one is saying that about health insurance.

Quote:

Like science, or education, or art.

There is really no question that public involvement dramatically expanded the number of people who got an education, or that government funding has been critical for the sciences.

Quote:

I do not see how the logic works.

It's simple.

When governments offer health care to its citizens, they are in an incredibly strong position to negotiate rates with hospitals, doctors, labs, pharmaceuticals and so forth.

E.g. why are drugs cheaper in Canada? The medicines are identical, and the costs are no different. It's because the Canadian government negotiates the prices down.

In addition, health care is not a normal market, and treating it that way results in all sorts of distortions. Insurers don't care about covering their ratepayers, they care about profits -- so they do everything they can not to pay out or to cover people who rely more on insurance. Hospitals don't set the rates for procedures based on costs; they have to negotiate rates for every procedure, test and medication with insurers, so the rates are actually just a starting point with insurers... and if you don't have insurance, you get slammed with the "full" price. And so on.

The result? The US spends more than twice the GDP per capita on health care than the rest of the OECD, and overall doesn't offer better care.

The "free market" system does a very good job with some goods and services. Health care is not one of them.

The ACA isn't a great fix... because it is ultimately a right-wing free-market fix. The idea is to prevent people from getting the benefits of insurance without paying into it first (what Romney calls the "personal responsibility principle.") It tries to preserve the status quo, including the inefficient insurers, the "chargemaster" rates at hospitals, the incentives to make more new erectile dysfunction pills than new antibiotics and so forth.

But at least someone who is in their 30s can be a freelancer and get coverage.

Posted on: 2014/1/22 3:28

Adonis

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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Quote:

CdeCoincy wrote:
Quote:

MDM wrote:
Quote:

trambone wrote:
For a so called christian nation as some in both parties have said, not wanting to help care for your fellow citizens would probably have really upset Jesus.

Maybe this country is way more amoral then we think we are.

Lets see... a small sample of programs designed to 'help'.
WIC
SNAP
Medicade
Section 8
Head Start
Homeless Assistance Grants
.

Let's add:
Deducting mortgage interest and real estate taxes to keep the cost of housing affordable for the middle class

Tax abatements for housing that will be occupied by the rich to lower their housing costs

Charitable deductions that allow money that would go to the Treasury to go to support personal agendas

Depreciation of residential real estate investments that actually gets more valuable over time

Any idea who really is the beneficiary of Government largesse?

You forgot to mention AMT which negates much of those benefits. Have you ever heard of AMT much less had to pay it? Probably not.

Posted on: 2014/1/22 2:56

CdeCoincy

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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Quote:

MDM wrote:
Quote:

trambone wrote:
For a so called christian nation as some in both parties have said, not wanting to help care for your fellow citizens would probably have really upset Jesus.

Maybe this country is way more amoral then we think we are.

Lets see... a small sample of programs designed to 'help'.
WIC
SNAP
Medicade
Section 8
Head Start
Homeless Assistance Grants
.

Let's add:
Deducting mortgage interest and real estate taxes to keep the cost of housing affordable for the middle class

Tax abatements for housing that will be occupied by the rich to lower their housing costs

Charitable deductions that allow money that would go to the Treasury to go to support personal agendas

Depreciation of residential real estate investments that actually gets more valuable over time

Any idea who really is the beneficiary of Government largesse?

Posted on: 2014/1/21 23:04

Adonis

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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Quote:

MDM wrote:
Quote:

trambone wrote:
For a so called christian nation as some in both parties have said, not wanting to help care for your fellow citizens would probably have really upset Jesus.

Maybe this country is way more amoral then we think we are.

Lets see... a small sample of programs designed to 'help'.
WIC
SNAP
Medicade
Section 8
Head Start
Homeless Assistance Grants

Since the mid 1960's, we have spent on the order $15 trillion (2011 dollars), which excludes Social Security and Medicare. Yet, today our social dysfunctions have gotten worse.. not better.

Government does a few things fairly well: Building and fixing roads, bridges, sewers, organizing regular trash collection, courts (enforcement of contracts, tort law, law enforcement, etc.).

What government doesn't do well is fix broken people. In the name of caring for the poor, we have turned generations of people into serfs.. stuck forever on the government teat.

We are running out of money and time. All this is going to end for you will run out of people who are capable of paying the bills.

As for Jesus: ?For the poor are always with you, and whenever you wish, you can do good for them, but I am not always with you.

Amen to that.

Posted on: 2014/1/21 22:54

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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Quote:

trambone wrote:
For a so called christian nation as some in both parties have said, not wanting to help care for your fellow citizens would probably have really upset Jesus.

Maybe this country is way more amoral then we think we are.

Lets see... a small sample of programs designed to 'help'.
WIC
SNAP
Medicade
Section 8
Head Start
Homeless Assistance Grants

Since the mid 1960's, we have spent on the order $15 trillion (2011 dollars), which excludes Social Security and Medicare. Yet, today our social dysfunctions have gotten worse.. not better.

Government does a few things fairly well: Building and fixing roads, bridges, sewers, organizing regular trash collection, courts (enforcement of contracts, tort law, law enforcement, etc.).

What government doesn't do well is fix broken people. In the name of caring for the poor, we have turned generations of people into serfs.. stuck forever on the government teat.

We are running out of money and time. All this is going to end for you will run out of people who are capable of paying the bills.

As for Jesus: ?For the poor are always with you, and whenever you wish, you can do good for them, but I am not always with you.

Posted on: 2014/1/21 22:40

Garage

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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I didn't know we were a Christain nation....did I miss the memo?

I'm all for helping my fellow man....I don't think I should have to refi my house to pay for health care increases.

Posted on: 2014/1/21 22:24

trambone

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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Well since we broke one half of the golden rule of the internet by talking about politics I'll bring in the other half, religion. For a so called christian nation as some in both parties have said, not wanting to help care for your fellow citizens would probably have really upset Jesus.

Maybe this country is way more amoral then we think we are.

Posted on: 2014/1/21 20:22

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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ACA has made catastrophic coverage more expensive:

From Thinkadviser.com from an article back in 2012:
(emphasis is mine)

Because of this, many HDHPs will be required to provide higher reimbursement rates beginning in 2014?meaning that the plans will offer lower deductibles with correspondingly higher premiums, thereby eliminating much of the benefit that an individual can realize by using an HSA in conjunction with the HDHP.

The PPACA?s 80/20 rule provides a further disincentive for HDHPs to offer very low premiums because the rule requires that at least 80% of premiums collected in any given state be paid as benefits, or the insurance company must refund the difference. Some HDHPs charge premiums so low that their fixed administrative costs eat up a larger percentage of these premiums, thus causing them to run afoul of the 80/20 rule.

For example, if an insurance plan collects $500,000 a month in insurance premiums in Florida and the corresponding administrative costs are $100,000, then $400,000 a month?or 80 percent?of the premiums are paid in benefits and the plan remains within the limits of the 80/20 rule. A HDHP that collects monthly premiums of, say, $300,000 in Florida with the same administrative costs will violate the 80/20 rule because the administrative costs represent more than 20 percent of the $300,000 in premiums collected within the state. The insurer will then be required to refund the difference to Florida policyholders, eliminating much of the incentive for offering low premiums in the first place.

Posted on: 2014/1/21 19:37

Wishful_Thinking

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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Quote:

borisp wrote:
Quote:
CdeCoincy wrote:
What's your fallback stategy if you incur overwhelming bills?

I do not plan to incur those. I plan to pay my own way. Of course, if something happens that I failed to foresee, I will first sell everything that I have, - and then I will ask for help. I will definitely not force others to pay for me.

In a nutshell, the attitude that necessitates government intervention in health care in the first place... you don't plan to incurr catastrophic medical expenses - are you [censored] kidding me?! Depending on which study you read, 17% (Kellogg School of Management, 2006) to 62% (Harvard, 2007) of all bankruptcies in the US are the result of medical expenses. This is not a matter of people expecting to be taken care of, this is a serious public policy matter that contributes to poverty among surviving spouses, children and the elderly, over-burdening emergency rooms, loss of productivity in business, etc. I can't believe you would offer such a ludicrous justification for disabling the ACA.

Posted on: 2014/1/21 19:12

Garage

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

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2014/4/6 23:53

From Jersey City

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what the insurance companies call catastrophic is still over $1300 a month. Thank you for the advise though.

Posted on: 2014/1/20 23:13

Pebble

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

#58

Home away from home

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2013/3/29 21:43
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2023/9/5 18:27

From Bergen Hill

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Quote:

Garage wrote:
Blue Cross/ Blue Shield silver family plan , which I am currently paying $1075 , will be approx $1650 plus a month. I am not sure if it will allow us to see Drs. in NYC. Still shopping around.

That comes to $19,800 annually. and then we have co-pays,
dental, ortho, prescription and a high deductable ....if we require a hospital stay thats another $6000. I project 2014 health care to cost my family at least 25k.

This is not afforable this is a worse policy than what I had...

I mentioned before the use of disaster coverage. Do a quick calculation on what the cost is per month. Then you have the deductible that you would need to reach. For a family, it?s usually about $2k. Then for the next $10k of bills you pay 10%, or $1k. You then double down on this by using an HSA account (pre-taxed contributions to a savings account that earns interest). That HSA money then goes towards paying the cost of a doctor visit. Early on, the costs are higher. However, once you hit that deductible number, all expenses are paid. The overall yearly cost is often much lower.

My numbers for a family could be off. I honestly don?t know. But with a family, doctor visits are likely to be quite regular. To me, that means lots of bills over the year. If you count up all of those trips last year, calculate the deductibles you were paying, along with prescriptions, and along with the cost of the insurance, you might be able to see one plan being better for you.

Posted on: 2014/1/20 14:54

Dos A Cero

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

#57

Home away from home

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2010/7/9 11:16
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10/30 16:49

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A previous poster mentioned that they thought they couldn't get insurance because of a pre-existing condition:

NJ has been a guaranteed issue and community rating state for many, many years. The former means you can't be turned down with a pre-existing condition. The latter means you have to charge everyone the same rates. Though NJ losened up on the community rating by at least allowing younger people to be charged less and allowing very basic coverage plans (now banned under ACA).

Both of these items destroyed the individual health insurance market for young people. In my late 20's, I tried to see if I could get my own insurance. In NJ I was looking at $600+ a month for a non-catastrophic plan, which was a good part of my take-home pay (didn't make that much back then).

In PA, a catastrophic plan would have cost me between $90 to $125 a month. However, I would have to go through a health screening first. I really thought about moving....

Posted on: 2014/1/19 3:55

Garage

Re: Obamacare...creating more working poor.

#56

Not too shy to talk

Joined:
2013/9/28 20:31
Last Login :
2014/4/6 23:53

From Jersey City

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Posts: 33

show me a silver plan I can sign up for $963 a month and I'll pay your insurance for for a year....I would love to be wrong!

There are policies for $1400-$1500 a month but they would require my wife to get new DR.. and they would prevent us from using NYC hospitals.

2 adults early fifties
2 kids

Posted on: 2014/1/19 3:48