bodhipooh wrote:
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Conformist wrote:
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bodhipooh wrote:
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hero69 wrote:
somewhere i mentioned that jersey city should require developers to put up stylish buildings in exchange for tax abatements instead of the ugly sh-t that is currently going up.

http://therealdeal.com/blog/2015/01/1 ... d-for-yotel-williamsburg/

Are you suggesting that is a stylish building?? That's a FUGLY design that is completely out of place with the character of its surroundings. I am all for development and improving neighborhoods (heck, I am almost always baffled by those that rant against gentrification) but this is atrocious overall. This is what the area looks like now:

Google Maps - Street View - 646 Lorimer St.

The new Yotel building is pretty silly, I agree, but given how atrocious that part of Williamsburg (really, all of Williamsburg...) looks now, I don't see what's worth saving about its current "character".

Regardless of what that particular area may look like now, there is a certain character to the surroundings. A good design and architect team could and should be able to come up with a design that meshes better into the neighborhood. It doesn't have to be like everything else around it, but it could complement it all. Heck, even modern buildings can complement a historic area by using and/or adapting certain elements.

Conformist wrote:
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bodhipooh wrote:
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hero69 wrote:
somewhere i mentioned that jersey city should require developers to put up stylish buildings in exchange for tax abatements instead of the ugly sh-t that is currently going up.

http://therealdeal.com/blog/2015/01/1 ... d-for-yotel-williamsburg/

Are you suggesting that is a stylish building?? That's a FUGLY design that is completely out of place with the character of its surroundings. I am all for development and improving neighborhoods (heck, I am almost always baffled by those that rant against gentrification) but this is atrocious overall. This is what the area looks like now:

Google Maps - Street View - 646 Lorimer St.

The new Yotel building is pretty silly, I agree, but given how atrocious that part of Williamsburg (really, all of Williamsburg...) looks now, I don't see what's worth saving about its current "character".

bodhipooh wrote:
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hero69 wrote:
somewhere i mentioned that jersey city should require developers to put up stylish buildings in exchange for tax abatements instead of the ugly sh-t that is currently going up.

http://therealdeal.com/blog/2015/01/1 ... d-for-yotel-williamsburg/

Are you suggesting that is a stylish building?? That's a FUGLY design that is completely out of place with the character of its surroundings. I am all for development and improving neighborhoods (heck, I am almost always baffled by those that rant against gentrification) but this is atrocious overall. This is what the area looks like now:

Google Maps - Street View - 646 Lorimer St.

hero69 wrote:
somewhere i mentioned that jersey city should require developers to put up stylish buildings in exchange for tax abatements instead of the ugly sh-t that is currently going up.

http://therealdeal.com/blog/2015/01/1 ... d-for-yotel-williamsburg/

WhoElseCouldIBe wrote:
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FakeGreenDress wrote:
I don't think they're putting an elevator on the Marin side at all. From an article about the ADA compliance lawsuit: "In a document filed Thursday, the Port Authority agreed to construct an elevator at the southwest entrance to the station and a passenger vertical platform lift on the west side of the station."

How much you wanna bet that 2 of the 3 entrances will be closed at one time? :)

FakeGreenDress wrote:
I don't think they're putting an elevator on the Marin side at all. From an article about the ADA compliance lawsuit: "In a document filed Thursday, the Port Authority agreed to construct an elevator at the southwest entrance to the station and a passenger vertical platform lift on the west side of the station."

Voyeur wrote:


It looks pretty clear from the renderings that the Marin entrance to the Grove PATH will be closed for a very long time in order to create this hotel.

JCMan8 wrote:
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Voyeur wrote:
Anyone interested in more up to date renderings of what the hotel will look like when built can find them here...

It looks pretty clear from the renderings that the Marin entrance to the Grove PATH will be closed for a very long time in order to create this hotel.

Voyeur wrote:
Anyone interested in more up to date renderings of what the hotel will look like when built can find them here...

Voyeur wrote:
Anyone interested in more up to date renderings of what the hotel will look like when built can find them here...

greenville wrote:
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hero69 wrote:
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greenville wrote:
This is why I don't like the political system in Hudson county. One party controls all parts of the government. You get different choices of faces but not different choices in ideology which appears that you just figured out. I may not like Republicans but I rather have a couple of them in city and county government to keep the democratic political machines in check.

i believe for mayor shundler (a republican) used to hand out tax abatements like coaches hand out condoms

But you can argue that during the time Shundler was mayor Jersey City was up and coming and needed, not what it is now since DTJC has become good enough to stand on its own. But I just want another party that can fight back against the Democratic political machine but that may be just pipe dreams.

hero69 wrote:
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greenville wrote:
This is why I don't like the political system in Hudson county. One party controls all parts of the government. You get different choices of faces but not different choices in ideology which appears that you just figured out. I may not like Republicans but I rather have a couple of them in city and county government to keep the democratic political machines in check.

i believe for mayor shundler (a republican) used to hand out tax abatements like coaches hand out condoms

greenville wrote:
This is why I don't like the political system in Hudson county. One party controls all parts of the government. You get different choices of faces but not different choices in ideology which appears that you just figured out. I may not like Republicans but I rather have a couple of them in city and county government to keep the democratic political machines in check.

Bubble_Tea wrote:
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Frank_M wrote:
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Bubble_Tea wrote:
Props to the Marriott team for having the skills and patience to navigate through Jersey City's maze of bureaucracy and corruption to get this deal done. It's businesses like these that are making JC a better place to live and bring growth and wealth to the community.

Do you know whether the developers? commitment to moving forward with the project was contingent on receiving a tax abatement? I didn?t read that anywhere. Sure they applied for one?it would have been foolish not to?but did they absolutely need it?

However the process works, I can tell you that the city is not giving away abatements where it knows it can secure equivalent development projects on the same land for the ordinary amount of tax revenue.

But as with all negotiations, it's hard to know what Mariott's "bottom line" was. I'm sure they began negotiations by asking for even more of a discount and the city began with less of a discount.

Frank_M wrote:
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Bubble_Tea wrote:
Props to the Marriott team for having the skills and patience to navigate through Jersey City's maze of bureaucracy and corruption to get this deal done. It's businesses like these that are making JC a better place to live and bring growth and wealth to the community.

Do you know whether the developers? commitment to moving forward with the project was contingent on receiving a tax abatement? I didn?t read that anywhere. Sure they applied for one?it would have been foolish not to?but did they absolutely need it?

Bubble_Tea wrote:
Props to the Marriott team for having the skills and patience to navigate through Jersey City's maze of bureaucracy and corruption to get this deal done. It's businesses like these that are making JC a better place to live and bring growth and wealth to the community.

Yvonne wrote:
I do not agree with some people that hotels do not use city services. Police department is a large part of the budget, hotels will encounter all types of problems that will tie up the police department. As an example, before Newport Mall was built, it was someone easy to have a cop response to a problem downtown. After the mall, they became tied up with petty crimes from stealing to other matters. Citizens then started complaining about police officers showing up the next day to take a report.

Sully wrote:
Disgusting and shameful - to approve this turd of a building to hang over the not-easy-on-they-eyes glass-can-sorry-no-elevator-PATH-entrance... and give away so much for so little in return.

This has got to be one of the most commercially desirable spots in the city - and we're giving up millions in tax revenue, for something that will be an eyesore for decades, without extracting any meaningful benefits to the residents of the city.

Politics at its worst - shame on Mayor Fulop and city council for pushing this through.

Yvonne wrote:
I do not agree with some people that hotels do not use city services. Police department is a large part of the budget, hotels will encounter all types of problems that will tie up the police department. As an example, before Newport Mall was built, it was someone easy to have a cop response to a problem downtown. After the mall, they became tied up with petty crimes from stealing to other matters. Citizens then started complaining about police officers showing up the next day to take a report.

score09 wrote:
Tax abatement.

What's that? What is an abatement? In this particular case, it is a lessening of tax that this hotel will pay to the city over a twenty year period, right?

So, somebody please help me out here. Because it seems to me that a 152 room hotel at 80 Columbus ought pay approximately $1,000,000 (one million) to $1,500,000 (one million five hundred thousand) per year in property tax to the city. At least this amount. Am I close? So then, a million dollars per year amounts to twenty million over twenty years. So, twenty million in lost tax revenue is what all the hub bub is about.

But, there was talk of an 11 million dollar Payment In Lieu, so right there, were down to 9 million. And there were other sweeteners as well, further mitigating the "give-away."

Bottom line, in a city with 250,000 people, the amount paid by John Q. taxpayer for this abatement is negligible. The question in my mind is why are we allowing for another corporate entity to snake its way into the prime real estate zone. THIS will have lasting consequences. For a brief time, Jersey City was cool, but then came the capitalists, with their Marriots, and Westins and Hyatts. Who decided that this address -- 80 Columbus -- is fit for a corporate hotel entity? I'd rather a museum, concert hall or University building.