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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Home away from home
 
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"The market" that economics classes teach you about is right by definition. It's an observation about human behavior.
Posted on: 2009/7/31 0:42
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Home away from home
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here is your econ 102 .....
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essentially, the banks own the regional reserves. in exchange, the federal reserve regulates those banks that own the 13 federal reserve banks. at top of this is board of governors. it is independent of all the government branches. one would argue that it is a privately held fourth branch of the government with the objective of managing monetary policy - the lubricant of the free market system. there are two broad policy approaches how central banks should relate to the executive or political branch. the us espouses the independent approach, where the executive branch does not have a direct influence in the policies of the central bank - the federal reserve. it is not a government agency, not a government organization, and it is not a separate department within the executive branch. what is so unique to the fed is that it is not responsible to the white house or congress. fed officials cannot be firedm they are only confirmed. although, the fed informs the white house and congress, it is providing information, not reporting on its activities under oversight. this is a huge difference. the other approach is the australian approach, where the central bank is a reserve bank serving under the executive power and where the executive power does in fact influence the policies of the central bank. there the reserve bank is a government agency with direct repsonsability to the government. if the government does not like the way the central bank conducts its policies, the head of the bank can be fired by the government. so, structurally, the fed is independent of the white house. since it has the power of printing money, organizing the payments system, and executing monetary policy by buying and selling government securities, it makes a boatload of money. thus, it is not dependent on taxpayer funds. in reality, the line between the white house, treasury, and the fed is blurred. but the fact is that the treasury is an agency of the united states government, but the fed is independent.
Posted on: 2009/7/31 0:35
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Home away from home
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anchovial,
The market is not always right. But that doesn't mean the government is right. When the market isn't right, those businesses should fail, not be propped up at our expense.
Posted on: 2009/7/31 0:11
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Just can't stay away
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And here come the subpoenas...
Google cached link to avoid the WSJ paywall: http://74.125.93.132/search?hl=en&q=c ... 691729.html&aq=f&oq=&aqi=
Posted on: 2009/7/30 2:19
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Just can't stay away
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Close but not quite. It's a government institution "independent within the government." Yes, it's complicated and Eco 101 doesn't cover it.
Posted on: 2009/7/29 21:50
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Home away from home
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I see things have NOT changed sinced ECO 1.
From the federalreserve.gov website: Quote: Why did Congress want the Federal Reserve to be relatively independent? "Self-financed and independent of other branches and agencies of government" and "not subject to congressional budgetary process" sounds pretty private to me. Just because it is called "the FED" has no bearing on the subject except to kid the easily kiddable. They act in the interests of banks and bankers and will continue to do exactly that until Congress passes a law requiring them to do otherwise. If Freddie and Fannie are public, private or a hybrid has NO bearing on the issue. If Congress had intended a PUBLIC entity it would have been called THE BANK OF THE UNITED STATES.
Posted on: 2009/7/29 13:38
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Just can't stay away
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You didn't really make a point. Let me guess, the market is always right?
Posted on: 2009/7/29 4:20
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Home away from home
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i thought the Goldman Sachs building was vacated by its Goldman Sux employees for NYC ....again.
Posted on: 2009/7/29 3:32
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Home away from home
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Point is that we need less hybrids, not more.
Posted on: 2009/7/29 3:29
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Just can't stay away
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Private - Lehman, Bear Stearns
Public - FEMA, SEC, Congress They've all fail failed here, so what's your point? And plenty more of both have obviously succeeded. The Fed is a very different hybrid than Fannie and Freddie. As all depositories have the backing of the FDIC and even investment banks have shown to be fully protected by the government, they are essentially all hybrid. You can throw GM and Crysler in there as well.
Posted on: 2009/7/29 1:21
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Home away from home
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The Fed is a hybrid - just like Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac... how did that work out?
Posted on: 2009/7/29 0:49
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Just can't stay away
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The Fed is a hybrid. It has a presidentially appointed Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System, The FOMC and 12 regional privately-owned, Federal Reserve Banks
Posted on: 2009/7/28 15:35
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Home away from home
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Hey but I hear some of them are good dancers!
Click link below for other jclist thread: http://jclist.com/modules/newbb/viewt ... t_id=85875#forumpost85875  You can just watch this video to get up on the conspiracy theories about GS http://www.rollingstone.com/videos/player/28915225 Here is the article that got people blogging http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/ ... t_american_bubble_machine http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/ ... ican_bubble_machine/print Here is New York Magazine's 8 page take on this: http://nymag.com/news/business/58094/ And of course Huffington Post's (something is evil about this site it freezes my browser - talk about Data Mining) http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/07 ... in-new-york_n_245480.html As for the building I like it -- if you don't just be happy it isn't a matched set like Pelli's other project - the Petronas Twin Towers. I just hope Goldman builds another tower across the Hudson and offers free ferry service "off peak" to us peons.  Here is info on Pelli: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C%C3%A9sar_Pelli
Posted on: 2009/7/28 13:23
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Home away from home
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This isn't true... The Federal Reserve was created via the Federal Reserve Act (circa 1913 and amended a few times since) and its chairman is appointed by the president and confirmed by congress. Whether they have too much power is another issue, but they are certainly not private - perhaps by private you meant they are unelected, which is certainly true.
Posted on: 2009/7/27 1:14
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Home away from home
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You can follow these stories on www.zero-hedge.com (or: http://zerohedge.blogspot.com/). The High-Frequency Trading / Algorithmic Trading developing story is an interesting one. It can get very technical but the jist of the story is that certain firms with ultra-fast computers which are co-located at trading centers (i.e. physically placing your server mere feet from the NY Stock Exchange servers) can submit buy/sell orders at such a fast rate that they can front-run individual or institutional investors and basically take a few pennies from millions of transactions every day. But that's just the tip of the iceberg, there's plenty of other interesting issues / conflicts created by high-frequency / algorithmic trading. They (zero-hedge) also train a very critical eye towards CNBC and their many conflicts of interest. There's actually a fairly funny clip that they posted a few weeks ago of 2 talking heads on CNBC (perhaps Joe Kernan & Carl Quintonia(sp?)) discussing Charles Schwab's latest earnings talking up the stock, saying every investor should have some in their portfolio, etc etc and then as they wrapped up they go to commercial and it's a 30-second ad for Schwab. This course says nothing of their parent company being GE...No conflict there... . . . I have no real issue with the GS building itself... What I DO have an issue with is GS employees running red lights on Hudson & Morris and running red lights on Essex & Greene St. I also have an issue with them driving 50mph down Greene street trying to get out of Jersey city...
Posted on: 2009/7/27 1:08
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Yes, a small conflict of interest...a half billion to one man. Gee, won't ANYONE ever offer me a bribe like that!
 Remember though, the FED is PRIVATE, not governmental, or that's what I remember from my ECO classes...not quite sure I believed it even then. Perhaps making it LESS private will advance the interests of society rather than retarding them in the interests of the Hank Paulsons of the country.
Posted on: 2009/7/26 19:53
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Xerxes,
Think there may be a small conflict of interest there? :) This is why the Fed needs less centalized power over our economy, not more. Goldman could only take advantage of us with the Fed's support.
Posted on: 2009/7/25 16:15
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Home away from home
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Let's see, I'm Treasury Secretery and that BILLION in GS stock that I own from when I was CEO a couple years ago is now only worth a HALF billion. WHat can I do? I could start by forcing the bankruptcy of GS' major competitor and then I can GIVE $20 billion (or $100 billion depending on where the AIG moeny went) to Goldman.
I guess nobody will notice that my stock portfolio has increased in value...sheer coincidence. Give me $20 billion and pay off all my debts and I'll bet I can declare a $3 billion profit every year for at least 7 years! I wouldn't even need a storefront or employees! How did the nation ever survive Hank Paulson? Or indeed, DID IT? Yep, GOldman and it's revolviing door with the top of the government is a blight even worse than the same deal with military providers and the Pentagram!
Posted on: 2009/7/25 13:28
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Newbie
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It is no coincidence that GS employees gave $2MM to Obama and the gov't has annointed them as untouchable.
Remember you can thank Corzine for bringing GS public in 1998. As a result, all the partners left, started hedge funds with their $50MM + payout, and drove the credit derivative market nutz. Unless Taibbi worked in finance his understanding will be completely based from other people's assessments and he doesn't have any idea what they told him. It will be crap coming from his trap and I like to tap the bottle while I trist the cap so sit in my lap and don't give meno flap
Posted on: 2009/7/25 1:40
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Newbie
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No. Krugman generally knows what he is talking about. Taibbi clearly does not. I don't always agree with Krugman but I respect his views
Krugman has yet to join the real world. An "economist" hiding in academia is as about as useful as a Non-smoking section outdoors at the Beer Garden
Posted on: 2009/7/25 1:28
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Home away from home
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Posted on: 2009/7/21 14:42
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Home away from home
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Carlyle had one fund that they walked away from. One relatively insignificant fund. They are far from out of business. Whether or not they are or were, though, misses the point. It's just like Cerberus - Dan Quayle, John Snow, et al. The idea that you can hop from bank to cabinet to bank like so many beds is kind of sickening, no? If it's not, maybe you should have someone explain it to you.
GS made a gazillion bad bets. It just got treasury to cover them via the AIG bailout - 1 dollar on the dollar. Not knowing how weak your counterparty is is as indefensible as making an outright crap bet. That's why GS and all the others have many, many people performing "counterparty credit" analysis. Or supposed to be. Quote:
Posted on: 2009/7/21 0:59
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Home away from home
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well if you understand the english language you would see half the thread was bickering over which analyst is better/worse, which had nothing to do with gs and why i replied.
and only a fool doesnt believe in tech/quants, all those value investors sure did wonders in the last 2 years... but you are right this is not the place to discuss this. Quote:
Posted on: 2009/7/21 0:57
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Just can't stay away
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Don't kid yourself. Without the government bailout, they would have been completely screwed as well.
And Carlyle is on the ropes but still very much in business.
Posted on: 2009/7/21 0:48
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Not too shy to talk
 
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GS is successful because they didn't make nearly as many bad bets as say, LEHMAN BROTHERS AND BEAR STEARNS.
Carlyle group, last time I checked, went under.
Posted on: 2009/7/21 0:21
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Home away from home
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Not at all - just tired of listening to the half-assed drivel. Nothing you said was anything but warmed-over jargon. On top of that, it was entirely out of context - which leaves one with the impression that you probably not only don't understand the markets, but perhaps the english language as well. The whole point of the thread is Goldman's very unique position within the markets and its perhaps too close relationship with the government.
JCList is not exactly the first place I go to for investment advice, nor is CNBC. But CNBC is one of those places that gets all juiced up about "technicals".... Just sayin'
Posted on: 2009/7/20 23:44
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Just can't stay away
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That would be a "yes".
Posted on: 2009/7/20 22:11
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Home away from home
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heh did i hit a nerve? keep following cnbc and those analysts, i am sure you will make millions in no time....
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Posted on: 2009/7/20 21:18
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Home away from home
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Wibbit -by "technicals" do you mean head and shoulder and other "the trend is your friend nonsense"? If you are going to throw around jargon, make sure it at least sounds knowledgeable.
Stick to hitting up people in every condo development for every piece of info you can scrounge so you can make your "informed decision". (Are you really buying or just talking?)
Posted on: 2009/7/20 20:49
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Re: Not only the building is ugly. So is the company. Goldman Sachs.
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Just can't stay away
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Did you just wake up from some debate you were having about a decade ago? Thanks for playing wibbit. Have some Rice A Roni.
Posted on: 2009/7/20 20:24
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