Browsing this Thread:
5 Anonymous Users
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Home away from home
 
Joined:
2004/11/7 17:04 Last Login : 2015/2/24 18:16 From "Pay for Play"
Group:
Registered Users
Posts:
1531
 |
Quote:
So mr "veteran online", prove it. Tell us your real name as mine is posted under my profile. Scared to do so? Just as I thought.  As to "check the polls", why don't you post a source for your so-called polls. The only poll I know is the one established by Morris Pesin, the State of NJ in making Liberty State Park a park, the thousands of volunteers over the years who've helped improve the park, all guided by either Morris or his son, Sam Pesin. What YOU got is polls that are all hat and no cattle!  Here's back at you, "bud". 
Posted on: 2010/5/6 2:54
|
|||
 Help US Sue Spectra! Join OR Donate! |
||||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Home away from home
Joined:
2006/4/18 0:04 Last Login : 2021/10/2 19:00 From Jersey Cxxx
Group:
Registered Users
Posts:
1404
|
Quote:
your link doesn't work.  click on this and click on: - Proposal for Jersey City Grand Prix Auto Race Track
Posted on: 2010/5/6 2:53
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Newbie
 
|
For cripes sake, Liberty State Park is a park. Its not a place for commercial development. Morris Pesin fought for this piece of land to remain undeveloped so that city dwellers could enjoy nature in the urban environment.
Thanks Morris, RIP. All these race car fans are saying Jersey City will lose revenue that Formula 1 would bring. Give me a break! Friends of Liberty State Park posted the Jersey City Tourism Official's proposal for Formula One on their website. Read it yourself. Where do you see revenue coming in to Jersey City? http://www.folsp.org/pdf/Proposal_for ... ity_Grand_Prix_Auto_Race2[.pdf All I see in the proposal is revenue going OUT of the city's pocket to Formula One. The proposal offers funding to help build the track, give security and staffing. Why would the city have to pay for the security, staffing and building of a track if Formula One that has such 'deep pockets'? Jersey City is flat out broke and we're giving money away! DUMB.
Posted on: 2010/5/6 2:22
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Home away from home
|
F1 (or specifically Bernie Ecclestone) has deep pockets. Bernie slipped Tony Blair's Labour Party 1 million pounds so that F1 could bypass the tobacco advertising ban in sport in the UK. So maybe we havent heard the end of this. It's a good job nobody on the City Council would ever take a bribe.
Blair got caught and had to hand back the million, but Bernie got to keep his advertising.
Posted on: 2010/5/6 1:15
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Newbie
|
Quote:
Hey Ryan, you just joined, this is your first post and you think you can speak for the "overwhelming majority"? You've got some stones for sure virgin here, veteran online. check the polls, its overwhelming bud
Posted on: 2010/5/6 1:09
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Home away from home
|
Quote:
God knows what you would do to Central Park if left to your own devices. You should move to Las Vegas. It seems that paved over schlock is more your speed.
Posted on: 2010/5/6 0:31
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Not too shy to talk
|
I got this email today from a big Formula 1 racing fan who is opposed to building a race track in LSP:
-------------------------------------------------- Sam, I applaud your coming out against Liverty Park as a F1 venue. It may surprise you, but I am an F1 fan - and can speak from attendance at over 14 races & 4 venues over some 17 years. Most of the races attended have been in Montreal - which has, according to a large consensus of F1 fans arguably the best transit facilities for getting to & from the track of any venue on the circuit. Indianapolis, the venue of the most recent US F1 Grand Prix races (and which I attended - once) was possible to a large extent because the promoters were able to secure the Indianapolis Airport parking lots & Indianapolis public transportation buses to bring fans to & from the track. I imagine this came from annual experience with the Indy 500, but I can assure you that it is at best a make-do arrangement for the fans. And, significantly, the added traffic of fans driving to the airport and then the buses bring them to the track gridlocked the affected interstate system. I drive frequently through northern New Jersey, typically on weekends. On even non-holiday ones the traffic moves at, shall we say, less than optimum rates. Throwing a F1 race weekend into already marginal conditions would result in addition to the obvious additional costs of trash pick up, traffic enforcement & security to be negotiated with the promoters (who will argue against picking up their fair share of the tab by saying they are bringing an "economic benefit" through concession sales taxes, etc.) but the added costs in increased fuel consumption and lost time for the (non F1 fan) drivers and citizens who must use - depend on - these same roads. I could go on, but see no reason to preach to the pulpit here. You may use any of the above to make a point that your opposition is not just a NIMBY argument. Check out some the newer venues Bernie Ecclestone has promoted and you will find that the net, net economic impact (of hosting/building a F! venue & track) has been negative except for a very few insiders - and, of course, Mr. Ecclestone himself. Good luck! John Jamaica Plain MA 02130
Posted on: 2010/5/6 0:17
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Home away from home
|
Singapore is a really nice track and Dubai has an awesome theme park.(look it up it looks really nice) change is good. people stay in jersey city to save money and take the path into the city. i have helped people on the train get to the city before. F1 can not be compared to all points west. all points west is not going to have people flying across the country to come listen to some hipster bands.
this is a huge opportunity for jersey city and once again the hippies just want a big empty plot of grass. if you do not like the idea of concrete why the hell do you live in a city? move to the suburbs everything is green there and lots of bike riding. they can not do this in central park because the streets are effed up and would need to be repaved and they want to go on city streets and those are not lovely either. I understand why Jersey City is dragging to become something more because people just want bike lanes and goddamn trees(suburbs)
Posted on: 2010/5/6 0:00
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Home away from home
|
I agree Vigilante. There are two issues--JC's economic development, and proper utilization of Liberty State Park--conflating them makes discussion difficult. Maybe bringing F1 racing to JC would in fact create opportunity, envigorate the area and elevate JC's profile. That doesn't mean putting F1 racing at LSP is the right thing to do, or that opposing that location means opposing all the good things F1 racing might do for JC. In looking at these sample sites for F1 racing, I don't see where they have been built in areas that serve a pre-existing AND conflicting purpose to the municipality---which is the case at LSP. Creating this race track and holding racing events at LSP CONFLICTS with the current use and purpose of LSP, as plainly stated here by others, notably Sam Pesin. That doesn't mean there are not other properties that are suitable for a race track. Unfortunately for F1, not in the shadow of the Statue of Liberty, right on the Hudson, a stone's throw from NYC. Is it really that surprising that sensible and thoughtful people would want to use such an inherently beautiful and valuable location for something other than a race track?
Posted on: 2010/5/5 21:48
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Home away from home
Joined:
2006/4/18 0:04 Last Login : 2021/10/2 19:00 From Jersey Cxxx
Group:
Registered Users
Posts:
1404
|
LSP is controlled by the State not the City and the final say of what happen in LSP is the State.. I can't imagine why someone would the proposal to F1 without speaking with the Mayor, the Council, the State, select community groups etc. This type of event needs to be well thought out with everyone on-board. It was smart for the Mayor to nix the proposal that was sent.
Posted on: 2010/5/5 21:33
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Home away from home
|
Are these types of images supposed to sell us on this idea? I'm sorry, this just turns me off. It's all cement and metal and pollution. A 9 hole golf course I could accept. It would be low impact and bring in lots of money almost all year round. A racetrack for a once a year event is too much to sacrifice.
 
Posted on: 2010/5/5 20:14
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Home away from home
Joined:
2004/11/7 17:04 Last Login : 2015/2/24 18:16 From "Pay for Play"
Group:
Registered Users
Posts:
1531
|
Quote:
Hey Ryan, you just joined, this is your first post and you think you can speak for the "overwhelming majority"? You've got some stones for sure. 
Posted on: 2010/5/5 20:12
|
|||
|
Help US Sue Spectra! Join OR Donate! |
||||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Home away from home
Joined:
2004/11/7 17:04 Last Login : 2015/2/24 18:16 From "Pay for Play"
Group:
Registered Users
Posts:
1531
|
Quote:
+1! I'll take Sam Pesin, his legion of volunteers and most important Liberty State Park itself, over those who think that "branding" everything and everybody is somehow intrinsic to everything in our daily life. Call it a day F1 and move on down the road!
Posted on: 2010/5/5 20:06
|
|||
|
Help US Sue Spectra! Join OR Donate! |
||||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Home away from home
|
Quote:
Unfortunately, the IRL sucks. It's a spec race with stifled technology and second rate drivers. Thanks Tony George. At least we still have the ALMS.
Posted on: 2010/5/5 19:49
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Home away from home
|
Quote:
Are you serious? You don't know much about "your park" now do you? You know, about the two thirds of the park that is yet to be reclaimed but would need to be for the track to go in? Pillock.
Posted on: 2010/5/5 19:48
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Just can't stay away
Joined:
2009/2/22 2:42 Last Login : 2011/7/30 19:58 From Italian Village
Group:
Registered Users
Posts:
124
|
Quote:
The IRL is going to Baltimore. Wow! haha! That's the city that actually got the renovated Power House, too. Isn't it ironic?
Posted on: 2010/5/5 19:23
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Quite a regular
 
|
The IRL is going to Baltimore.
http://sports.espn.go.com/rpm/racing/indycar/news/story?id=5165185 This is on city streets downtown, and nowhere near the prestige of F1
Posted on: 2010/5/5 19:01
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Just can't stay away
Joined:
2009/2/22 2:42 Last Login : 2011/7/30 19:58 From Italian Village
Group:
Registered Users
Posts:
124
|
look; Sam Pesin is a sweetheart, and I appreciate all he does for that park, but I wouldn't rest the future of this potentially great city, in his hands.
At first glance I was opposed, because I use the park, and I use it often. i don't want to see it get ripped apart. BUT, At second glance, I think there is PLENTY of reason to explore this idea. Sam, and LSP friends should at least discuss this with the Mayor, and the public, and even create demands and expectations from F1 should the event ever come to fruition. To just dismiss it altogether is disgusting.
Posted on: 2010/5/5 18:03
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Just can't stay away
|
Having reviewed the docs, it's clear this would NOT be good for the park or the city.
Posted on: 2010/5/5 17:49
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Home away from home
|
Unlike all those other cities you are mentioning this park is essentially cut off from the city to which it belongs, or at least the part any tourists would stay in. Additionally revenue form the event would most likely have yo go to the State ans not JC as they own the park.
So the visitors stay in NYC, the State gets the revenue, JC gets a traffic jam and bike trail.
Posted on: 2010/5/5 17:46
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Just can't stay away
|
 Looking at this map it is clear that they wouldn't even be using existing roads, but actually building new ones which in no way would enhance one's ability to bicycle around the park. Now seriously people, who are you gonna listen to about this? Sam Pesin, who represents generations of caretakers for the land in question, OR a multinational corporation and its allies represented by the nameless charlatans on this website interested in the location solely for its marketing value? I'll go with Sam Pesin all day baby.
Posted on: 2010/5/5 17:21
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Newbie
|
overwhelming majority want this. If mayor Healy doesn't then he gets voted out. simple
Posted on: 2010/5/5 17:03
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Quite a regular
|
The knee jerk reaction wins, and now the Mayor has something to hold over people's head when he pushes and gets a real bad idea through. Lets see how the powerhouse turns out now....
This was such a good idea on so many levels is was doomed to fail. F1 wants to be here, bad, so bad that for once JC and NJ was holding all the cards. The park would have gotten a 3+ mile bike and jogging trail for 50 weeks a year, plus a building or two that could be used for multiple purposes, everything Albert Park has had, but with somebody else paying for it! LSP was and is a great idea and a great park, but we need to leverage its use. It's a prime area to hold events because of the view, and people will pay for that backdrop. People don't come to JC because its JC, they come cause NYC is on the other side of the river. We need to deal with that and take advantage of that. Having a F1 race means your name is known the world over, would I or anyone else here know a park in Melbourne if it didn't hold a race? The rewards really outweighed the risks on this one, but a knee jerk reaction may kill it. I don't think its dead yet cause I'm not sure how many around here realize the financial might of F1, where drivers make $50 Mil/yr., but this really needed to be vetted out more.
Posted on: 2010/5/5 16:08
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Just can't stay away
Joined:
2009/2/22 2:42 Last Login : 2011/7/30 19:58 From Italian Village
Group:
Registered Users
Posts:
124
|
Quote:
Do you really think there would be much financial benefit to the people and businesses of Jersey City? This would be advertised as a New York City event and almost everyone would stay and spend money in NYC. Maybe a few folks will stay at the Westin and eat at Fire and Oak. Same as All Points West and the Barclay's Golf tournament. Sure it would. Even if it was small. There would be a few jobs, and it would raise some awareness of JC. It might be slight, but you and I both know we could use all the help we could get. If you don't think that sold out hotels in JC etc don't effect the restaurants and a handful of businesses whatsoever, you are nuts. It's not going to make us all millionaires, so spare me... Also I know they would say it's NYC and fine, that's what happens when you are NYC's neighbor. Big deal, but let's move on from this close-mindedness and negativity. There's no reason JC cannot be a decent and progressive city.
Posted on: 2010/5/5 15:58
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Home away from home
Joined:
2007/11/28 3:26 Last Login : 2014/10/27 13:13 From The fog.
Group:
Registered Users
Posts:
1013
|
Do you really think there would be much financial benefit to the people and businesses of Jersey City? This would be advertised as a New York City event and almost everyone would stay and spend money in NYC. Maybe a few folks will stay at the Westin and eat at Fire and Oak. Same as All Points West and the Barclay's Golf tournament.
Posted on: 2010/5/5 15:39
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Home away from home
|
Quote:
No, it doesn't and that's why F1 will not come here.
Posted on: 2010/5/5 15:32
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Just can't stay away
Joined:
2009/2/22 2:42 Last Login : 2011/7/30 19:58 From Italian Village
Group:
Registered Users
Posts:
124
|
Let's take a look here at successful locations of F1. They don't look like they ruin the World Class locations below! As a matter of fact JC doesn't belong in the same conversation as these cities....But no we wouldn't want the hacks of JC to be forward thinking would we? We'd rather have the same old S#@& we've always had.
Monaco: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Monaco_680.JPG Alberta Park, Melbourne: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Albert_park_and_lake.jpg Valenica, Spain : http://www.f1-gp.info/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/valencia-2010.jpg Singapore; http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/wp-content ... 8/01/singapore_08_art.jpg
Posted on: 2010/5/5 15:11
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Home away from home
|
Jersey City mayor nixes idea for Formula One race in Liberty State Park
Wednesday, May 05, 2010 By MELISSA HAYES JOURNAL STAFF WRITER Instead of a checkered flag, Jersey City Mayor Jerramiah T. Healy waved a white flag yesterday - telling a city agency to back off the idea of bringing Grand Prix racing to Liberty State Park. "After a review of the draft proposal prepared by the City's Tourism Office, I have come to the same conclusion...that this type of event is not suited for Liberty State Park," Healy said in a statement. Healy's announcement came the day after The Jersey Journal broke news that Destination Jersey City, a nonprofit operated by the city's Economic Development, sent a draft proposal to Formula One that called for a five-year commitment with the first Grand Prix to be held at the park in 2012. The proposal called for a 3.6-mile racetrack traversing the park's 600-land-acres. "While we work to attract national and international events to our city, we must ensure that they are appropriate and will have the least impact upon the quality of life of our residents and our community," Healy said. Sam Pesin, president of Friends of Liberty State Park, a group that works to protect the park, called Healy's announcement a "great relief." "Mayor Healy did reach out to me yesterday and we had a very constructive conversation," he said. "Instead of a negative wasteful controversy, we can all focus on working together on positive efforts to benefit Jersey City and Liberty State Park." Eugene Nelson, CEO of the Economic Development Corporation, could not be reached for comment. State officials who operate Liberty State Park wouldn't say yesterday if they'd approve holding a Grand Prix race at the park if the request came to them. "Each year Liberty State Park receives numerous requests for events to be held at this park," state Department of Environmental Protection spokesman Larry Ragonese said. "Each event is considered based on benefit to park users and its impact on the natural and historic resources on the site." While the city's tourism official forwarded a copy of the draft proposal to the park's superintendent, a DEP employee, Ragonese said no formal application was made to the state. Pesin noted that state and federal grants are funding a $32 million ecological restoration project at the park, which includes creating a 40-acre salt marsh, over 100 acres of forest and a network of nature trails
Posted on: 2010/5/5 15:04
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Home away from home
|
Oh. And that raceway track is not "mostly on industrial land." Have you been to LSP? I don't object to your visiting my park anytime. It is open early and late.
Posted on: 2010/5/5 14:33
|
|||
|
||||
|
Re: Friends of Liberty State Park oppose Formula One Grand Prix in Jersey City
|
||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Home away from home
|
Parks are called PARKS for a reason. They are not meant to be places to drive and race, or go to watch cars racing. Sorry. It's some new-fangled idea YOU have for using a park. I like the more typical uses, including the APW. I do not oppose concerts in the park. Oh. I mean in MY park.
Posted on: 2010/5/5 14:31
|
|||
|
||||