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Re: Jersey City Council grants 20-year tax exemption for Downtown hotel
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Home away from home
 
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Tax abatement, err tax exemption.
What's that? What is an abatement or exemption? In this particular case, it is a lessening of or elimination of tax that this hotel would otherwise pay to the city over a twenty year period, right? So, somebody please help me out here. Because it seems to me that a 152 room hotel at 80 Columbus ought pay approximately $1,000,000 (one million) to $1,500,000 (one million five hundred thousand) per year in property tax to the city. At least this amount. Am I close? So then, a million dollars per year amounts to twenty million over twenty years. So, twenty million in lost tax revenue is what all the hub bub is about. But, there was talk of an 11 million dollar Payment In Lieu, so right there, we're down to 9 million. And there were other sweeteners as well, further mitigating the "give-away." Bottom line, in a city with 250,000 people, the amount paid by John Q. taxpayer for this abatement is negligible. The question in my mind is why are we allowing for another corporate entity to snake its way into the prime real estate zone. THIS will have lasting consequences. For a brief time, Jersey City was cool, but then came the capitalists, with their Marriots, and Westins and Hyatts. Who decided that this address -- 80 Columbus -- is fit for a corporate hotel entity? I'd rather a museum, concert hall or University building.
Posted on: 2014/10/24 2:35
Edited by score09 on 2014/10/24 2:57:49
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Re: Jersey City Council grants 20-year tax exemption for Downtown hotel
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Home away from home
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There is another thread on this issue. Basically the linked article said that there are some heavy political hitters backing this hotel. That might explain Fulop's actions...
Posted on: 2014/10/23 23:58
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Re: Jersey City Council grants 20-year tax exemption for Downtown hotel
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Home away from home
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I have to agree on this one. 10 years would have been more than enough. Mr Mayor you are loosing me on this one..
Posted on: 2014/10/23 23:34
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Re: Jersey City Council grants 20-year tax exemption for Downtown hotel
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Home away from home
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I do not think that a 20 year tax abatement for any commercial property on the list is well thought out. I can understand wanting to encourage hotel development downtown. Tourism money is money that comes in with little demand for expenditures in services. Still, to give a blanket exemption to commercial property, particularly in prime locations downtown, seems to be giving away too much.
Posted on: 2014/10/23 23:27
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Re: Jersey City Council grants 20-year tax exemption for Downtown hotel
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Home away from home
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Quote:
User fees
Posted on: 2014/10/23 22:16
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Re: Jersey City Council grants 20-year tax exemption for Downtown hotel
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Home away from home
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Quote:
Lots of fat to cut outside of those areas.
Posted on: 2014/10/23 21:54
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Re: Jersey City Council grants 20-year tax exemption for Downtown hotel
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Home away from home
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Quote:
If you give everyone an abatement how do you fund schools or the courts?
Posted on: 2014/10/23 21:51
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Re: Jersey City Council grants 20-year tax exemption for Downtown hotel
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Home away from home
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Good for the Marriott for negotiating a deal to get some of the government's burden off their backs. Amazing progress is made when that happens.
And, by the way, the solution is not to drag everyone down equally with the weight of taxes. It's to give everyone a permanent abatement, including residents, and then to cut the budget accordingly.
Posted on: 2014/10/23 21:47
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Re: Jersey City Council grants 20-year tax exemption for Downtown hotel
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Home away from home
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Quote:
http://www.crainsnewyork.com/article/ ... n-tax-proposal-nonstarter
Posted on: 2014/10/23 21:25
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Re: Jersey City Council grants 20-year tax exemption for Downtown hotel
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Home away from home
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This particular hotel has air rights to the PATH Grove Station, it has a cover passage to the trains. It is ridiculous to give an abatement. During Healy last two years as mayor, he gave downtown only 10 years and the rest of the city 15 years. The Kennedy Lofts in Journal Square received 12 years. Fulop is giving away the city with his 20 and 30 years abatement.
Posted on: 2014/10/23 18:36
Edited by Yvonne on 2014/10/23 19:05:27
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Jersey City Council grants 20-year tax exemption for Downtown hotel
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Home away from home
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Matthew Speiser | The Jersey Journal
Amid 45 minutes of debate, the Jersey City Council gave its final approval of a 20-year tax exemption for a 14-story hotel in Downtown Jersey City during last night's council meeting. The ordinance, which grants an abatement for a 152-room Marriott hotel to be built at 80 Columbus Drive, was passed by a 7-2 vote. Councilman Michael Yun and Councilwoman Candice Osborne voting against the abatement. "This is absolutely ridiculous," said Jersey City resident Yvonne Balcer. "It is appalling that I have to subsidize for a for-profit hotel, I wish you guys would just stop with your abatements." Council President Rolando R. Lavarro countered by saying that the $21 million dollar hotel would bring nearly a $11 million payment in lieu of taxes to the city, as well as $400,000 in annual estimated hotel taxes. The project will also provide 100 construction jobs and 40 permanent jobs, he said. "If (Mayor Steve) Fulop were still on the council, this would never happen," Balcer shot back. More
Posted on: 2014/10/23 17:58
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Re: Jersey City seeks 20-year tax break for hotel outside Grove Street PATH station
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Home away from home
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the developer should get no abatement if he/she is building such an atrocious looking building. it is amazing how jc squanders its opportunities. where did the developer get the architect - from wal-mart?
Posted on: 2014/10/10 3:04
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Re: Jersey City seeks 20-year tax break for hotel outside Grove Street PATH station
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Not too shy to talk
 
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I guess my question is more along the lines of who owns the land that the PATH station is built on? And if it's owned by the port authority or the city, how are they able to literally float a hotel over the land? Air Rights sale perhaps? Massive kickback more likely.
Posted on: 2014/10/9 20:31
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Re: Jersey City seeks 20-year tax break for hotel outside Grove Street PATH station
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Home away from home
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Quote:
I believe the article answers your question as well as why Fulop is pushing for massive tax abatements when he voted against them in this same location as councilman. Quote: The hotel is a joint venture of four developers, some with political ties: former Hudson County Democratic bigwig Joe Panepinto; Ironstate Holdings, owned by David Barry and Michael Barry; FJG Columbus, controlled by former U.S. Rep. Frank Guarini; and KimmelLipson.
Posted on: 2014/10/9 20:17
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Re: Jersey City seeks 20-year tax break for hotel outside Grove Street PATH station
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Not too shy to talk
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This building is an abomination and I'm praying that the awful design of the building can be attributed to the schematic nature of the rendering. Notice the truss supporting the hotel is bearing directly on top of the existing PATH entrance...not sure how that's gonna work.
I'd be fully supportive of a tax abatement if the hotel developer was making any sort of attempt to enhance the corner or improve access to the path station. Instead, they're doing everything possible to avoid it. It's a colossal missed opportunity and I'd love to know how they got approval to build that floating box over the land that path station is built on.
Posted on: 2014/10/9 20:09
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Re: Jersey City seeks 20-year tax break for hotel outside Grove Street PATH station
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Home away from home
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Quote:
The new buildings in Miami look pretty much the same. So JC will look more like Miami. Except for the models and palm trees.
Posted on: 2014/10/9 19:04
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Re: Jersey City seeks 20-year tax break for hotel outside Grove Street PATH station
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Home away from home
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I also wonder if they will close access to that PATH entrance while the hotel is being built.
Posted on: 2014/10/9 18:54
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Re: Jersey City seeks 20-year tax break for hotel outside Grove Street PATH station
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Home away from home
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I don't think it's particularly attractive, but I also don't think it's absolutely hideous. From the rendering, it looks actually kind of dated, like a 1980s building you'd see built in Miami.
Posted on: 2014/10/9 18:54
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Re: Jersey City seeks 20-year tax break for hotel outside Grove Street PATH station
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Home away from home
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That is the ugliest building to ever be proposed in Jersey City! Fulop should be recalled if he pushes this through.
Posted on: 2014/10/9 16:21
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Re: Jersey City seeks 20-year tax break for hotel outside Grove Street PATH station
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Home away from home
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Quote:
Thanks! You just killed 2 birds with one stone. I have been wondering why that new skyscrapper was built with an ugly solid cement wall running up the bottom third or so of the building facing the path. Your answer makes perfect sense.
Posted on: 2014/10/9 14:54
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Re: Jersey City seeks 20-year tax break for hotel outside Grove Street PATH station
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Home away from home
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Quote:
DING DING DING to the text in red.
Posted on: 2014/10/9 14:34
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Re: Jersey City seeks 20-year tax break for hotel outside Grove Street PATH station
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Home away from home
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yuck from an aesthetic pov. is this urban planning or not?
Posted on: 2014/10/9 1:32
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Re: Jersey City seeks 20-year tax break for hotel outside Grove Street PATH station
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Home away from home
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Quote:
The stated rationale is right there in the article. Hotels (i) are cheaper than residential buildings from a city-services perspective (true, as hotels do not result in more children in public schools, for example) and (ii) provide significantly more employment opportunities than residential buildings (also true, as residential buildings will employ maybe 15-20 staff maximum, while a hotel will have at least 100-200 staff). Whether that's enough of a rationale to justify treating hotels differently from residential is a harder declaration to make. Hotels have their own social costs as well, and I worry that offering abatements to hotels but not residential developments will result in hotels crowding out residential development downtown, which would be bad for those of us who actually live here.
Posted on: 2014/10/8 23:51
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Re: Jersey City seeks 20-year tax break for hotel outside Grove Street PATH station
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Quite a regular
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For those of you wondering where it will go.
Posted on: 2014/10/8 23:04
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Re: Jersey City seeks 20-year tax break for hotel outside Grove Street PATH station
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Home away from home
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Is there any acceptable reason why Fulop wants a big hotel built in a prime location to receive 20 year tax break?
Is there some kind of arrangement where the hotel takes some of its massive savings and contributes it to Fulop's governor run that I don't know about? I just can't understand why he would be seeking this, especially when the article says he voted against an abatement in this exact location for the accompanying residential tower as Councilman.
Posted on: 2014/10/8 22:40
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Re: Jersey City seeks 20-year tax break for hotel outside Grove Street PATH station
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Home away from home
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Yup, that makes sense. I wasn't able to figure out why that side was built as a solid wall.
Posted on: 2014/10/8 18:07
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Re: Jersey City seeks 20-year tax break for hotel outside Grove Street PATH station
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Home away from home
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I think directly on top of the round Path entrance on Marin Blvd. I think it will go as high as the "rough" western face of the new skyscraper that is currently being built. That portion was left rough because this hotel be built right up against it, up to that height.
Posted on: 2014/10/8 15:58
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Re: Jersey City seeks 20-year tax break for hotel outside Grove Street PATH station
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Home away from home
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Does anyone know the *precise* location where this is going?
Posted on: 2014/10/8 15:48
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Re: Jersey City seeks 20-year tax break for hotel outside Grove Street PATH station
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Home away from home
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I received my tax bill, it is stated there will be a lien sale this December. Fulop does care about people's ability to pay taxes if he continues to hand out tax breaks, every abatement is not a ratable and only ratables can lower taxes.
Posted on: 2014/10/6 14:18
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Re: Jersey City seeks 20-year tax break for hotel outside Grove Street PATH station
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Home away from home
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As tax breaks and abatements directly affect the taxes I pay, I'd like to see a cause / conditions that state the recipients of such 'breaks' must employ 50% of staff from JC and a further 25% from NJ
Posted on: 2014/10/5 21:45
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My humor is for the silent blue collar majority - If my posts offend, slander or you deem inappropriate and seek deletion, contact the webmaster for jurisdiction.
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