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Re: Newport Centre Mall: GameStop store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say
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I worked in the toy department of a major department store when I was in high school... it was before everyone was credit-card-crazy and using their Visas for $5 purchases, but it was also 20 years ago and average sales were smaller, and around Christmas we regularly had $30k-$35k per _day_. I dont think there's anything fishy about $27k at Christmas in a store with an average item price of $50.

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Posted on: 2007/12/30 18:04
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Re: Newport Centre Mall: GameStop store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say
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I'm not sure Grove, and now you have me curious, I'm going to email my old mentor who I worked with in retail and is the in-house council. I know workman's comp. covers covers certain things, I'm just not sure if this situation falls into it to prevent civil action. I'll let you know the response.


That's a good idea. I'm only admitted in NY and NJ, so I can really only answer as to what the law would be if this happened in either of those states. I was curious too, so I asked my boyfriend who is in-house counsel, specializing in workers comp, for the largest insurance carrier in NY state. But it would be good to know what your friend says.

Posted on: 2007/12/30 17:09
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Re: Newport Centre Mall: GameStop store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say
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Something seems a bit odd here - I have worked in many retail stores and have NEVER seen a store have $27k in cash, especially during the holiday season where the managers should be making more deposits than usual. Sounds fishy - seems like they didn't make deposits in several days and now they have been "robbed" (but not caught on camera). Sounds like someone has some nice holiday cash this year.....

Posted on: 2007/12/30 17:02
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Re: Newport Centre Mall: GameStop store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say
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I never really did like GameStop much, so to them I say good job on being idiots and having unsecured deposits late at night with no security whether they are armed or not.

As for the people who were beaten up, well who knows maybe they had the thing planned out and had their friends "rob" them to make off with a quick $27G. Although it sucks they were hurt.

To the thieves, you have quite a bit of money there can I have some?

Posted on: 2007/12/30 16:58
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Re: Newport Centre Mall: GameStop store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say
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If something ever happened and we failed to make changes to ensure employee safety we could be held liable in a civil court.
I'm not sure if a lawyer told you that, and I'm not sure what the laws are in San Jose, but no, that's probably not correct. Foreseeability is irrelevant. If an employee is an injured, while performing their work duties AND the injury arose out of them performing their work duties, their injuries are covered by worker's comp, there's no need for a lawsuit.

(The risk that the company was taking wasn't a lawsuit, but was the risk that their worker's comp insurance rates would go up because the employees are in a more dangerous situation. Just like your car insurance rates go up when you move to Jersey City from the suburbs.)

Aside from insurance rates, it does not matter what steps were taken by the employer to make the job safer because worker's compensation law creates a duty in the employer to cover employees for on-the-job injuries regardless of who is at fault.

I'm not sure, but it might be that you're just disagreeing with me over the use/definition of "negligence." The legal definition includes foreseeable risk, it doesn't mean accidental, which might be a layman definition.

An example might be something like the Triangle Shirtwaist Factory fires in NYC. That was the same kind of negligence or worse - blocking of doors and fire exits to keep the workers working. (This is "negligence" even though what the employers did wasn't accidental - they certainly could have foreseen that locking fire exits would be a fire hazard.) Today, the injuries and even the deaths that ensued would be covered by worker's comp and employees would not have the choice of suing the Factory.

So, that's the tradeoff of workers comp. Injured workers don't have to "take the chance" of going through a lawsuit where they might win, they might lose, they might never find a lawyer to take their case, they might not be awarded enough money to cover their injuries. Instead they are guaranteed to have their injuries covered by worker's comp.

Why would employers agree to this? Because the other side of the tradeoff is that they're protected from lawsuits by agreeing to provide workers comp to injured workers.


I'm not sure Grove, and now you have me curious, I'm going to email my old mentor who I worked with in retail and is the in-house council. I know workman's comp. covers covers certain things, I'm just not sure if this situation falls into it to prevent civil action. I'll let you know the response.

Posted on: 2007/12/30 16:57
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Re: Newport Centre Mall: GameStop store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say
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If something ever happened and we failed to make changes to ensure employee safety we could be held liable in a civil court.
I'm not sure if a lawyer told you that, and I'm not sure what the laws are in San Jose, but no, that's probably not correct. Foreseeability is irrelevant. If an employee is an injured, while performing their work duties AND the injury arose out of them performing their work duties, their injuries are covered by worker's comp, there's no need for a lawsuit.

(The risk that the company was taking wasn't a lawsuit, but was the risk that their worker's comp insurance rates would go up because the employees are in a more dangerous situation. Just like your car insurance rates go up when you move to Jersey City from the suburbs.)

Aside from insurance rates, it does not matter what steps were taken by the employer to make the job safer because worker's compensation law creates a duty in the employer to cover employees for on-the-job injuries regardless of who is at fault.

I'm not sure, but it might be that you're just disagreeing with me over the use/definition of "negligence." The legal definition includes foreseeable risk, it doesn't mean accidental, which might be a layman definition.

An example might be something like the Triangle Shirtwaist Factory fires in NYC. That was the same kind of negligence or worse - blocking of doors and fire exits to keep the workers working. (This is "negligence" even though what the employers did wasn't accidental - they certainly could have foreseen that locking fire exits would be a fire hazard.) Today, the injuries and even the deaths that ensued would be covered by worker's comp and employees would not have the choice of suing the Factory.

So, that's the tradeoff of workers comp. Injured workers don't have to "take the chance" of going through a lawsuit where they might win, they might lose, they might never find a lawyer to take their case, they might not be awarded enough money to cover their injuries. Instead they are guaranteed to have their injuries covered by worker's comp.

Why would employers agree to this? Because the other side of the tradeoff is that they're protected from lawsuits by agreeing to provide workers comp to injured workers.

Posted on: 2007/12/30 16:38
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Re: Newport Centre Mall: GameStop store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say
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Worker's comp laws are supposed to protect employers from worker injury suits, but if an employer clearly was negligent and kept sending employees out just to be robbed, then maybe a lawyer could file a separate negligence suit.


You're right that Worker's comp laws protect employers from suits, but "negligence" doesn't change that - if you think about it, workers comp injuries are almost always a result of negligence.

The only remaining suit, I believe, would stem from an intentional tort (i.e. your employer paid some guy to mug in you in the parking lot). Which I don't think is what happened here.

So there's probably no law suit to be had here, against Game Stop at least. (Suing the mall might be a possibility though...)


Grove~ I don't agree with this, if the managers are required as part of the job description to make deposits, and they fail to do what is required of the basic job description they can be terminated. Most large retail organizations( non mom and pop stores) have all deposit slips sent to them on a weekly basis, or check the online banking statements and match against the daily sales records. This is done to prevent internal theft so, if they fail to make deposits when required the manager or acting manager can loose their job.

When policy is set it is the responsibility of the company to make sure that all basics measures are taken to ensure that it is feasible and employee safety is one of them.

Example: I was the DM for a store in San Jose, the bank used for this location was in a bad section of town, poorly lit, and had the the drop box in an alleyway. Our corp. office was located in NYC, they had no clue what the neighborhood was like. This store did not have a safe and they were required to make night deposits. When I visited the store the manger mentioned the banking situation in passing. The moment this was mentioned to me I had an obligation to advise my regional manager. A decision was made to get a safe, and we eventually moved to a bank that deposits were made during normal banking hours. The reason the company reacted so quickly, we were a large company, similar to a GameStop and since we were made aware of a potential situation we had to react to protect the staff and to protect the company. If something ever happened and we failed to make changes to ensure employee safety we could be held liable in a civil court.

I find it very difficult to understand how the company did not foresee a problem here, this is all basic loss prevention 101.
26k is a large cash deposit considering how many people use credit/debit cards. This was either a high volume store or there was many days of deposits that were not sent to the bank. Since employee turn over/internal theft is very common in retail stores Loss prevention plays a major role i, and the very first thing that is done is to ensure that every possible precaution is done to protect the assets and protect the company against any civil action. I can't begin to tell you how many lawsuits I've seen in my 20+ years of retail by both customers and employees.

Posted on: 2007/12/30 15:46
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Re: Newport Centre Mall: GameStop store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say
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Worker's comp laws are supposed to protect employers from worker injury suits, but if an employer clearly was negligent and kept sending employees out just to be robbed, then maybe a lawyer could file a separate negligence suit.


You're right that Worker's comp laws protect employers from suits, but "negligence" doesn't change that - if you think about it, workers comp injuries are almost always a result of negligence.

The only remaining suit, I believe, would stem from an intentional tort (i.e. your employer paid some guy to mug in you in the parking lot). Which I don't think is what happened here.

So there's probably no law suit to be had here, against Game Stop at least. (Suing the mall might be a possibility though...)

Posted on: 2007/12/30 14:45
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Re: Newport Centre Mall: GameStop store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say
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I wonder if the mall security cctv cameras will show anyone hanging around the store and watching what happens at the end of the day and guess who might have the days takings.
If you look at every store in JC, most stores are an easy target and even I get a couple of employees to accompany me to the bank - I never accept cash from private jobs and arrange electronic money transfers online with clients.

Gamestop might be big business, but operate like small business and it appears they look at every cost-effective way to save money with little regards to employee safety. Gamestop HQ would be VERY aware that they never get invoiced from security co's to deposit money!

Posted on: 2007/12/30 12:33
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Re: Newport Centre Mall: GameStop store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say
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Thanks.

One thing to note is that the limit seems to be $25,000 for regular treatments and $35,000 for rehab.

In the Gamestop case, those limits would obviously be more than high enough.

But, if I'm understanding the limits correctly, they are super low, especially for an uninsured person who has to pay the full retail price for care.

For someone who's seriously injured, any limit under $200,000 is really a joke.


Since this was a work related situation I'm sure all medical costs and "other" costs will be covered by the company.

Since we don't know all the facts, it's hard to say what can/should/may happen, but it seems that a poster on this thread may have been employed by Gamestop at one time. If the things he posts are accurate and Gamestops polices put their employees in danger by forcing them to make after hour deposits (night drops) and with no proper security......well you all do the math!

When I use to work in retail, even for our normally lower volume stores, from Black Friday through mid to the end of January, we hired armed security to accompany the mangers to do night drops. The cost of this was approx. 100.00 per week, that's pennies....

Posted on: 2007/12/30 5:26
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Re: Newport Centre Mall: GameStop store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say
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Thanks.

One thing to note is that the limit seems to be $25,000 for regular treatments and $35,000 for rehab.

In the Gamestop case, those limits would obviously be more than high enough.

But, if I'm understanding the limits correctly, they are super low, especially for an uninsured person who has to pay the full retail price for care.

For someone who's seriously injured, any limit under $200,000 is really a joke.

Posted on: 2007/12/30 4:45
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Re: Newport Centre Mall: GameStop store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say
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That's the thing though, I've never seen an employee sue them over something like this & that's why they continue to do it.


Worker's comp laws are supposed to protect employers from worker injury suits, but if an employer clearly was negligent and kept sending employees out just to be robbed, then maybe a lawyer could file a separate negligence suit.

If someone here knows the crime victim, one step might be to start a thread here asking for names of good Jersey City personal injury or worker's comp lawyers.

Posted on: 2007/12/30 4:39
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Re: Newport Centre Mall: GameStop store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say
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fat-ass-bike wrote:
- Cheap and typical of small business and how they value their staff. Why pay for insurance and also money collections


Gamestop is a publicly traded corporation, that owns over 5000 stores, has over 33,000 employees with annual sales of over 5.5 billion dollars, this is not a "small business".

Insurance companies writing polices for retail stores have clear guidelines for public and employee safety as well as loss due to theft.
They will not cover losses or lawsuits if the written policy is not followed, when it comes to insurance coverage of missing, lost and stolen deposits. There is very clear and strict guidelines.

Looking at this event from with a "loss prevention" perspective, there is something clearly wrong here.

If the store management/staff did not violate company policy by doing a unsecured night drop, and the staff were following all the coperate policies and procedures, the risk for a law suit from the employees because of employer negligence would be substantial for such a large company.


That's the thing though, I've never seen an employee sue them over something like this & that's why they continue to do it. I remember a store was robbed at gunpoint and when the DM was notified the first thing he said was, "How much did they get" not, "Is everyone ok?"

Posted on: 2007/12/30 2:30
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Re: Newport Centre Mall: GameStop store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say
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fat-ass-bike wrote:
Thats exactly the point - It costs money to get armed guards to collect the money and deposit it for you (sometimes the cost is based on the amount they collect and deposit for you).
If you get an employee to deposit the money it costs you nothing.

Insurance will cover the money lost and the employee will be covered (medical costs) by being a victim of crime


Is it true that crime victims can get free medical care in Jersey City? If so, how does that work?


http://www.state.nj.us/victims/

http://www.state.nj.us/victims/pages/benefits_in_a_nutshell.htm

Posted on: 2007/12/29 21:52
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Re: Newport Centre Mall: GameStop store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say
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fat-ass-bike wrote:
Thats exactly the point - It costs money to get armed guards to collect the money and deposit it for you (sometimes the cost is based on the amount they collect and deposit for you).
If you get an employee to deposit the money it costs you nothing.

Insurance will cover the money lost and the employee will be covered (medical costs) by being a victim of crime


Is it true that crime victims can get free medical care in Jersey City? If so, how does that work?

Posted on: 2007/12/29 21:43
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Re: Newport Centre Mall: GameStop store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say
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fat-ass-bike wrote:
- Cheap and typical of small business and how they value their staff. Why pay for insurance and also money collections


Gamestop is a publicly traded corporation, that owns over 5000 stores, has over 33,000 employees with annual sales of over 5.5 billion dollars, this is not a "small business".

Insurance companies writing polices for retail stores have clear guidelines for public and employee safety as well as loss due to theft.
They will not cover losses or lawsuits if the written policy is not followed, when it comes to insurance coverage of missing, lost and stolen deposits. There is very clear and strict guidelines.

Looking at this event from with a "loss prevention" perspective, there is something clearly wrong here.

If the store management/staff did not violate company policy by doing a unsecured night drop, and the staff were following all the coperate policies and procedures, the risk for a law suit from the employees because of employer negligence would be substantial for such a large company.

Posted on: 2007/12/29 21:03
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Re: Newport Centre Mall: GameStop store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say
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Thats exactly the point - It costs money to get armed guards to collect the money and deposit it for you (sometimes the cost is based on the amount they collect and deposit for you).
If you get an employee to deposit the money it costs you nothing.

Insurance will cover the money lost and the employee will be covered (medical costs) by being a victim of crime - Cheap and typical of small business and how they value their staff. Why pay for insurance and also money collections

Posted on: 2007/12/29 20:49
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Re: Newport Centre Mall: GameStop store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say
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SpyderVash wrote:
Just one more reason I hate that company. In that store they started making us take the deposits to the bank at night, when it used to be perfectly fine to take them during the day, while there is security around and there's light outside.

I'm surprised that they gave the manager off today, but it didn't surprise me when I found out that they still expect him to be back at work by tomorrow.

Next I'm sure they'll blame him saying that he should've taken a different route to the bank or walked faster.


I'm not sure what type of volume that store does and how many days worth of deposits this entailed, but asking any employee to do a night drop when the bank is not located in the mall is insane. The cost of deposit pickups is pennies when you look at the big picture and the safety of the staff.


Save-a-buck > Staff Safety

It's sad too, they weren't always like that

Posted on: 2007/12/29 18:15
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Re: Newport Centre Mall: GameStop store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say
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SpyderVash wrote:
Just one more reason I hate that company. In that store they started making us take the deposits to the bank at night, when it used to be perfectly fine to take them during the day, while there is security around and there's light outside.

I'm surprised that they gave the manager off today, but it didn't surprise me when I found out that they still expect him to be back at work by tomorrow.

Next I'm sure they'll blame him saying that he should've taken a different route to the bank or walked faster.


I'm not sure what type of volume that store does and how many days worth of deposits this entailed, but asking any employee to do a night drop when the bank is not located in the mall is insane. The cost of deposit pickups is pennies when you look at the big picture and the safety of the staff.

Posted on: 2007/12/29 17:46
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Re: Newport Centre Mall: GameStop store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say
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Just one more reason I hate that company. In that store they started making us take the deposits to the bank at night, when it used to be perfectly fine to take them during the day, while there is security around and there's light outside.

I'm surprised that they gave the manager off today, but it didn't surprise me when I found out that they still expect him to be back at work by tomorrow.

Next I'm sure they'll blame him saying that he should've taken a different route to the bank or walked faster.

Posted on: 2007/12/29 17:31
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Newport Centre Mall: GameStop store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say
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Store employees beaten, robbed of $27G, cops say

Jersey Journal
by Paul Koepp
December 28

Two employees of GameStop at the Newport Centre Mall in Jersey City were beaten up and robbed of over $27,000 in cash from the store as they left the mall last night, police said yesterday.

According to police, officers responded to a reported assault at the Hudson-Bergen Light Rail station at Newport at about 10:30 p.m. They found a GameStop manager and a sales associate who seemed disoriented and said they couldn't remember what had happened, reports said.

The 21-year-old manager had a swollen right cheek, and was missing a black bag containing $27,132.06 in cash that he was taking to deposit at a bank, police said. Reports said the sales associate, complaining of pain and dizziness, had a bruise near her left eye and was taken to Jersey City Medical Center. A hospital spokesman said information on her condition was unavailable.

Another store employee told police he had left the mall with the two victims and taken garbage to a nearby trash compactor, but about a minute later, he saw two men running toward J.C.
Penney, where they got in a gray Jeep and sped south on Mall Drive East toward Sixth Street, with the GameStop manager running after them, reports said.

Security footage from Macy's shows two men following the victim away from the mall and a third man walking toward the Jeep, but the attack was not caught on tape, police said.
Calls to the store and its corporate office in Texas were not returned today.

Police said it is not unusual for stores to make cash deposits late at night and that banks often have night drop-off services.

Posted on: 2007/12/29 16:31
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