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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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Since were talkin Newark. Is this scary or what?
Newark police arrest teen accused of having Uzi near school
2/17/2006, 4:32 p.m. ET
The Associated Press

NEWARK, N.J. (AP) — Police arrested an 18-year-old high school graduate Friday morning, accusing him of carrying a loaded Uzi submachine gun near his alma mater.

Authorities said the arrest was made after a security guard at Weequahic High School notified a city police officer assigned to the school that a group of four teens may be armed with a gun. The police officer detained the teens as they walked through a nearby alley. He noticed a bulge in the jacket of one of the boys, Keith Canyon, who was arrested, officials said.

The weapon was hanging around Canyon's neck by a shoestring, police said.

Also another "argument" in Hoboken yesterday between teenagers. One dead, gun.

Posted on: 2006/2/18 18:55
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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Quote:

elgoodo wrote:
Quote:

mimosa wrote:
i agree w/the others...as a former resident of newark, i had my doubts about JC back in the day, downtown was much more sketchy than my old neighborhood. but nyc has spread, and jc benefited. newark has been poised, even named 'the renaissance city', and i think now that people are looking outside of JC for a deal (and access to PATH) newark will prosper....and sharpe will finally get out of office...
a walk in downtown newark, and along ferry street will tell you the better...(so long as you have a base of comparison)


From what I know (admittedly, not much) about the subject, I do agree that getting Sharpe James out of office would be a decent start. And yeah, I'm well aware that there are relatively safe, relatively nice sections of Newark.

I do wonder if the stigma of Newark is as strong for people who haven't lived around here forever. If you say the words "Newark, New Jersey" to someone who grew up in Boston, does it mean the same thing to them as it does to people around here? The fact is the stigma is so strong that you couldn't pay most people around here to live in Newark. JimmyConway's reaction is typical. But the same was once true of many places. People used to say "Alphabet City" as if you needed a bullet proof jacket to walk from Avenue B to Avenue C.

And yeah, I have friends who grew up in Jersey City who used to talk about downtown in similar terms. 20 years ago, there were people who grew up and lived in Jersey City who were frightened to set foot in downtown after dark. So there you go. A lot of it is perception, and I think the perception of Newark has to change before the city actually does.



I do understand that there are ok neighborhoods in Newark, the Ironbound for example. It is a very ethnic neighborhood populated by many portugese immigrants. My sister dated a guy who lived in this area. It kind of reminded me of parts of linden with its polish population. But, just the other day I was driving through the Clinton Hill section on my way to Rt 78 from Irvington and that area of Newark is just a dump. I definitely saw drug dealers openly selling on the street corners. I understand that the rents are going up, but Newark does have a stigma attached to it. It will be awhile before a large amount of young urban professionals move there with their families. In Newark, it does not matter who is elected, their political machine will take control of a person with even the best intentions. Sharpe James should have lost the last election to that young candidate who opposed him, but the political machine would not let that happen.

Posted on: 2006/2/18 16:36
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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mimosa wrote:
i agree w/the others...as a former resident of newark, i had my doubts about JC back in the day, downtown was much more sketchy than my old neighborhood. but nyc has spread, and jc benefited. newark has been poised, even named 'the renaissance city', and i think now that people are looking outside of JC for a deal (and access to PATH) newark will prosper....and sharpe will finally get out of office...
a walk in downtown newark, and along ferry street will tell you the better...(so long as you have a base of comparison)


From what I know (admittedly, not much) about the subject, I do agree that getting Sharpe James out of office would be a decent start. And yeah, I'm well aware that there are relatively safe, relatively nice sections of Newark.

I do wonder if the stigma of Newark is as strong for people who haven't lived around here forever. If you say the words "Newark, New Jersey" to someone who grew up in Boston, does it mean the same thing to them as it does to people around here? The fact is the stigma is so strong that you couldn't pay most people around here to live in Newark. JimmyConway's reaction is typical. But the same was once true of many places. People used to say "Alphabet City" as if you needed a bullet proof jacket to walk from Avenue B to Avenue C.

And yeah, I have friends who grew up in Jersey City who used to talk about downtown in similar terms. 20 years ago, there were people who grew up and lived in Jersey City who were frightened to set foot in downtown after dark. So there you go. A lot of it is perception, and I think the perception of Newark has to change before the city actually does.

Posted on: 2006/2/18 1:27
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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JimmyConway wrote:
I dont care how high the rents go, I would never move to Newark. It will be a very, very long time before Newark becomes gentrified, if ever.


i agree w/the others...as a former resident of newark, i had my doubts about JC back in the day, downtown was much more sketchy than my old neighborhood. but nyc has spread, and jc benefited. newark has been poised, even named 'the renaissance city', and i think now that people are looking outside of JC for a deal (and access to PATH) newark will prosper....and sharpe will finally get out of office...
a walk in downtown newark, and along ferry street will tell you the better...(so long as you have a base of comparison)

Posted on: 2006/2/18 0:56
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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rory_bellows wrote:
Funny, I was just talking to someone who grew up in Newark and still lives there, and says the real estate there is soaring (relative term). Seriously, hard as that may be to believe to anyone who grew up around here. And Metro Homes, the place that's partnering with Trump in JC, is building this monstrous... neighborhood, really, in Newark. Things are just insane. Get 'em while they're still affordable, while you still can! Look out Utica, Newark's a city on the grow!


That Whole Foods will be moving into Irvington any day now.

Real estate tycoons won't be happy until you cannot afford to live within one hour of New York City unless you have a household income of over 200k. Where the hell are all of these rich people coming from?

Seriously though, I do hope Newark comes back to some extent. It would be nice.

Posted on: 2006/2/17 23:32
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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Pisces1979 wrote:
...um that's why I said "new yorker" in quotes...

for example, Brit/french/indian/etc. expat comes to Manhattan works for bank realizes that he can't raise his family in the overpriced manhattan rental they have had for the whole three months they have been here, hears about new jersey and gets suckered into paying waaaay to much for a house in the heights, by realtor who passes it off as suburban because it has a backyard.

But these people have eyes. Unless they are buying sight unseen they will see the urban landscape. These people are not totally clueless, they were transfered here because they are smart people. As far as paying way too much, the prices are what they are and if the buyer is happy with the purchase then all is well and we have some new neighbors. Re Newark: I have been in areas of the northern part of the city that actually are suburban, really quite nice.

Posted on: 2006/2/17 23:02
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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JimmyConway wrote:
I dont care how high the rents go, I would never move to Newark. It will be a very, very long time before Newark becomes gentrified, if ever.


I apologize in advance for veering off topic-

Funny, I was just talking to someone who grew up in Newark and still lives there, and says the real estate there is soaring (relative term). Seriously, hard as that may be to believe to anyone who grew up around here. And Metro Homes, the place that's partnering with Trump in JC, is building this monstrous... neighborhood, really, in Newark. Things are just insane. Get 'em while they're still affordable, while you still can! Look out Utica, Newark's a city on the grow!

Posted on: 2006/2/17 22:29
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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...um that's why I said "new yorker" in quotes...

for example, Brit/french/indian/etc. expat comes to Manhattan works for bank realizes that he can't raise his family in the overpriced manhattan rental they have had for the whole three months they have been here, hears about new jersey and gets suckered into paying waaaay to much for a house in the heights, by realtor who passes it off as suburban because it has a backyard.

Back to the topic, I do agree that any development will cause big time traffic problems in hamilton park. What I am suggesting is working with the developer to create housing that would be geared towards single proffessionals or elderly people. Those two groups of people would be less likely to drive everywhere, wereas a family is gonna get a couple of cars to drive the kids everywhere. You could do this by making all the units in the building studio apartments.

Posted on: 2006/2/17 22:27
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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But you said:

"alot of the "New Yorker" families who are being brought into the area by developers would probably be better off in West Orange, New Brunswick, or Parsipanny than Jersey City, and I feel they are tricked into moving to Jersey City"

Please make up your mind. "Expats from India or England " or '"New Yorker" Families'???

BTW, are "New Yorker " families - families that read the New Yorker magazine? Just curious. Thanks, Pisces.

Quote:

Pisces1979 wrote:
... I see alot of the Expats from India or England who come over here to work for the banks, and buy and/or rent in Jersey City and the realtors pass the neighborhoods off as suburban to them because they really don't know any better, especially in places like the heights.
"Look this place has backyards and nice historic houses, it's very suburban!"



Posted on: 2006/2/17 22:14
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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... I see alot of the Expats from India or England who come over here to work for the banks, and buy and/or rent in Jersey City and the realtors pass the neighborhoods off as suburban to them because they really don't know any better, especially in places like the heights.
"Look this place has backyards and nice historic houses, it's very suburban!"



Posted on: 2006/2/17 22:03
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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super_furry wrote:
The JCLIST Webmaster gives the Genius Awards once a year. You are a shoe in since Bouncing Soul/aka MrT no longer posts!


I still have my doubts that he's gone away.

Posted on: 2006/2/17 21:55
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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super_furry wrote:
IThe JCLIST Webmaster gives the Genius Awards once a year. You are a shoe in since Bouncing Soul/aka MrT no longer posts!



OOOhhhh is this a black tie gala event?

Posted on: 2006/2/17 21:51
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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If they do get tricked, they would have to be extremely gullible. Could you give some examples of this misrepresentation?

The JCLIST Webmaster gives the Genius Awards once a year. You are a shoe in since Bouncing Soul/aka MrT no longer posts!

Quote:

Pisces1979 wrote:I feel they are tricked into moving to Jersey City, because this City is often misrepresented as a "suburb".

Posted on: 2006/2/17 21:46
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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I dont care how high the rents go, I would never move to Newark. It will be a very, very long time before Newark becomes gentrified, if ever.

Posted on: 2006/2/17 21:34
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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Pisces1979 wrote:
I agree totally, alot of the "New Yorker" families who are being brought into the area by developers would probably be better off in West Orange, New Brunswick, or Parsipanny than Jersey City, and I feel they are tricked into moving to Jersey City, because this City is often misrepresented as a "suburb".
Especially since many young people have been priced right out of downtown to Journal Square, and will be forced to move to Newark in a couple of years unless the rents stop soaring.


Newark's dying for it.

I don't know that anyone thinks that JC is a suburb. I really have never met anyone who thinks that.

Posted on: 2006/2/17 21:32
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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I agree totally, alot of the "New Yorker" families who are being brought into the area by developers would probably be better off in West Orange, New Brunswick, or Parsipanny than Jersey City, and I feel they are tricked into moving to Jersey City, because this City is often misrepresented as a "suburb".
Especially since many young people have been priced right out of downtown to Journal Square, and will be forced to move to Newark in a couple of years unless the rents stop soaring.

Quote:

ccitizen wrote:
I don't think that is a fair characterization. Ms. Davis had a very strong argument for why this variance should be granted and I appreciate her objectivity in handling this issue (I assume in her heart she would want a smaller project).

I live one half block from the development and I can tell you that while i and others may not be as vocal as the opponents, there are quite a few people that are happy to see this location developed. we think packing 80-99 units of townhouses onto two deadend streets would be very awkward and would make deliveries, etc. much more problematic.

Also, many people don't have a problem with allowing young, singles to plant roots here. even hoboken is starting to "grow up" as college students that moved in 10-15 years ago are bringing up families in the new developments along the water. I just mention that because there seems to be a bit of a bias toward only encouraging families to move into the area and I don't think that is good or fair.

Posted on: 2006/2/17 21:27
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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I don't think so, but it would be great if it was available online.

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ccitizen wrote:

Question: Is there a public domain where you can find the documents submitted in the BOA meetings other than just going to the office?


Posted on: 2006/2/17 21:16
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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That referred to the idea that the variance "sailed through." I thought it passed based on objective standards as opposed to "appropriateness" let's say.

I appreciate your group - like the new blog. I understand that your intentions are in the right place even though I may not agree with you on every point.

I do happen to agree with you regarding the benefit Ms. Davis provides to JC. She really is impressive.

My point is, I think Ms. Davis would probably personally agree with the people that wanted the project scaled down further. I appreciate the fact that her memo/argument was objective and made a case for approving this project even though her own sentiment might be different (I don't know her and can't say for sure one way or the other). Her memo made a case for allowing them to build this many units on a site of this size.



Question: Is there a public domain where you can find the documents submitted in the BOA meetings other than just going to the office?


Posted on: 2006/2/17 20:19
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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I'm not sure I follow you. I think it was a good decision, and the compromise that the developer made was right on. The city is lucky to have Ms. Davis.

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ccitizen wrote:
I don't think that is a fair characterization. Ms. Davis had a very strong argument for why this variance should be granted and I appreciate her objectivity in handling this issue (I assume in her heart she would want a smaller project).

Posted on: 2006/2/17 20:09
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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I don't think that is a fair characterization. Ms. Davis had a very strong argument for why this variance should be granted and I appreciate her objectivity in handling this issue (I assume in her heart she would want a smaller project).

I live one half block from the development and I can tell you that while i and others may not be as vocal as the opponents, there are quite a few people that are happy to see this location developed. we think packing 80-99 units of townhouses onto two deadend streets would be very awkward and would make deliveries, etc. much more problematic.

Also, many people don't have a problem with allowing young, singles to plant roots here. even hoboken is starting to "grow up" as college students that moved in 10-15 years ago are bringing up families in the new developments along the water. I just mention that because there seems to be a bit of a bias toward only encouraging families to move into the area and I don't think that is good or fair.

Posted on: 2006/2/17 19:37
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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The variance sailed through the Zoning Board tonight. The board responded to comments from a fair number of outraged residents, responded to questions peppered at them by a lawyer hired by a neighbor, and a featherweight planning expert tried to refute some of the information presented by the former head of the Jersey City Planning Department..

Read more at the blog: www.25mc.com

Posted on: 2006/2/17 3:48
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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Not allowing people to own cars for the first 5 years, what the hell is this, college?


Don't try to make sense out of what he says. Your head might just explode.

In Soviet Russia, car owns you after 5 years.

Posted on: 2006/2/16 20:31
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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Posted on: 2006/2/16 20:31
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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Are you the same Peter Mocco that is building Liberty Harbor North off of Grand St? If so, you've received a fair share of variances in your time developing in JC and Hudson County.

Posted on: 2006/2/16 20:10
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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Pisces1979 wrote:
Oh yeah, what about senior housing? According to this times article Senior housing is the hot new market.

"Hot Niche in the Rental Market: Housing for the Elderly"

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/02/15/rea ... /commercial/15senior.html

They are quiet, won't burden the school system, and they are less likely to drive.

Maybe you could make the developer turn this development into senior only housing?


Maybe they should turn it into affordable housing for the non-producers.

Posted on: 2006/2/16 20:06
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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Oh yeah, what about senior housing? According to this times article Senior housing is the hot new market.

"Hot Niche in the Rental Market: Housing for the Elderly"

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/02/15/rea ... /commercial/15senior.html

They are quiet, won't burden the school system, and they are less likely to drive.

Maybe you could make the developer turn this development into senior only housing?

Posted on: 2006/2/16 19:48
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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Peter, I'm right by the project as well. I guess I'm part of the minority that supports this project and others like it. The more bodies that are living in this area increases the chances of us getting more amenities and increasing safety. Maybe even some "fantasy" things like extending the light rail up along 10th street.

Zoning is not some monolith that never changes. This is a growing area, even booming area. Places can be upzoned as well as downzoned. Especially places that are not in the historic district. I don't think the skyscrapers along Park Ave take away from the beauty of the townhouses in Murry Hill.

I'm not equating this area to Midtown Manhattan today but at one point midtown was residential. I think things have worked out well.

We live in an urban area first and a historic area second no matter how you slice it. This are will grow.


Posted on: 2006/2/16 19:35
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
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Pisces1979 wrote:
Honestly, there is a housing shortage, the whole NYC/NJ metro area is going to have a 20 percent increase in population over the next 20 years, the only way to house that population increase is by building upwards.

Now, It sounds like you biggest issue is the fact that all the units are going to be going to proffesionals who will all insist on owning their own cars and driving everywhere instead of taking public transportation.

Building more parking lots into a building is like widening a highway, initially it will cut congestion, but it will just encourage more people to drive.

In the Netherlands, the social policy is to make all new development transit friendly as possible.

Here is what they could do in Jersey City, by forcing developers to pay for bicycle racks and bicycle lanes in the neighborhood, making developers to partner with car sharing agencies like "zip car", and condo sales agreements that mean that any buyer of a condo in a new development has to not own a car for the first 5 years of residence under pain of being sued.

Quote:

PeterMoccoJr wrote:
I have viewed the changes that have been proposed. And I concede that they have lowered the amount of units. That is not enough. What I fail to understand is why these developers feel the need to put up mid-rise buildings in an area zoned for townhouses?

They have lowered the amount of units from an almost 80% increase to a 33% increase over the current zoning. All I am asking (hoping), is that we do not allow developers to pay almost a quarter of million dollars into a fund for the city that will in turn, give them a variance allowing them to overdevelop our neighborhood. To me, that is unacceptable.

I repeat: What is wrong with building townhouses?

I urge members of our community to go to this meeting and voice their opinions about this project. All it can do is help. At the very least, the developers will have to come back to the table with better plan.

I live here, you live here, and together we can make a difference if we just stand up and voice our opinions. Please come to the meeting tomorrow night.

Peter Jr.


Not allowing people to own cars for the first 5 years, what the hell is this, college?

Posted on: 2006/2/16 19:12
----------------------
"Here comes the Irishman to take all you guinea's money."- Goodfellas
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
#5
Just can't stay away
Just can't stay away


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Honestly, there is a housing shortage, the whole NYC/NJ metro area is going to have a 20 percent increase in population over the next 20 years, the only way to house that population increase is by building upwards.

Now, It sounds like you biggest issue is the fact that all the units are going to be going to proffesionals who will all insist on owning their own cars and driving everywhere instead of taking public transportation.

Building more parking lots into a building is like widening a highway, initially it will cut congestion, but it will just encourage more people to drive.

In the Netherlands, the social policy is to make all new development transit friendly as possible.

Here is what they could do in Jersey City, by forcing developers to pay for bicycle racks and bicycle lanes in the neighborhood, making developers to partner with car sharing agencies like "zip car", and condo sales agreements that mean that any buyer of a condo in a new development has to not own a car for the first 5 years of residence under pain of being sued.

Quote:

PeterMoccoJr wrote:
I have viewed the changes that have been proposed. And I concede that they have lowered the amount of units. That is not enough. What I fail to understand is why these developers feel the need to put up mid-rise buildings in an area zoned for townhouses?

They have lowered the amount of units from an almost 80% increase to a 33% increase over the current zoning. All I am asking (hoping), is that we do not allow developers to pay almost a quarter of million dollars into a fund for the city that will in turn, give them a variance allowing them to overdevelop our neighborhood. To me, that is unacceptable.

I repeat: What is wrong with building townhouses?

I urge members of our community to go to this meeting and voice their opinions about this project. All it can do is help. At the very least, the developers will have to come back to the table with better plan.

I live here, you live here, and together we can make a difference if we just stand up and voice our opinions. Please come to the meeting tomorrow night.

Peter Jr.

Posted on: 2006/2/16 18:46
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Re: Stop 171 Units On Brunswick!! New Date- 2/16/06 at 6:00 pm
#4
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I have viewed the changes that have been proposed. And I concede that they have lowered the amount of units. That is not enough. What I fail to understand is why these developers feel the need to put up mid-rise buildings in an area zoned for townhouses?

They have lowered the amount of units from an almost 80% increase to a 33% increase over the current zoning. All I am asking (hoping), is that we do not allow developers to pay almost a quarter of million dollars into a fund for the city that will in turn, give them a variance allowing them to overdevelop our neighborhood. To me, that is unacceptable.

I repeat: What is wrong with building townhouses?

I urge members of our community to go to this meeting and voice their opinions about this project. All it can do is help. At the very least, the developers will have to come back to the table with better plan.

I live here, you live here, and together we can make a difference if we just stand up and voice our opinions. Please come to the meeting tomorrow night.

Peter Jr.

Posted on: 2006/2/16 0:47
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