jcdd wrote:
Fairway or Wegman's would be the best choice. Forget Whole Foods.

craigslistdiva wrote:
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user1111 wrote:

The one type of customer I did not see was a poor person. This is not surprising. Eating healthy is expensive, and you?ll never find a Whole Foods in a poor neighborhood. Statistics show a heavy correlation between obesity and poverty, and a trip to Whole Foods bore this out. I fear that we are dividing into two Americas, not just between the haves and have-nots, but between the healthy and the unhealthy, with a lot of the division being the same. I feared that I was, by shopping here, inadvertently contributing to it.

As much as I can see your point, I feel like the so called "poor" (including myself, I live pay check to pay check barely making rent sometimes) also need access to healthy options. Maybe not a WF - or as I call it, Whole Paycheck - but a Trader Joe's or something other than the Shop Wrong or Pathmark. The Pathmark (on Grand Street) is so overpriced it is almost as expensive as WF. Weirdly enough, the demographic you targeted in your post is the prime customer at this store.

The Shop-Wrong is over crowded and their non boxed food is often poor quality and doesn't last. A&P is far for people that live in Paulus Hook and don't have a car. Same goes for the 77 Hudson store. They are merely ok, super overpriced.

Now, the saving grace in our neighborhood is the Farmer's market which ends in mid December. So from January thru May, there is no access to a decent grocer.

There may not be a demand for a WF but there certainly is a demand for a Trader Joes, a Wegmen's, Stew Leonards or whatever. Something that has a decent butcher, decent seafood and decent organic groceries.

user1111 wrote:

The one type of customer I did not see was a poor person. This is not surprising. Eating healthy is expensive, and you?ll never find a Whole Foods in a poor neighborhood. Statistics show a heavy correlation between obesity and poverty, and a trip to Whole Foods bore this out. I fear that we are dividing into two Americas, not just between the haves and have-nots, but between the healthy and the unhealthy, with a lot of the division being the same. I feared that I was, by shopping here, inadvertently contributing to it.

Let's say WF listens to the silly Change.org petition and opens a store in JC. And it fails. What then, will the people who are complaining offer to defray some of WF's expenses?

jcguy05 wrote:
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WhoElseCouldIBe wrote:

Who cares about the stock price? WF's revenue, gross margin and cash accounts are growing every year. WF is doing better year after year - they know what they are doing. So much butthurt because they didn't pick YOUR city.

did you get all that from watching cramer? WF is in terrible shape as a company, they keep making bad decisions on the new stores - each store is very capital intensive to open. They are also getting out competed and trying to cut price which is crashing their margin. Their yoy growth has slowed significantly. It's all in their quarterly numbers from the past 12 month.

Not sure what planet you are on saying "wf is doing better year after year", time to stop watching cnbc.

jcguy05 wrote:
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WhoElseCouldIBe wrote:

Who cares about the stock price? WF's revenue, gross margin and cash accounts are growing every year. WF is doing better year after year - they know what they are doing. So much butthurt because they didn't pick YOUR city.

did you get all that from watching cramer? WF is in terrible shape as a company, they keep making bad decisions on the new stores - each store is very capital intensive to open. They are also getting out competed and trying to cut price which is crashing their margin. Their yoy growth has slowed significantly. It's all in their quarterly numbers from the past 12 month.

Not sure what planet you are on saying "wf is doing better year after year", time to stop watching cnbc.

Seagull wrote:
Fuck Whole Foods. I'm hoping we get a Fairway.

WhoElseCouldIBe wrote:

Who cares about the stock price? WF's revenue, gross margin and cash accounts are growing every year. WF is doing better year after year - they know what they are doing. So much butthurt because they didn't pick YOUR city.

Bubble_Tea wrote:
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jcguy05 wrote:
it's not even the population density, but the demographic - downtown jersey city is full of mid/high income residents who are health/organic focused - the perfect target audience for WF. Not to mention i can count at least 10 highrise rental towers coming in the next 2 years to this area increasing the population density even further.

Yet WF chose to overlock jersey city in favor of suburbs with far less density and more competition. No wonder their stock is down by 30%+ YTD. What a bunch of idiots.

Is JC the "perfect" target for Whole Foods? I'm not so sure. A lot of the DT-JC residents are extremely frugal savers relative to New Yorkers, which is why they live in DT JC rather than NYC in the first place.

That's obviously a generalization, but I think it's particularly true among the two major foreign cultures that have moved into DT JC en masse. They also tend to concentrate their food shopping at grocery stores that specialize in food from their native countries.

I'm not suggesting any negative connotation here--it's GOOD to save. I'm just pointing out what Whole Foods has likely considered as they analyze demographics and neighbors for their business strategy.

I think that analysis will change as more and more of these rental projects are completed, because of growth in the sheer number of potential shoppers.

WhoElseCouldIBe wrote:
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brewster wrote:
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JCMan8 wrote:
Do you really think the execs of WF are stupid and don't recognize the obvious market potential in DTJC?

It's possible. Years ago I once had an exchange of emails with an exec at Harbor Freight Tools when I urged them to open a store on 440. I said "you've opened stores out west in towns of 30k but you won't open one here with half a million people within a 15 minute drive?" His response: "but the rents are too high there for our business model". He was completely unable to get his head around the kind of volume the store could do compared to some shitass village in Nebraska. So, yes, WF execs may be capable of making stupid choices.

PS they've since opened stores, including 3 in Saddle Brook, Clifton and Hasbrouck Heights that are 10 minute apart, but not one in Hudson Cty.

I'd imagine that WF business planners have a better idea of how their business would perform in JC than you would. They're doing something right.

jcguy05 wrote:
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brewster wrote:
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JCMan8 wrote:
Do you really think the execs of WF are stupid and don't recognize the obvious market potential in DTJC?

It's possible. Years ago I once had an exchange of emails with an exec at Harbor Freight Tools when I urged them to open a store on 440. I said "you've opened stores out west in towns of 30k but you won't open one here with half a million people within a 15 minute drive?" His response: "but the rents are too high there for our business model". He was completely unable to get his head around the kind of volume the store could do compared to some shitass village in Nebraska. So, yes, WF execs may be capable of making stupid choices.

PS they've since opened stores, including 3 in Saddle Brook, Clifton and Hasbrouck Heights that are 10 minute apart, but not one in Hudson Cty.

it's not even the population density, but the demographic - downtown jersey city is full of mid/high income residents who are health/organic focused - the perfect target audience for WF. Not to mention i can count at least 10 highrise rental towers coming in the next 2 years to this area increasing the population density even further.

Yet WF chose to overlock jersey city in favor of suburbs with far less density and more competition. No wonder their stock is down by 30%+ YTD. What a bunch of idiots.

brewster wrote:
Quote:

JCMan8 wrote:
Do you really think the execs of WF are stupid and don't recognize the obvious market potential in DTJC?

It's possible. Years ago I once had an exchange of emails with an exec at Harbor Freight Tools when I urged them to open a store on 440. I said "you've opened stores out west in towns of 30k but you won't open one here with half a million people within a 15 minute drive?" His response: "but the rents are too high there for our business model". He was completely unable to get his head around the kind of volume the store could do compared to some shitass village in Nebraska. So, yes, WF execs may be capable of making stupid choices.

PS they've since opened stores, including 3 in Saddle Brook, Clifton and Hasbrouck Heights that are 10 minute apart, but not one in Hudson Cty.

Seagull wrote:
Fuck Whole Foods. I'm hoping we get a Fairway.

Monroe wrote:
There isn't a footprint big enough for a Wegman's. Have you ever been to one? Giant parking lots that support immense stores. They draw from all the towns that surround them.

The soccer moms drive up in their giant SUV's and load up. The demographic isn't here to support it.

user1111 wrote:
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Bubble_Tea wrote:
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jcguy05 wrote:
it's not even the population density, but the demographic - downtown jersey city is full of mid/high income residents who are health/organic focused - the perfect target audience for WF. Not to mention i can count at least 10 highrise rental towers coming in the next 2 years to this area increasing the population density even further.

Yet WF chose to overlock jersey city in favor of suburbs with far less density and more competition. No wonder their stock is down by 30%+ YTD. What a bunch of idiots.

Is JC the "perfect" target for Whole Foods? I'm not so sure. A lot of the DT-JC residents are extremely frugal savers relative to New Yorkers, which is why they live in DT JC rather than NYC in the first place.

That's obviously a generalization, but I think it's particularly true among the two major foreign cultures that have moved into DT JC en masse. They also tend to concentrate their food shopping at grocery stores that specialize in food from their native countries.

I'm not suggesting any negative connotation here--it's GOOD to save. I'm just pointing out what Whole Foods has likely considered as they analyze demographics and neighbors for their business strategy.

I think that analysis will change as more and more of these rental projects are completed, because of growth in the sheer number of potential shoppers.

I have noticed lots of people on the lightrail with Whole Foods shopping bags believe it or not these are mostly GV, BL and Bayonne residents why would they need one in Jersey City when you can go one stop on the PATH.. or pick up groceries b4 getting on the PATH

Area_Man wrote:
The people of Newark and its surrounding area deserve access to quality groceries as equally as everyone else does.

Bubble_Tea wrote:
Quote:

jcguy05 wrote:
it's not even the population density, but the demographic - downtown jersey city is full of mid/high income residents who are health/organic focused - the perfect target audience for WF. Not to mention i can count at least 10 highrise rental towers coming in the next 2 years to this area increasing the population density even further.

Yet WF chose to overlock jersey city in favor of suburbs with far less density and more competition. No wonder their stock is down by 30%+ YTD. What a bunch of idiots.

Is JC the "perfect" target for Whole Foods? I'm not so sure. A lot of the DT-JC residents are extremely frugal savers relative to New Yorkers, which is why they live in DT JC rather than NYC in the first place.

That's obviously a generalization, but I think it's particularly true among the two major foreign cultures that have moved into DT JC en masse. They also tend to concentrate their food shopping at grocery stores that specialize in food from their native countries.

I'm not suggesting any negative connotation here--it's GOOD to save. I'm just pointing out what Whole Foods has likely considered as they analyze demographics and neighbors for their business strategy.

I think that analysis will change as more and more of these rental projects are completed, because of growth in the sheer number of potential shoppers.

jcguy05 wrote:
it's not even the population density, but the demographic - downtown jersey city is full of mid/high income residents who are health/organic focused - the perfect target audience for WF. Not to mention i can count at least 10 highrise rental towers coming in the next 2 years to this area increasing the population density even further.

Yet WF chose to overlock jersey city in favor of suburbs with far less density and more competition. No wonder their stock is down by 30%+ YTD. What a bunch of idiots.

brewster wrote:
PS they've since opened stores, including 3 in Saddle Brook, Clifton and Hasbrouck Heights that are 10 minute apart, but not one in Hudson Cty.

brewster wrote:
Quote:

JCMan8 wrote:
Do you really think the execs of WF are stupid and don't recognize the obvious market potential in DTJC?

It's possible. Years ago I once had an exchange of emails with an exec at Harbor Freight Tools when I urged them to open a store on 440. I said "you've opened stores out west in towns of 30k but you won't open one here with half a million people within a 15 minute drive?" His response: "but the rents are too high there for our business model". He was completely unable to get his head around the kind of volume the store could do compared to some shitass village in Nebraska. So, yes, WF execs may be capable of making stupid choices.

PS they've since opened stores, including 3 in Saddle Brook, Clifton and Hasbrouck Heights that are 10 minute apart, but not one in Hudson Cty.

JCMan8 wrote:
Do you really think the execs of WF are stupid and don't recognize the obvious market potential in DTJC?

craigslistdiva wrote:
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tommyc_37 wrote:
And the average HHI in Manhattan is $66k, and average HHI in Brooklyn is $46k.

I don't care if what we get is a Whole Foods. It could be a Trader Joe's, Wegmans, Fairway, whatever ... but a proper market, in a good walkable location, is absolutely necessary in modern day Downtown Jersey City.

Whatever the HHI maybe in JC, it's a fact that most parts of Manhattan and BK look "prettier" than JC. If you see the areas that WF is in, are definitely the "prettier" areas where there are less grungy looking stores and more "trendy" stores. Unfortunately, we lack that in our city (and area that's pretty and is close to transit and is close to some sort of parking facility). Our book has been judged by it's cover!