Frank_M wrote:
Quote:

bodhipooh wrote:
Quote:

hero69 wrote:
i agree about the lack of shade trees and have complained about that before, but someone pointed out that there are no/few trees due to ground contamination.

I don't buy that explanation, hero69. If the ground was so contaminated, it wouldn't be open to the public. And, there ARE trees planted all over the park, just small trees and in areas that are not necessarily where people would congregate (perimeter of grass areas, etc.). The last time I brought this up, I was told that the trees that are planted are expected to grow and become shade trees. Well, it's been nine years since I arrived in JC, and those trees are sure taking a long time to become shade trees. :)

They really should have invested in, and planted, more mature, fuller trees.

Environmental conditions that are less than ideal for large trees aren?t necessarily dangerous to our health.

The contamination we all talk about comes from the construction fill that was originally used to build rail beds out of brackish marshland, and then a century of messy train and rail yard operation. A layer of sand and topsoil was added to create the public areas of LSP, so exposure to the material below is probably minimal and may not be much of a factor. However, while I don?t have any expertise in soil or trees, I would be surprised if mature hardwood trees would have been able to thrive in a recently added layer of soil, even if the money existed to buy and plant them.

As far as the interior portions of the site go, there?s more information than any of us would want to know in a dissertation written by Francis Gallagher in 2008:

https://rucore.libraries.rutgers.edu/rutgers-lib/24382/pdf/1/

bodhipooh wrote:
Quote:

hero69 wrote:
i agree about the lack of shade trees and have complained about that before, but someone pointed out that there are no/few trees due to ground contamination.

I don't buy that explanation, hero69. If the ground was so contaminated, it wouldn't be open to the public. And, there ARE trees planted all over the park, just small trees and in areas that are not necessarily where people would congregate (perimeter of grass areas, etc.). The last time I brought this up, I was told that the trees that are planted are expected to grow and become shade trees. Well, it's been nine years since I arrived in JC, and those trees are sure taking a long time to become shade trees. :)

They really should have invested in, and planted, more mature, fuller trees.

tommyc_37 wrote:
I can't argue that the boats up on blocks looks a little "blighty". But I would imagine most of us could agree that the marina itself, with the boats in the water and passing by, adds some nice nautical ambiance, no? It's actually a very nice and well maintained marina. I wonder if the boats on dry dock/storage can be hidden behind shrubbery or fencing...

bluehorse wrote:

If we're finding faults with LSP status quo, let me add the eyesore boat graveyard as you enter the park. What is that about? Why are these guys allowed to treat that parcel like a junkyard? Totally degrades the 'oasis' feeling.

bluehorse wrote:
...If we're finding faults with LSP status quo, let me add the eyesore boat graveyard as you enter the park. What is that about? Why are these guys allowed to treat that parcel like a junkyard? Totally degrades the 'oasis' feeling.

brewster wrote:
You do put in at the "cartop boat launch" at the last lot, not the trailer launch, right?

brewster wrote:
I grew up sailing on LI and long ago stopped getting angry at ignorant inconsiderate powerboaters. It's like getting angry at the weather, and just as unavoidable. If NJ drivers have no clue what to do at a multiway stop, why should you expect the same idiot in a boat to know the "rules of the road"?

sampesin wrote:
Thanks to Terrence McDonald of the Jersey Journal for reporting Councilman Boggiano's uninformed and dead wrong recommendation for the privatization of Liberty State Park. http://www.nj.com/hudson/index.ssf/20 ... _to_tak.html#incart_river

My comments posted after that nj.com story as Friends of LSP president and son of Morris Pesin, the park's "father" are:
In addition to the Councilman wanting the state to give up LSP to a private entity - casting aside 39 years of the broad public consensus for a free and green urban open space park - he complained about a few things which the story mostly addresses. LSP is a beautiful open space park used mostly by the urban people for the quality of our lives. Of 5 and a half million LSP visitors annually, about 700,000 use the ferries and about 500,000 go to Liberty Science Center and the rest come to the park to enjoy a variety of unstructured recreation. Regarding the bathroom near the temporary ticket window, that undersized facility serves about 5000 people each weekend and the maintenance department, as understaffed as it is, cleans it 3 times a day. When the Terminal reopens in the fall after a $10 million reconstruction after Sandy, those bathrooms will better serve the public. Regarding long lines for the ferries to Lady Liberty and Ellis Island - since 9/11, the security checks by the National Park Service slows the line way down and the line is shorter than in Battery Park, and Americans and people from around the world expect lines getting to any major tourist attraction. About food choices, as someone suggested, people may and do bring picnics to the park if they want something in between the two excellent park restaurants and the hot dog carts and there is also Liberty Cafe Diner at the southwest corner of the park.The Friends of LSP have led many grassroots battles against privatization with our main ally, The NY/NJ Baykeeper and with groups and people from our county and state,in addition to funding over 800 trees (they aren't planted in the key view sheds toward Lady Liberty) and creating and maintaining over a dozen gardens. The DEP and Governor's privatizers will reveal their privatization plans probably this summer, after their major search for privatization plans, and a new grassroots movement will be needed to protect the park from commercialization and privatization. LSP is important for the quality of life of the urban people, and the park needs the state to support LSP as an American landmark, a free park behind Lady Liberty and Ellis Island. To get on the Friends email list, please see the top right of our website www.folsp.org

bodhipooh wrote:
Unfortunately, what Monroe describes has been my experience all too often in the channel leading out of the southern ramp. On many occasions, some teenage (or, early 20-something) jockey at the helm of the Liberty National ferry must have been feeling the pressure to get his passengers to the club in a jiffy, because I have been on the wrong end of his wake many, many times. Sometimes, as I watch them speeding inside the channel area, I try to make my presence known by signaling, but it has been in vain. As a former midshipman and licensed Coast Guard sailor, I feel like I know enough about the "rules of the road" when it comes to sailing and waterways, but I find those are mostly ignored in this area. I see lots of entitled assholes driving their powered boats and watercraft like complete idiots, oblivious to those around them. It's a small miracle we don't see more accidents and incidents in the waters around NYC.

Monroe wrote:
Quote:

brewster wrote:
Quote:

bodhipooh wrote:
the only thing I would add to my wish list is for a small launch ramp in the northern area for people to be able to launch a kayak or canoe.

Actually, the paddling is more pleasant from the southern kayak launch because there's very little boat traffic down there relative to the marinas and ferries at the N end. You can paddle miles S to Staten I and never encounter another craft. There's only occasional slow moving barges and such.

I think the tree problem has to do with the landfill nature of the soil. There's a thin layer of crappy topsoil over fast draining fill. It appears to me it can't hold enough water for the planted trees to thrive. It can barely sustain the crabgrass on the open fields.

The ship that ferries the Wall Streeter's to Liberty National moves at a pretty good clip right past there, often. And you get the occasional jet skier zooming like lunatics during the summer as well.

brewster wrote:
Quote:

bodhipooh wrote:
the only thing I would add to my wish list is for a small launch ramp in the northern area for people to be able to launch a kayak or canoe.

Actually, the paddling is more pleasant from the southern kayak launch because there's very little boat traffic down there relative to the marinas and ferries at the N end. You can paddle miles S to Staten I and never encounter another craft. There's only occasional slow moving barges and such.

I think the tree problem has to do with the landfill nature of the soil. There's a thin layer of crappy topsoil over fast draining fill. It appears to me it can't hold enough water for the planted trees to thrive. It can barely sustain the crabgrass on the open fields.

bodhipooh wrote:
the only thing I would add to my wish list is for a small launch ramp in the northern area for people to be able to launch a kayak or canoe.

bodhipooh wrote:
Quote:

hero69 wrote:
Quote:

bodhipooh wrote:
My one complaint about LSP is the lack of shade trees. I think the park would be much more inviting and pleasant for visitors if it had shaded areas and bigger trees. The northern area with grills is devoid of those and, if the Sun is out in full force, it can get pretty harsh. As for unpaved roads, I have NO IDEA what Boggiano is referring to, as the main North-South roads (Freedom Way and Phillip St) are both fairly smooth and well paved. Audrey Zapp is (thankfully) a brick road, which forces people to slow down as they enter the park. If anything, I wish they would turn Freedom Way into a brick road!! People LOVE to speed on Freedom Way (I run on it, and it can be scary at times) but the Park Police barely bothers enforcing speed limits.

i agree about the lack of shade trees and have complained about that before, but someone pointed out that there are no/few trees due to ground contamination.

I don't buy that explanation, hero69. If the ground was so contaminated, it wouldn't be open to the public. And, there ARE trees planted all over the park, just small trees and in areas that are not necessarily where people would congregate (perimeter of grass areas, etc.). The last time I brought this up, I was told that the trees that are planted are expected to grow and become shade trees. Well, it's been nine years since I arrived in JC, and those trees are sure taking a long time to become shade trees. :)

They really should have invested in, and planted, more mature, fuller trees. As for the rest of the park, I am actually quite impressed with it. It is kept remarkably clean (during weekends, you often see cleaning crews walking around checking on the garbage cans and emptying them out) and I do like the overall size and wide open spaces. I agree with everything Monroe said (admin building is indeed very clean) and the only thing I would add to my wish list is for a small launch ramp in the northern area for people to be able to launch a kayak or canoe.

bodhipooh wrote:
Quote:

Yvonne wrote:
The Friends of Liberty State Park have raised money to plant trees, some were lost to Sandy, they also plant over 20,000 bulbs every fall. The state has neglected the park in my opinion. Do you remember when a child fell in a hole at the park? Personally, I don't trust a private entity to run the park but I am disappointed with the state. http://photos.nj.com/jersey-journal/2 ... _into_hudson_river_2.html

You conveniently left out that the mother of the child was obviously distracted, or negligent, or both. The hole was surrounded by barricades. The child slipped through the barricade and then fell into the hole. Perhaps the mother should have put away the phone and paid more attention to her toddler.

Yvonne wrote:
The Friends of Liberty State Park have raised money to plant trees, some were lost to Sandy, they also plant over 20,000 bulbs every fall. The state has neglected the park in my opinion. Do you remember when a child fell in a hole at the park? Personally, I don't trust a private entity to run the park but I am disappointed with the state. http://photos.nj.com/jersey-journal/2 ... _into_hudson_river_2.html

hero69 wrote:
only in nj would someone recommend that a private entity take over a public park!

hero69 wrote:
Quote:

bodhipooh wrote:
My one complaint about LSP is the lack of shade trees. I think the park would be much more inviting and pleasant for visitors if it had shaded areas and bigger trees. The northern area with grills is devoid of those and, if the Sun is out in full force, it can get pretty harsh. As for unpaved roads, I have NO IDEA what Boggiano is referring to, as the main North-South roads (Freedom Way and Phillip St) are both fairly smooth and well paved. Audrey Zapp is (thankfully) a brick road, which forces people to slow down as they enter the park. If anything, I wish they would turn Freedom Way into a brick road!! People LOVE to speed on Freedom Way (I run on it, and it can be scary at times) but the Park Police barely bothers enforcing speed limits.

i agree about the lack of shade trees and have complained about that before, but someone pointed out that there are no/few trees due to ground contamination.

bodhipooh wrote:
My one complaint about LSP is the lack of shade trees. I think the park would be much more inviting and pleasant for visitors if it had shaded areas and bigger trees. The northern area with grills is devoid of those and, if the Sun is out in full force, it can get pretty harsh. As for unpaved roads, I have NO IDEA what Boggiano is referring to, as the main North-South roads (Freedom Way and Phillip St) are both fairly smooth and well paved. Audrey Zapp is (thankfully) a brick road, which forces people to slow down as they enter the park. If anything, I wish they would turn Freedom Way into a brick road!! People LOVE to speed on Freedom Way (I run on it, and it can be scary at times) but the Park Police barely bothers enforcing speed limits.

He added that he finds it "amazing" that the historic Central Railroad of New Jersey Terminal Building, battered in 2012 during Hurricane Sandy, remains closed.