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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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JSleeze wrote:
These issues are incredibly complex and are going to require a lot more thought than it takes to jam a massive tax break through congress in days just so you can appease your donors and have a "win". They won't be solved by one "team" "winning" in this endless political super bowl we seem to be engaged in.


I heard an amazing point from Megan McArdle of Bloomberg on Econtalk, one of the best podcasts out there:

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America is like a marriage. It's like a marriage in a country with no divorce. You cannot win a marriage. You can only win something that ends before you do. And so, you can't just beat the other 50% of the population. They are here. You've got to figure out a way to live with them. If we want, we can have a bad marriage. There were lots of them around before divorce was legal. There are still some around now. We can have a terrible marriage where we scream at each other and we are bitter; we say nasty things to each other all the time. But you don't win that. You lose that. You lose that. Because, now you are in a miserable marriage. And the other person has just as much power to hurt you as you have to hurt them. And that is, I think, in a lot of ways the lesson of Trump--is that people--and you know, you can also say the lesson of gay marriage, where social conservatives turned around and said, 'Why is everyone beating me up?' and, like, 'Well, these people felt like you were beating them up for a long time, that's why.'


http://www.econtalk.org/archives/2017/10/megan_mcardle_o.html

Posted on: 12/14 12:32
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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Sensible reform is always welcome, but simply doing away with chain migration is ridiculous. The 'best and brightest' may not even want to come here if they can't bring their family over. My point is to not make bizarre conclusions because one jackass decided to terrorize subway riders. Politics has nothing to do with it, it is pure math.

As for changes to chain migration, sure. After going through all the background checks, the legal fees, etc. It would be nice to have less wait time. Some people wait decades. The system is capped yearly so lengthy waits are unavoidable but 20+ years? That's crazy.

Posted on: 12/14 12:12
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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It's interesting to watch people of opposite political views go at each other without trying to see the other side so we can solve the problem. Chain migration was done with little oversight or focus on the mindset of the "family member" being granted the privilege of entry into the US. This needs to be done much more carefully.

But I also get the desire to have family members who want to come to the US to be with other family members to experience the American opportunities (freedom and protection from oppression). There is a way to balance these two ideologies. Open borders and Globalization is a recipe for total disaster. So is unchecked chain migration.

We pay a ton of money (billions a year) to government officials so they can figure out a way to make this work while keeping Americans as safe as possible. Lets get them to do their job and stop the partisan trash talk.

Posted on: 12/14 8:52
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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drifterx wrote:
Yeah, and discussing with insults and general lack of facts to back up your policies, let alone some statistical numbers is what? More like your kind of game? Not sure what conservatives are nowadays but they used to be smarter and more rational.

Nobody is justifying a crime here. I didn't cite illegal immigration out of thin air. It's a fact that it exists because the market exists. You want to bury your head in the sand, do it at your own thread. Let me know what is really wrong with chain immigration and why the work of one criminal suddenly invalidates decades of accepted practices where millions of productive lives have been brought into this country. Keep talking about your tribal nonsense as if that has any bearing to the facts.


Exactly. The fact that Stillinjc has excited heights tells you all you need to know about their argument. These issues are incredibly complex and are going to require a lot more thought than it takes to jam a massive tax break through congress in days just so you can appease your donors and have a "win". They won't be solved by one "team" "winning" in this endless political super bowl we seem to be engaged in.

I'll even agree with part of Monroe's point - there do need to be limits on immigration. However, unless we are willing to start paying triple for our groceries, it is unrealistic to think you can just shut off well-established labor flows. Jargon and selective imagery is great for political rallies. Governing is much more difficult and requires thoughtful consideration.

Posted on: 12/13 15:14
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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Discussing this matter with deluded liberals is pointless. They will support illegal and chain immigration even as pipe bombs explode up their asses. Same with European idiots - they are getting mowed down and still support uncontrolled immigration.

I agree with you 100%, well stated !

Posted on: 12/13 9:56
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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Yeah, and discussing with insults and general lack of facts to back up your policies, let alone some statistical numbers is what? More like your kind of game? Not sure what conservatives are nowadays but they used to be smarter and more rational.

Nobody is justifying a crime here. I didn't cite illegal immigration out of thin air. It's a fact that it exists because the market exists. You want to bury your head in the sand, do it at your own thread. Let me know what is really wrong with chain immigration and why the work of one criminal suddenly invalidates decades of accepted practices where millions of productive lives have been brought into this country. Keep talking about your tribal nonsense as if that has any bearing to the facts.

Posted on: 12/12 23:18
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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Discussing this matter with deluded liberals is pointless. They will support illegal and chain immigration even as pipe bombs explode up their asses. Same with European idiots - they are getting mowed down and still support uncontrolled immigration.

Posted on: 12/12 23:12
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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We must admit we need limits and security re:immigration. Given that we can only assimilate X number of people lets insist on the best and the brightest, not another failed livery cab driver like the Bangladeshi subway bomber.


And as I have said, if 'we' ever did that, Donald Trump wouldn't even exist. A comforting thought but unrealistic. There is no one criteria for 'best and the brightest' and when it comes to realistic needs, we won't always have a need for those. More than ever, farmers have need for low skill labor. Do you plan on leaving your job to fill that void? I don't think so. There is a reason there is a market for illegal immigration in this country and it's not because we have a desperate need for the 'best and brightest.'

And here's the kicker. The vast majority of countries that chain migrants come from aren't from areas where jihadis live. Hell they're not even Muslim. Talk about a dumb knee jerk reaction.

Posted on: 12/12 22:46
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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psyop wrote:
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heights wrote:
This is what happens when we continue not to scrutinize those who come in.


What do we about the a**holes born here that do the same thing genius?

What's your point, do you feel better with imported terrorism ? This topic is about the recent Nyc underground bombing. Plus we have better control blocking the overseas criminals then the domestic ones. We have to start somewhere especially when they standout. You just have to look for the tell-tale signs.


Terrorism sucks and I hate it regardless of who is responsible.
You have a history of racist comments so I'm just calling your bullshit.

Posted on: 12/12 21:56

Edited by psyop on 2017/12/12 22:14:52
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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heights wrote:
This is what happens when we continue not to scrutinize those who come in.


What do we about the a**holes born here that do the same thing genius?

What's your point, do you feel better with imported terrorism ? This topic is about the recent Nyc underground bombing. Plus we have better control blocking the overseas criminals then the domestic ones. We have to start somewhere especially when they standout. You just have to look for the tell-tale signs.

Posted on: 12/12 19:26
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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We must admit we need limits and security re:immigration. Given that we can only assimilate X number of people lets insist on the best and the brightest, not another failed livery cab driver like the Bangladeshi subway bomber.

Posted on: 12/12 14:19
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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Destroyed because one out of 23 people ended up being a criminal? Hyperbole much? So what happens to the other 22 who happen to be non criminals and are otherwise leading quiet and productive lives? We know that in everything we do here in America, just like with legal immigration, there will be some bad apples. That doesn't mean Law Enforcement with a few dirty cops is suddenly destroying America. Or maybe it is, and you are just picking and choosing what suits your politics. I like to think that America is much stronger than the weak dumpster-fire that you and Trump like to portray.

Just for shits, why don't you tell me when the USA didn't have chain immigration and tell us just how lovely and so much greater it is to now? Because that's what you want right? Eliminate chain immigration?


Even pointing out that the other 22 of 23 "chain" immigrants aren't criminals misses the point. Think in terms of the millions upon millions who have entered the country through this process - millions of productive people who helped build and grow the country. The miniscule number of people who are used as examples to support all sorts of draconian policies are statistically insignificant relative to the total population of "chain" immigrants.

Don't get dragged into selective and half-witted "whataboutism" arguments. It's just a deflection one uses when they have nothing of substance to support their misguided position.

Posted on: 12/12 14:05
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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Let me just add that, in place of chain migration, you sobs want a solely merit based migration? Ok, fine. Lets apply that to Mary Anne MacLeod. She's a migrant from Scotland with and 8th grade education. She wants to enter the US as a maid. I think she fails the merit test with such low prospects and more of a possible drain to the economy, right? While as tempting a prospect that would be for Trump haters, we wouldn't be the country we are now if such a system was in place decades ago. And yes, they were are more lax back then compared to now. Mary would have a hard time and a much longer wait with the current system. She may just miss out on Fred.

Posted on: 12/12 14:02
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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Destroyed because one out of 23 people ended up being a criminal? Hyperbole much? So what happens to the other 22 who happen to be non criminals and are otherwise leading quiet and productive lives? We know that in everything we do here in America, just like with legal immigration, there will be some bad apples. That doesn't mean Law Enforcement with a few dirty cops is suddenly destroying America. Or maybe it is, and you are just picking and choosing what suits your politics. I like to think that America is much stronger than the weak dumpster-fire that you and Trump like to portray.

Just for shits, why don't you tell me when the USA didn't have chain immigration and tell us just how lovely and so much greater it is to now? Because that's what you want right? Eliminate chain immigration?

Posted on: 12/12 13:26
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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Far too strict? The NYC bike path murderer was one of 23 brought in from the original 'lottery' winner. You must really want to see our country destroyed.

Posted on: 12/12 12:56
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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Spot on for what? Being an idiot as usual? Chain immigration has its problems, namely, it is already far too strict and lengthy process. Gone are the days when Italians can bring mama to the States before she croaked.

Lets focus on the crime here which is domestic terrorism. The guy has been here since 2011. So unless the FBI can prove the guy was some genius ISIS agent who took his sweet ass time to blow himself up in comical fashion then the stringent process of screening chain migrants worked just fine. Is the guy on a watch list? Nope. Seems to me, the guy got radicalized here, for whatever stupid reason one has for blowing himself and innocent people in the process.

Compared to other much worse domestic terrorists we've had lately, this guy is a joke but since he's Muslim and an immigrant, let's talk about immigration policy. /smh So are we done talking about guns control yet after that massacre in Las Vegas? No?

Posted on: 12/12 12:13
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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Our President was talking about the dangers and downsides of chain migration just s few days ago at a rally. He's spot on.

Posted on: 12/12 8:37
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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For the a**holes that are born here, we lock them up and throw away the key if they are even thinking about something. For the ones outside this country we can vet them before they come in. We need to change our immigration policy similar to what Australia has. We need immigrants but we need immigrants that are going to help this country. Mostly we need immigrants that LOVE this country.

Posted on: 12/12 7:44
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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psyop wrote:
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stillinjc wrote:
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psyop wrote:
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heights wrote:
This is what happens when we continue not to scrutinize those who come in.


What do we about the a**holes born here that do the same thing genius?


Nothing, but at least you can keep the additional scum (and their future scum offspring) out, genius.


Cool thanks, glad to know. More angry homegrown killers in the US than from abroad though, thanks for trying.


It does not mean we should be adding more (by lottery no less - more like a Russian Roulette).

Posted on: 12/12 7:25
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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stillinjc wrote:
Quote:

psyop wrote:
Quote:

heights wrote:
This is what happens when we continue not to scrutinize those who come in.


What do we about the a**holes born here that do the same thing genius?


Nothing, but at least you can keep the additional scum (and their future scum offspring) out, genius.


Cool thanks, glad to know. More angry homegrown killers in the US than from abroad though, thanks for trying.

Posted on: 12/11 23:52
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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psyop wrote:
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heights wrote:
This is what happens when we continue not to scrutinize those who come in.


What do we about the a**holes born here that do the same thing genius?


Nothing, but at least you can keep the additional scum (and their future scum offspring) out, genius.

Posted on: 12/11 23:29
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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This is what happens when we continue not to scrutinize those who come in.


What do we about the a**holes born here that do the same thing genius?

Posted on: 12/11 23:18
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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This is what happens when we continue not to scrutinize those who come in.

Posted on: 12/11 21:35
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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That fool came to the US as a relative of another fool who won the visa lottery, a foolish concept if I ever saw one.

Posted on: 12/11 21:22
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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Do Mammies come from Mamhattan?

Posted on: 12/11 20:45
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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caj11 wrote:
Regarding the header on this thread, I read other news reports that said four other people (civilians) were injured and taken to hospitals.


This morning when I posted this - that was all that was being reported, however now on CNN...

"Other injuries were minor: Two victims at Mount Sinai West and one at Mount Sinai Queens are being treated for headaches and ringing in the ears."

http://www.cnn.com/2017/12/11/us/new- ... thority-subway/index.html

Posted on: 12/11 17:20
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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Regarding the header on this thread, I read other news reports that said four other people (civilians) were injured and taken to hospitals.

Posted on: 12/11 15:17
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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NY Post website has a picture of the fool laying on the ground looks like he had it strapped to his stomach. They also have a video of it going off in the pedestrian tunnel. It seems he is the only one that got injured... thank God.

Posted on: 12/11 9:53
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Re: Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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All sorts of delays on the PATH to WTC this morning due to PA police activity. Had a very time consuming commute in this morning.


Posted on: 12/11 9:26
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Pipe Bomb went off in Port Authority in Mamhattan - only bomber injuried
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MIDTOWN MANHATTAN, NY — Police have arrested a man in connection with an explosion inside the Port Authority Bus Terminal Monday morning, the NYPD said.
The explosion happened at about 7:30 a.m., police said. The station and the A, C and E subway lines were evacuated at the bus station, police said.
The suspect was carrying a pipe bomb in his backpack inside the terminal when it exploded unintentionally, a law enforcement source told Patch.
The suspect was injured and is in custody at Bellevue Hospital, the law enforcement source said. No one else was hurt, the NYPD said.
The 1, 2, 3, A, C, E, N, Q, R, W and 7 trains are skipping the 42nd Street stops this morning, the MTA said.
Gov. Andrew Cuomo is at the bus terminal and was briefed on the explosion, he said on Twitter. Mayor Bill de Blasio was also briefed on the situation.

Posted on: 12/11 9:10
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