$20k to paint walls! I live in 86 unit building and our lobby renovation ended up north of $50k (paint and new carpets). Our board dropped our super a few years back and retained a "super services" company. The so-called savings that they sold us on never happened. Our budget has grown by 48%, no audits on the books - only "reviews". We spent $70k between super and Repairs & Maintenance ten years ago, now we are at $127k.

We spend ~$16k for our management company. I'm amazed how condo boards, supers and management companies work. It is such a joke!

Quote:

Do you do it on a rotating volunteer basis or do you pay one or several of your own to handle the job?

My building, Morgan Lighthouse (143 Morgan Street) is 40 units on 8 floors.

After finding our management company was cooking the books (by padding & rigging bids), we canned them.

ie
$20,000 to paint the hallways!?!?

[STAY AWAY FROM RPM Management in Hackensack].

Since then we have been self managing, and things couldn't be better.

Quote:

I wouldn't know. We have just 10 units. It's probably best to get at least 3 quotes to compare and be very clear about what you want them to do.

Is there any way to salvage the relationship with your current manager? Perhaps a face to face meeting with the agent to let them know why you're not satisfied and tell them what you need to be improved on. If they're not willing to work with you then you have no choice but to move on. Good luck.

How many of your 54 units are owner occupied? If they are mostly renters then forget it. Nothing against renters but there is nothing more frustrating than dealing with a bunch of "absentee landlords". I formerly lived in a 12 unit building which was only about 25% owner occupied. The other owners never responded to anything as they all lived outside the area. The management company sucked and nobody cared. You will quickly learn how incredibly lazy people can be if you attempt to do any of the required work yourselves. You would think with such an investment people would care more but they just don't. I sold, THANK GOD, and am renting again. Even now I find myself sweeping up the street and keeping the block looking nice where I currently live. Some people have pride, others not so much. I would suggest shopping around for a better management company. I am sure some folks on this site could give you some leads. Good Luck.

Are the owners that are suggesting to end the relationship with your current manager unhappy with them or just looking to save money? Do the people serve on the Board and have any responsibilities now? They may not realize how much time is involved in a building of that size.

If they're unhappy with the manager, you may want to look for another -- or -- you could try and negotiate a deal where a management company plays a limited role and the Board will handle the balance of responsibilities.

For example the manager could handle and be paid for 60 or 70 % of the duties and the Board would handle the remaining 30 or 40 %. This would allow the Board to save some money and give the association the opportunity to see how much work there really is, before making that kind of decision. If it's too much, you ask the manager to take over and pay them accordingly.

I personally would want the manager to handle the billing, accounts payable, receivable, check writing/deposits, and so forth. The board could handle the maintenance by working directly with contractors and acting in a supervisory role. I would hate to see a contractor in my building and not know who they are, what job they're doing, and have to refer to the manager to learn what they're being paid. I would prefer the association to handle getting the estimates, negotiating work contracts and supervising the work while it's being done.

Thanks to everyone who responded to my previous question, about whether it made sense for our 54 unit condo to self manage. The clear consensus seems to be NO!

One person raised the question of why switch - the short answer is many unit owners are not satisfied with the supers or the managing agents service, and do not feel the management company is able to manage the super and his staff or address needed building repairs. Thus, the suggestion we find a new property manager.

We are in the process of getting proposals, but I am wondering - what is a reasonable annual cost for a condo of our size, 54 units? We have a garage, but no yard or other amenities, such as health clubs etc.

The New Jersey Condo, HOA & Co-op Expo
This expo might be of interest to any board or non board members, who are contemplating of their service options. E.g. comparing different HOA management companies, and maybe even finding info on self managed buildings. The expo is in Secaucus, NJ, on May 5th, free and open to all.

http://nj-expo.com/

For 12 years I lived in a self-managed condo on the Jersey shore that had almost 150 units. It was beautiful. If you already have bylaws, a law firm, and an accounting firm you are most of the way there. You will probably need a full or part-timer on site for administrative purposes and, of course, you will need some dedicated volunteers for committees, rule enforcement, and such.

I would do it and do it well for a stipend and a 10 unit building.
But a 54 unit building is another story, as others have said. Perhaps if you have a unemployed GENIUS who you would be willing to pay fairly for a 40 hour week, then use him.

But for a shifting group of volunteers, this is just not going to work. NOBODY will bear the work and the abuse for free.

There is no freakin' WAY in the world you can be a
self-managed 54-unit building. No chance whatsoever. Find another management company if you don't like the one you have. True, most management companies around here leave a lot to be desired, but it is the lesser of two evils. If you try be self-managed, your building's common areas will fall into serious disrepair, among other things. A friend's building, with just 8 units tried it and even with that small number of units it was bad enough. The building practically fell apart and water bills didn't get paid, and the water company threatened to shut the water off. The management company for my small building isn't perfect, but they are necessary to the building's existence.

I would not buy a unit in a self-managed building either.

54 units is too much. You may also have issues obtaining mortgages on a self managed building with that many units. 8, 9 units maybe but once you go above that some lenders may have issues.

I lived in a self-managed building and it was a nightmare. Some people put in lots of time; others did nothing but complain. Once we hired management, things were maintained much better saving us $$ on costlier repairs. A good management company saves you more in the long run.

What is the reason for the split? Problems with management company? Costs?

If its the cost, I always think it's better to shell out those few extra bucks bc you're bound to have issues with one another and you want that third party to be there to settle those disputes.

For a smaller building, say no more than 8 units, being self-managed makes some economic sense as most management companies want a minimum $200-$300/month fee. That adds quite a bit to the maintenance if it's only being parceled out among a handful of units. Managing a building essentially amounts to a second job. Unit owners may, in principle, agree to share tasks, but in reality only one or two people end up doing all the work. You'll also find that it's just one or two unit owners in the building who'll end up creating 90% of the problems. For a 54-unit building, I'd say find a professional management co. The headaches are too numerous and complicated for a building that size.

Personally, as a buyer I would want nothing to do with a condo that is self managed. I wouldn't want to make the effort and it sounds like it would be a hassle. Just food for thought as I am sure there are a lot of people out there who feel the same way. This could affect your resale value.

Well the first thing you would need is a lawyer. Then set up a condo board with elected officers, then a bank account. You could keep the same by-laws or adopt a new version. You should decide what tasks or chores are to be done by either the residents or hired hands. Monthly or occasional meetings may be necessary. This can be done and it wouldn't be the first time.

We are eight units and self managed - it's time consuming. There is a ton involved and you will have to rely heavily on the people in your building (or board) to step up and do things like collect HOA fees, manage finances, manage vendor contracts (cleaning, repairs, trash, etc.). It's considerable effort. I dont know if you have dealt with any insurance and adjuster issues yet... but that is pretty time consuming and requires someone to be around (not working).

There are three people who do this in our building and I know we all set aside time for building issues.

It is very much do-able, but it kind of sucks. Outside of the savings, I wish we still had a management company.

I am on the Board of my condo association, a 54 unit building converted in 1990. Our management company also purchased the conversion from the original sponsor, and owns the remaining (9 or 10) sponsor units.

Some of the owners have suggested ending our relationship with the management company, and 'self-managing'. Anyone have any suggestions, experiences they can share about managing their own building?