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Re: Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
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Are you deliberately refusing to understand my question? I am not challenging the perfectly sensible policy of booting scofflaws, only booting a car with zero outstanding tickets. And why should a PUBLIC agency not have it's finances on it's website? The schools do, the Feds do. Barriers to information is so last century. No, I do not know her, she posted here, a bunch of platitudes and vague numbers defending her agency, so I asked for more details in the thread and she never posted again.
Posted on: 2011/7/2 17:49
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Re: Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
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brewster.... One ticket unpaid( maybe they didnt get the ticket) 2nd ticket unpaid ( forgot) maybe thats the rational. This isnt rocket science.. would you rather 5 unpaid??
Put in the correct public record request and get the numbers like the rest of us did . I guess you know the CEO, ask her for the rational on the 3 tickets FAB you are making a mountain out of a mole hill..... registered owner responsible for vehicle. enough with the what ifs what if they didnt get the driver what if the owner lent the car out STOP !! common sense here !! you buy the car you register the car you are responsible for the car!!!!! the tickets the accidents everything.... Go to court and listen to the BOOO HOOOs the crying is nuts!!!! I wish JCPA followed in the PA of Hoboken.... There isnt these problems... They dont listen to the masses They have rules they enforce the rules Period!!! Brightmoment---this was from the original article Until now, this work was done by the city?s Parking Authority, according to Ward E Councilman Steven Fulop, who strenuously objected at last night?s council caucus to transferring the work to police. ?Is this where we want them (Jersey City police officers) devoting their time?? Fulop asked, adding that if cops have extra time on their hands maybe they could mow residents? lawns as well. I think Mr Fulop is a smart man , why stop money from coming in ?why spend more to get less done..... why would you want cops doing this job , its beyond stupid!! pay cops who cost 3 to 4 times what the PEOs and supervisors cost. Thats not bright....... And I have to add, I ran into a few cops I know and was teasing them about becoming meter maids and maybe a spot on Parking Wars.... The answer I got was " Better shot at getting hit by a train on the ocean then cops doing that job effectivly "
Posted on: 2011/7/2 17:13
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Re: Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
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I don't think JCPA needs to care. They can hit up the registered owner for any fines. The registered owner can collect from the driver through small claims or credit card on file.
Posted on: 2011/7/2 9:23
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Re: Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
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How is it the registereed owner (rental company) can pass on the ticket yet another registered owner (private) can not ? If the rental agreement can pass on the ticket, then an affidavit (legal document) highlighting the driver at the time by the 'private' registered owner should also apply. I would love to be a fly on the wall in a Court situation if this did happen........The Judge would be forced to agree with the affidavit and the JCPA would be forced to gather evidence to prove the affidavit was false. Like wise if the nominated driver was to provide an affidavit contrary to the owners affidavit, the JCPA would need to prove one was lying and had commited pergury via their statement on the affidavit............until then the vehicle can not be booted and held as extortion. JCPA seem to want an 'easy' ride when booting and impounding vehicles. I'd be happy to bet that if this scenario was presented in Court, the registered owner would get their car back without penalty and the JCPA forced to adhere to any affidavits presented to them when another driver is nominated. PS. I wouldn't put to much legal faith in a Budget rep - Their job doesn't require a lot of IQ points !
Posted on: 2011/7/2 9:07
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Re: Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
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Maybe 3rd time's the charm here too, I'll give it a go: Please explain why "3rd unpaid ticket and you're booted" does not solve the problem of chronic scofflaw parkers EVEN IN THOSE ZONES as well as 1st time booting. Worst case is they park twice, ignore the tickets, and never do it again for fear of getting booted. Mission accomplished! And without booting an ignorant visitor or new resident and sending them on a frantic trip to the Heights, unless they've gotten one of the new "phone boots". Since it sounds like you're a real student of the JCPA, do you know where a financial report of our "public" agency can be found? Certainly not on it's website or the city's. Does one need to file a FOIA? Mary claims they make money for the city, as opposed to being in the red as was the case back when, but when I asked her for numbers I got no response.
Posted on: 2011/7/2 4:05
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Re: Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
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[url=http://www.jerseycityindependent.com/2011/06/29/jersey-citys-plan-to-use-jcpd-to-round-up-parking-ticket-scofflaws-hits-bump-in-the-road/Jersey City?s Plan to Use JCPD to Round Up Parking Ticket Scofflaws Hits Bump in the Road[/url]
Scofflaws have never been a priority. I moved to JC in '82 and in '84 The 1st new bar in years was opened by the President of the Tavern's Assn., called JC Winston's. The Mngr of said place was walked out in handcuffs one day as she had run up over $14,000+ in parking tickets when tickets were $10. This was before zoned parking permits and there were many who'd park in JC downtown, go to NYC and pay the ticket which was cheaper thaan parking in NYC! So how many years did it take that person to accumulate 14k+ in tickets? Was there no NJ state law that prescribed writing it off the books after 3 yrs.? I think Councilman Fulop's idea of folding the JCPA into the Police Dept. is an excellent idea resulting in savings for the City, more revenue without territorial disputes and a continuing erosion of patronage jobs and nepotism and thus more transparency in government. Not to mention the end to buying buildings worth less than market price, in fact bought at a premium, (was owner of bldg a crony or political pay-to-play donor?), approved by the council with only Fulop, I believe, voting against this waste of taxpayer's monies as they didn't want to spend the $500 for a new assessment which would of course pointed out their wasteful or purposeful intent. In addition the Post office is the only tenant besides the JCPA and not guaranteed to renew their lease amidst national closure of smaller post offices.
Posted on: 2011/7/2 0:38
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Re: Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
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Riazw.... Im waiting for an answer from DMV but since the holiday im sure they are pretty busy. Im 99.99% sure this is the answer ..... There will be no future registrations issued to the named register owner who is (a) has a warrant for arrest due to scoflaw (b) is a scoflaw violator without a warrant just a few violations.
Brewster ... Im sorry but I think you missed my point of an earlier post....1st time booting is for Permit locations by the lightrail stops ,the downtown stop on Essex St, C. C. Drive from Marin to the water and a few other streets designated as 1st time areas due to commuters ,Out of Towners, vehicles on JC streets and hit the ferry and trains. There are also streets by the colleges ,NJCU and ST Peters . There is NO 1st time booting for anything else.... Scoflaw is the 3 FTAs and the Boot. These locations were passed by CITY ORDINANCE to PRESERVE parking for the residents. Passed by City Ordinance means its the LAW voted in by our City Council. The JCPA just doesnt make up the rules as they go. The most previous CEO of the Parking Authority did just that , made his own rules !! Thats why he got the boot ( Ha Ha I just caught that NO PUN INTENDED). The new CEO has , in my opinion, brought this agency out of the gutter and making the right decisions for a professional agency. I say Thank god for that. Im sure its because her background , being a member of the council, she is more educated as to the rules and ordinances. Granted that agency has its problems , it seems as she had her hands full the minute she walked in the door. But numbers dont lie! the money coming in the door takes the presure off us.
Posted on: 2011/7/1 20:57
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Re: Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
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Thanks jcresident0001 for the response!
Does NOT DMV force them to pay the fines, when a driver goes for Vehicle re-registration or driver's license renewal? Quote:
Posted on: 2011/7/1 16:44
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Re: Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
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Ummm, read my question, I asked why WOULDN'T such a 3 strike policy be satisfactory as opposed to 1st offense booting. I don't think anyone objects to booting scofflaws rather than those with a clean record. As for the contractor, as I admitted, at the time I didn't know that local contractors all had itinerant zone permits, and he needed to get a temp. How would I know if someone never told me? It's not like you get an orientation packet when you move here, it's all word of mouth and trial & error. But booting rather than just ticketing a marked commercially plated contractor vehicle with no priors is just vicious.
Posted on: 2011/7/1 16:41
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Re: Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
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FAB........... So what you are saying is ......The PA come to your door waving a handful of tickets , you tell them it wasnt me it was BOB SMITH from 123 Main St . JC NJ they take that information and say Thanks FAB since you nominated him you are no longer responsible for these tickets and they go away? The PA then go to 123 Main st and there is no BOB SMITH there so they say Well FAB nominated BOB SMITH so it must be him and since there is no Mr Smith where FAB said into the shreaded the tickets go?? REALLY you have to be kidding!!
I just spoke with a Budget Car Rep and asked him " If I rent a car and a month from now after I returned it Budget Car company gets a FTA in the mail for a parking ticket that was issed to the car I Rented on the day I rented it , who has to pay for it. ANSWER>>>>> Sir, whoever signed the rental aggreement and was the driver of record on the contract is legally responsible for the ticket even if another committed the violation...Its up to the renter of the vehicle to pay and if he didnt commit the violation he could get whoever the driver was to pay him back. Sounds like the same to me, the registered owner of a vehicle is responsible for any violations even if he/she wasnt the driver. He/she could get whoever the driver was to pay him back. Here is an informed, researched answer not an assumption. Im sure there is someone on here that agrees with it , even though its not the popular explaination. I understand that all on here hates the PA and would like to see them squashed. People think about that with an open mind not with a checkbook that has been hit a time or two. They bring in more then double what they cost , they have no debt and have , I believe 13, parking lost which are all paid for , they own all equiptment without monthly bills. In the last 4 years they have put approx 25 million in the check book of the city. If not for them where do you think that money would come from. US! OUR TAXES or more services would be cut to make up the differences. If the vehicle was sold the day before the boot the registered owner is still on the hook no matter what. There may be an arrest warrant issued once the vehicle was not recoverable . Future registerations may have a problem also.
Posted on: 2011/7/1 13:03
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Re: Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
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In reply, how do you think a rental company deals with parking tickets ? They nominate the driver. The same would apply to private vehicles.......if I got a notice in the mail about tickets, I would nominate who the driver is......it's a no brainer.
Therefor going after the driver is easy, but the JCPA are taking the easy way out of going after a vehicle.....what would the JCPA do if the vehicle was legally sold the day before the bootings ? Do they still hang onto it ?
Posted on: 2011/7/1 9:08
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Re: Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
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F.A.B.... I agree again half way. The driver should hav his/her feet held to the fire but. how is the PA or the PD going to know exactly who was driving? Show to the door of the owner and ask? and when the owner says " I dont remember or I have no idea" whats supposed to happen? rip up the ticket? forget the fines ?
If I may ask you this, you witness a fatal motor vehicle accident , you are 1000% sure of the plate on the vehicle that caused the accident and you give your statement to the police. The police finds the car at the registered owners home. The police ask the owner who was driving and the owner says " I have no idea" whats next? walk away? I know this is a far cry from a $52.00 parking ticket but im sure you understand where im going with this. If im not mistaken the registered owner of the vehicle is held fully responsible and if they were not driving the car when the tickets were issued then have the driver pay them back. Im taking a guess from the screen name that you are a fellow HOG owner. If you ever did lend your Bike to anyone Im sure you would know exactly who was using it at ANY particular time of day. Brewster... The 3 FTAs will stop the numerous tickets that add up to hundreds /thousands of dollars. If the owner is brought in due to being booted for 3 FTAs its likely that the registered owner would pay and watch out that they dont get to 3FTAs again. By the way do you know what FTA stands for? Its Failure to Appear in court. Thats called a NO SHOW in court If I had employees in my business that were a NO SHOW at work for 3 days , they would be looking for a new job. I have a question... The contractor from NY, when did they get booted? Because if it was within the last 12 years and 11 months why didnt you warn him . The responsibility is on the owner of the home to let the out of towners know the rules How on earth would they know if you didnt tell them?? Riazw... Sorry for the delay in reply but I had to research the issue. The violators are most times, put on payment plans by the judges A very small percent down and monthly payments to follow. Most times they make a payment or 2 , then they fail to make a payment, which constitutes the first FTA then the next month or so theres the 2nd FTA then a month or so theres the 3rd FTA so here we are 6 months later and then the vehicle is booted again. Theres the whole process again . It does happen. The same vehicles get booted over and over.So the clearing the slate in 6months will never happen If anyone wants to disagree with what i have stated. Please do as I have ,research the issue , do not assume the answer .
Posted on: 2011/7/1 6:51
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Re: Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
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I see that as a form of extortion, why boot a car at all when you should be targeting the driver (offender). What if the car is owner by a parent or hire car ? It's a soft option to go after the car and not the driver. This is why the Police are sometimes best suited to do the job of getting repeative parking offenders that don't pay - especially if the car in question is not owned by the offender. Remember this is parking, not a drug crime.
Posted on: 2011/6/30 22:25
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Re: Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
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Please explain why "3rd unpaid ticket and you're booted" does not solve the problem of chronic scofflaw parkers as well as 1st time booting. Quote: The contractor should have taken 15 minutes out of his day , spent $3.00 and gotten a daily permit. Is that so wrong??? Really? unheard of? If the contractor thinks that let him stay in NYC . There are plenty of talented contractors in JC that do great work and follow the rules every day . An out of town contractor, like most of the out of towners booted, is unfamiliar with the routine, as was I at the time. And no, there was no local stair building specialist, trust me. That's the real nasty core of the policy, it victimizes mostly out of towners and new residents who don't know the parking routines. I tell people from elsewhere that JC boots on 1st offense and their jaws drop like I told them we cane for jaywalking. When we moved here 13 years ago we drove to the DMV to register the car and change our licenses. We parked on the street, and went in, but found we were missing documents. we went home to get them, had lunch, and returned to find another street spot a couple of blocks away. We came out to find the car booted on the basis of being parked "in the area" more than 2 hrs. WELCOME TO JC, LAND OF THE NUCLEAR FIRST STRIKE!!!
Posted on: 2011/6/30 16:10
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Re: Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
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jcresident0001, you seem to be very knowledgeable about JCPA.
Anti-scofflaw activity has been going on for quite sometime, as per your old post. Where did the JCPA get this number $10m is not collected from prolonged offenders? I am sure there is registration as well as vin number database is available for these 'prolonged offenders' vehicles. Who is responsible for this collection process? What is the process today to collect the money from a 'prolonged offender' once he/she is identified? Assuming the number $10m is correct, does the Jersey City administration know about this un-collected money? If so, how long they knew this? What kind of efforts have been consistently deployed by this administration to collect the money? JCPA has been for the last one month+, booting these 'prolonged offenders' around 13 per day. Assuming,it is $10m, there are 20,000 plus prolonged offenders. This will take, at this rate, around 5+ plus years to collect. Given the Quigley law effect, around 8000 prolonged offenders will not be paying, i.e. around $4m, loss to the city, approximately. What is stopping this administration to collect this money within next 6 months? Why cant they just put an ad like property tax lien and list the prolonged offenders with a follow-up mailers, and tell them that that they will be responsible for any addition collection costs including JCPA & JCPD overtime to collect this money ? This looks like another leadership failure, here is $10m (assume it is correct) but we are closing libraries, STD clinics etc etc., [quote] jcresident0001 wrote: Do you know why there is Scoflaw Booting?? Its because people refuse to take responsibility for the tickets they owe ! Please look up Quigley Law. This law , short explaination, if you get a ticket in january of 2011 and you dont ever pay it , never get booted, never get pulled over by the police , 3 years from the date of issue its like the ticket never existed. Poof gone! Its taken out of system. I wonder how much money the courts get beat for year after year.
Posted on: 2011/6/30 15:10
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Re: Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
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Brewster..... You are talking apples and oranges. The reason for first time booting is to preserve parking around commuter hot spots like by the light rail and by the colleges ( NJCU and ST Peters) . Without that the out of towners and the student will take over those areas and the residents will be S.O.L (S&%t out of Luck).
How well do you know Chapel ave? Port Liberte'? That street , why i cant answer, is a private block from the walkway of the golf course to the water. In the early morning its empty but starting at 530am or so WOW!! The hoards of Out of Towners take over, take most of the parking then hop on the ferry. If you doubt this go check it for yourself!!! A friend of mine just moved in there and when the moving truck got there at 9am there wasnt a space at all so they double parked. leaving it that way caused the driver to stay in the vehicle so not to get a ticket by the police. and delayed the move by 2 hrs . By 7pm the spaces were empty! I watched this. Again if you doubt this go check it out ( If you dont agree please dont assume that im wrong, check it out and have information for an inteligent arguement). The contractor should have taken 15 minutes out of his day , spent $3.00 and gotten a daily permit. Is that so wrong??? Really? unheard of? If the contractor thinks that let him stay in NYC . There are plenty of talented contractors in JC that do great work and follow the rules every day . Do you know why there is Scoflaw Booting?? Its because people refuse to take responsibility for the tickets they owe ! Please look up Quigley Law. This law , short explaination, if you get a ticket in january of 2011 and you dont ever pay it , never get booted, never get pulled over by the police , 3 years from the date of issue its like the ticket never existed. Poof gone! Its taken out of system. I wonder how much money the courts get beat for year after year. In your reply you stated that my initial explaination on booting was the "Common Sense Approach" so is any other explaination of booting ? Its Non Sense ! People dont like the booting because it hits you in the pocket and it holds you to following the rules .If you get a parking ticket you can throw it away and drive off, cant do that with a boot can you.
Posted on: 2011/6/30 10:58
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Re: Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
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While that is the common sense approach, booting has instead been used as a form of terrorism by the JCPA. There's simply no excuse for the 1st offense, no outstanding balance booting that has been commonplace here, but it has gone on forever. I had a contractor from Brooklyn get his truck booted, he'll never take a job in JC again I'm sure. So forgive us for believing giving cops boots will get us more of the same.
Posted on: 2011/6/30 2:46
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Re: Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
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To Croft..... In any line of work there is a need for a chain of command, rank structure. Supervisors have responsibilities to assure that the jobs are being done correctly. I hate to tell you that there isnt much of a pay difference between enforcement officer and top "rank" of captain. According to the JCPA, when this was brought up once before, enforcement officers make an aprox 35K a Sgt makes aprox 37K a LT makes aprox 40K and a Capt makes 42K. There are less then 12 in the Supervisors "Rank" Wheres the "BIG PRETTY PENNY SAVINGS" You Need a structure there are different jobs done by enforcement officers where bosses are needed. Would you feel better with them being called something else?
The SUVs are essential for a few jobs year round more so in the winter time. There are less enforcement officers so walking wouldnt be smart for all of them They can cover much more ground in vehicles. The scoortes are what I have a problem with . They cost much more then the SUVs, and cost 3x more to repair!!! you cant get parts for these things look them up they are out of Canada and the company just shut its doors!!! So for reliability and year round use then have about 12 SUVs is acceptable .Also more then half are little Geos and Ford escapes. They trade off a few dollars in gas and not spent thousands in repairs. I just found out this year that the JCPA , while assigned to the Office of Emergency Management , transport doctors, nurses and other essential personal in the snow storms and plow the snow in police lots along with the PAs lots. To F.A.B... I agree with you half way. For a vehilce that is used in a crime ( vehicles used in crimes , stolen vehicles , drug dealers) why boot it? That would justify an official impound. The unsafe vehicles fall under title 39 and the are subject to official police impound. Booting is for one reason and one reason only, its to compel a person to show up to court to pay whats owed on the registered vehicle
Posted on: 2011/6/30 1:31
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Re: Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
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If you think about it, just about every serious crime involves a car.
JCPD should be involved with booting and towing to expedite accidents, stolen cars, involved in crime or unsafe ONLY. They also work 24/7.
Posted on: 2011/6/29 22:07
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Re: Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
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Why don't they just eliminate the Captain/Lieutenant/Sergeant ranks in the parking authority? Is there any need to have "ranks" for people who just write tickets and put boots on cars? They'd probably save themselves a decent penny if they get these guys out of the gas guzzling SUV's and back on foot where they belong. They act too much like police officers when in fact they are just civilians with ticket writing ability.
Posted on: 2011/6/29 21:21
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Any idea, how many resolutions have they withdrawn during past one year just because of lack of basic co-ordination and analysis?
Posted on: 2011/6/29 16:58
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Jersey City council will hold off on proposal to have police boot and tow cars
Published: Wednesday, June 29, 2011, 3:00 AM By Kate Kowsh/The Jersey Journal The Jersey City City Council has decided to withdraw an ordinance from tonight?s agenda that would have given Jersey City police the job of having cars booted and towed from city streets for parking violations. The ordinance was pulled because of issues raised at the council caucus on Monday and issues that have arisen between the Jersey City Parking Authority and the Police Department, city spokeswoman Jennifer Morrill said. JCPA CEO Mary Paretti said she and Jersey City Police Chief Tom Comey had initially discussed sharing booting duties from midnight to 6 a.m. since JCPA are not working then, but procedural details were never worked out. A TRUCK with a parking boot on High Street in Jersey City. ?These are all little things that again, if you don?t do it every day you don?t realize the little nuances that go along with it,? she said. At the caucus meeting, Downtown Jersey City Councilman Steven Fulop blasted the proposed ordinance on the grounds that police officers should spend their time making the streets safer, not investigating whether parking violators have outstanding warrants or owe fines. Chief Comey, who attended the caucus, said Monday that if the ordinance were adopted, police officers would focus on ?prolonged offenders? with several outstanding tickets and scofflaw warrants dating back one to two years. He explained that officers would utilize plate reading devices to access a database of offenders, and might check some vehicles even if they were not illegally parked. Paretti questioned whether it made sense to have Jersey City police officers who are paid on average $80,000 a year, she said to do the work of JCPA workers, who average $35,000 annually. ?I could put out two people (JCPA workers) for every one (JCPD officer) and my primary job is to ticket and boot,? she said. Paretti also questioned how JCPD would juggle the added duty of booting cars. ?If they?re in the middle of a boot, what happens if they get a call for something else?? she said. ?The reality is that they?re busy on the midnight tour. I don?t know how it would work for them.? Comey, who favors implementing the ordinance, could not be reached yesterday for further comment.
Posted on: 2011/6/29 13:18
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Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
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Jersey City Council to debate letting cops boot, tow vehicles
Published: Tuesday, June 28, 2011, 3:00 AM By Kate Kowsh/The Jersey Journal The Jersey City Council is scheduled to introduce an ordinance tomorrow night that would put the Police Department in the booting and towing business. Vehicles whose owners have failed to pay three or more parking tickets, have received failure-to-appear notices from the Jersey City Municipal Court, and/or have existing warrants can be booted or impounded, according to the ordinance. Until now, this work was done by the city?s Parking Authority, according to Ward E Councilman Steven Fulop, who strenuously objected at last night?s council caucus to transferring the work to police. ?Is this where we want them (Jersey City police officers) devoting their time?? Fulop asked, adding that if cops have extra time on their hands maybe they could mow residents? lawns as well. Police Chief Tom Comey, who spoke at the caucus, said it makes sense to involve police officers since they are patrolling the streets and historically no one gets booted between 10 p.m. and 6 a.m. The ordinance would allow police officers with vehicles that utilize plate reading-devices to access a database of offenders to boot and tow cars, even if the vehicles they are checking are not illegally parked, Comey said. ?It?s an opportunity for the city to get some revenue and the license plate readers to be more interactive,? Comey said. The police chief said police officers would focus on ?prolonged offenders? who have outstanding tickets, fines and scofflaw warrants dating back one to two years. Fulop said after the meeting that if the ordinance is ultimately adopted, he might recommend disbanding the Parking Authority since its duties are being taken away. Tomorrow's City Council meeting will take place at 6 p.m. at City Hall, 280 Grove St.
Posted on: 2011/6/28 15:05
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