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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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Home away from home
 
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No one has a civil right to have housing provided for them, at a subsidized discount, where ever they choose. Were that true, we'd have subsidized housing in Beverly Hills, Greenwich, any number of towns in Silicon Valley, etc.
I'm still waiting for a unit to open up in the Dakota. I will, though, settle for a nice apt at the San Remo. And no, I'm not saying get rid of state support. I'm only amused that those receiving it think they deserve more of a handout, or those saving money in their taxes seem to not want to recognize the handouts they receive (JC taxpayers, for instance).
Posted on: 2015/4/21 22:32
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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Home away from home
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2012/10/12 12:58 Last Login : 2016/5/8 0:52 From Jersey City
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All that aside, the taxes in JC could be FAR higher if it wasn't for state aid. Given the very low crime rate (for an urban area), access to decent quality schools (including 2 very good high schools), and focus/attention from city hall, downtown tax payers (especially) don't have it so bad... it's another story for those paying taxes in some other parts of the city though.
Posted on: 2015/4/21 21:08
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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Please quote who said that. We are only disputing your desire to do away with the state assistance. As for affordable housing programs dotted here and there, how long do you suppose the wait lists are? These programs come nowhere close to matching demand. The only point of this branch of the thread is to dispute Monroe's assertion that poor people only live in JC by choice, and there's plenty of other options for them in lovely, leafy, nearby towns with much better schools. There isn't, they don't want there to be. Most affluent suburbs have strongly opposed any movements to increase density either by allowing more conversions to 2 family or construction of larger multifamily properties in the "transit walkable" zone. This is a large part of what has driven young people to the city, the fact that they can't rent an affordable apartment in the town they grew up in, and 35 years of failure to trickle down means they can't afford to buy one.
Posted on: 2015/4/21 21:07
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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And the ward with the largest number of affordable housing units is Ward E because of a large concentration in, wait for it, Newport. They are in the older buildings, but Newport nonetheless.
Posted on: 2015/4/21 20:44
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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Home away from home
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Additionally, there is affordable housing in the middle of Summit NJ. There is affordable housing in Livingston. There goes that argument...
Posted on: 2015/4/21 20:32
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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Home away from home
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There is low income housing in Short Hills. It is just off of rt 78/24, essentially separated from the rest of town.
Posted on: 2015/4/21 20:29
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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I'm unclear how anyone feels the earners in NJ don't do enough to support inner city education. The subsidy provided by the suburban earners is over $17,000/year, every year, for each and every JC student. For Millburn, the state subsidy is $1,996/year. On top of that, JC spends 20% more per student every year.
If you figure that many of the JC kids have parents that pay little or no Federal income tax (being among the 47% that don't), figure that the Federal taxes paid by the earners also helps for paying their food stamps, Section 8 Housing, cell phones, and the myriad other social services available to them. So any idea that JC residents are paying high taxes is silly; the tax abatement issue that Yvonne often refers to doesn't really weigh in when you consider the hundreds of millions of dollars JC avoids charging taxpayers for JC kids education. I'd bet the amount lost to abatements could be recaptured if graft and inefficiency were removed from JC schools.
Posted on: 2015/4/21 19:47
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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The only reason that thread exists is because you created it when you claimed in post #18 the poor could move to affordable housing with great schools in Millburn. You're arguing with yourself.
Posted on: 2015/4/21 17:39
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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My Newport comment was towards those wondering why there isn't low income housing available in Millburn/Short Hills, because some feel that low income people should be able to live wherever they choose, not where they can afford.
So I ask again-why not demand the same of Newport? Where is the low income housing stock on the waterfront?
Posted on: 2015/4/21 17:03
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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How do you extract this nonsense from a point about subsidizing inner city schools? It boils down to this: The poor can't pay much tax, yet they are concentrated in the cities. Expecting the "not poor" minority in the cities, rather than society in general, to be able to pay for a fair level of education is no fairer than expecting landlords alone to subsidize housing for the poor or expecting the sick who are solvent to pay for the sick who are not. In all these cases it seems obvious that society at large should shoulder the costs for those who are unable to pay for basic services. It's the same idea as a large insurance pool, if you leave out the healthy, whether bodily or financially, it's going to fail. And when you let the wealthy off the hook by moving out of the city, it's going to fail.
Posted on: 2015/4/21 16:59
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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Where's the waterfront affordable housing in JC? How come no one is upset Fulop hasn't squeezed the Newport/Lefrak people for some Section 8 housing? Why should the rich only have NYC views? It's simply unfair, damn that Republican mayor!
Posted on: 2015/4/21 16:24
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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It would be funnier if it wasn't true. 
Posted on: 2015/4/21 16:20
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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Home away from home
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Just stumbled on this - just for laughs:
http://www.newyorker.com/humor/borowi ... ott-walker?intcid=mod-yml
Posted on: 2015/4/21 16:13
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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Home away from home
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Monroe - You really can't control it, can you? Pity.
JCMan8 - I don't claim to be the first one to say it, just that it's truer now more than ever. Just seems like we're at a decision point: Do we want some sort of benevolent (hopefully) corporatocracy or do we want something that more closely resembles government by and for the people? (Actual people, not mailboxes in Delaware.) Sure - corporations have long had disproportionate say in our elections, but spending in the upcoming Presidential election is projected to triple that spent in 2012. Triple. The last time political spending exploded - in the 60s - a fair amount of campaign finance reform was undertaken and the Federal Elections Commission was formed. As a result, spending in each of the subsequent four presidential elections declined. Since the Citizens United ruling, spending has gone through the roof. Unless and until that changes in a meaningful way, nothing else really matters. Whether your dress is blue or it is red, you are still going to dance with the one(s) who brung you, no? http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2012/ ... st-presidential-elections
Posted on: 2015/4/21 16:07
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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The people doing the demonizing are the Democrats-expecting the earners to pay for everything.
But please, someone let me know when I can get that rent controlled apartment in the Dakota. Because, they're rich-why shouldn't they be expected to carve out a unit for me?
Posted on: 2015/4/21 15:13
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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Nice sentiment, but George Carlin eloquently explained this decades ago. People didn't care then and they don't care now. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rsL6mKxtOlQ
Posted on: 2015/4/21 14:52
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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Home away from home
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This. This is exactly what I'm talking about. Your reflexive, doctrinaire response to anything and everything with a whiff of political undertone to it - even if you have to stretch to make it political. You are in pain. You've been damaged. Everything to you is Hatfields (Republicans) and McCoys (Democrats). The world doesn't work that way - but as long as there are huge numbers of people who are brainwashed into thinking it does, nothing is ever, ever going to change. It's a silly kabuki theater that plays on people's emotions to get them to "take sides" that allows corporate america to continue to have its way with pretty much everything. On both sides of the aisle. $5 billion for a presidential election? That's not coming from $50 a piece from you and me. What is expected in return for that kind of investment, not to mention the additional billions to buy the senate and house? Let go of the Whizzys and Whineys and Christie and Jeb and Hillary and McGreevey and Fulop and McConnell and Boehner and Booker and Menendez and everyone else in your imaginary battlefield. They are all the same - interested in their own advancement and learned in the ways of getting enough people to buy in. Don't be that guy any more.
Posted on: 2015/4/21 14:43
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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Hey, if you want to do it-you can. My immigrant grandparents came to the USA and didn't speak a word of English. They came with zero money. They lived in Irvington for a spell, and wanted a better education for their 12 kids. They lived, all 12, in a two bedroom apartment above Mario's Restaurant in Millburn-which is now a Charley Brown's.
They worked with their hands, rather than have them out looking for handouts. Zero financial assistance. So rather than expect others to pay for your ride, pedal yourself. No Section 8 housing, no food stamps, no free cell phones.
Posted on: 2015/4/21 13:07
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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Plenty? Really. Please do show. Craigslist shows zero 2 br units for rent under $1500. Zillow 2 units. Somehow I doubt your typical JC couple will pass the scrutiny & credit report for those very nice looking 2 family homes.
Posted on: 2015/4/21 1:48
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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So Millburn welcomes low-income? lmfao. States (and subsidies) tend to work on where people are and not where you, I, nor them, would like them to be.
Posted on: 2015/4/21 1:06
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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I missed the part where living wherever you want, regardless if you can afford to do so, is a civil right.
There are plenty of apartments for rent in Millburn above retail stores, in small two family homes, where a hardworking couple could afford to put their kids into the wonderful school system. NJT Midtown Direct is a block away. I'd like to live in Aspen. Do they have cheap housing? Let me know. I'm not going to add up all the Abbott school money spent, but Newark and JC ALONE take $1.6 billion each and every year. If that's your idea of 'not enough being done' then I really don't know what to say.
Posted on: 2015/4/21 0:59
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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Because I don't believe the rest of NJ is doing it's bit on affordable housing and support for low-income families. Let me coin a phrase here. It's NJ apartheid. How many low-income families do you have in your town?
Posted on: 2015/4/21 0:47
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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dtjc, how can you say it isn't subsidized? Local taxes don't even pay a fifth of the schools cost, the rest comes from state taxpayer money.
Posted on: 2015/4/21 0:41
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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Interesting that you rebut a description of the GOP electorate with talking point criticisms of individual politicians. I suppose that's because you know saying "all Democrats are 1%er hypocrites" is laughable.
Posted on: 2015/4/21 0:39
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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I agree - we're throwing good money after bad in the area of education. But that's the framework and rules in which we operate. Subsidies to JC? You're kidding right? Inner cities like JC bear the brunt of the costs of ed to lower income families. Create your own state (Monrovia?) and go there if you don't like the rules. Or where would you like to draw the tax boundaries? Your city/town? Your street? Your house? Your crapper?
Posted on: 2015/4/21 0:33
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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I could answer by saying that there are only Democrats like Hillary Clinton and Cherokee Warrren, who espouse progressive ideals but when it comes to the almighty dollar do exactly the opposite. You know, Warren who rails against the high cost of education but accepts hundreds of thousands of dollars for teaching ONE university class.
Or Mrs. Clinton, who talks women's rights but accepts tens of millions of dollars from companies who repress women. Anyway, my comment on JC taxes is that it's silly to me to see anyone here complain when single largest component of city taxes is so heavily subsidized from suburban taxpayers-with little results to show for it. These are objective facts. As far as fixing it, I'm all for new ideas that work within existing financial constraints. Spending every more of other people's money not only won't fly, it won't work. Quote:
Posted on: 2015/4/21 0:15
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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I really believe that if everyone received a condensed letter from the federal government each year that itemized all the taxes (federal income taxes, state income taxes, payroll taxes, property taxes, etc.), they paid during the preceding year there would be a huge revolt in this country.
Posted on: 2015/4/20 15:17
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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Substantiate that statement, as in HIGH relative to whom. You've been howling this for years and you make these claims about the tax base as if all the millions in PILOT payments did not exist. When I look at the RE tax rates for Hudson, Bergen & Essex, ours looks average. Lots higher, lots lower. Maplewood and Montclair are higher, Millburn is lower. Hoboken is lower, Bayonne much higher. YMMV. http://www.state.nj.us/treasury/taxation/lpt/taxrate.shtml The "Effective Tax Rate" is the one to compare. In dollars rather than rate, we're actually lower than most of the other north Jersey counties, where homes are more expensive. I have no idea how they calculate for multifamily homes. http://www.nj.com/politics/index.ssf/ ... e_highest_and_lowest.html
Posted on: 2015/4/20 2:51
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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+1
Posted on: 2015/4/20 2:14
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Re: How much do Jersey City residents spend on taxes? Report says more than most
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JC has high taxes because the ratable base is low due to abatements. JC was worth $6.5 billion after the 1988 reval, it is now below $6 billion. If the new construction was not abated, the ratable base would increase and taxes would drop. It has nothing to do with social issues or the fact that the school system is subsidized.
Posted on: 2015/4/20 0:38
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