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Re: Jersey City leaders cheer federal judge's finding that "stop and frisk" violates Constitution
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Typical, the same idiots who scream don't take my gun(s) away because its unconstitutional, however go ahead and stop and frisk minorities even though its violates the constitution. Disgusting.

Posted on: 2013/8/14 15:42
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Re: Jersey City leaders cheer federal judge's finding that "stop and frisk" violates Constitution
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VA2015 - might want to educate yourself on the meaning and context of a quote before you use it to make a point:

http://www.lawfareblog.com/2011/07/what-ben-franklin-really-said/

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The words appear originally in a 1755 letter that Franklin is presumed to have written on behalf of the Pennsylvania Assembly to the colonial governor during the French and Indian War. The letter was a salvo in a power struggle between the governor and the Assembly over funding for security on the frontier, one in which the Assembly wished to tax the lands of the Penn family, which ruled Pennsylvania from afar, to raise money for defense against French and Indian attacks. The governor kept vetoing the Assembly?s efforts at the behest of the family, which had appointed him. So to start matters, Franklin was writing not as a subject being asked to cede his liberty to government, but in his capacity as a legislator being asked to renounce his power to tax lands notionally under his jurisdiction. In other words, the ?essential liberty? to which Franklin referred was thus not what we would think of today as civil liberties but, rather, the right of self-governance of a legislature in the interests of collective security.

What?s more the ?purchase [of] a little temporary safety? of which Franklin complains was not the ceding of power to a government Leviathan in exchange for some promise of protection from external threat; for in Franklin?s letter, the word ?purchase? does not appear to have been a metaphor. The governor was accusing the Assembly of stalling on appropriating money for frontier defense by insisting on including the Penn lands in its taxes?and thus triggering his intervention. And the Penn family later offered cash to fund defense of the frontier?as long as the Assembly would acknowledge that it lacked the power to tax the family?s lands. Franklin was thus complaining of the choice facing the legislature between being able to make funds available for frontier defense and maintaining its right of self-governance?and he was criticizing the governor for suggesting it should be willing to give up the latter to ensure the former.

In short, Franklin was not describing some tension between government power and individual liberty. He was describing, rather, effective self-government in the service of security as the very liberty it would be contemptible to trade. Notwithstanding the way the quotation has come down to us, Franklin saw the liberty and security interests of Pennsylvanians as aligned.
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[quote]
VA2015 wrote:
[quote]
JC_Man wrote:
Please read Wednesday Aug 13 WSJ editorial on this to see how the wacko judge arrived at her ruling.

The same minorities that are "hurt" and "violated" by this policy will now be getting killed and shot even more.


"Those who would sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither" - Ben Franklin

Posted on: 2013/8/14 15:33
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Re: Jersey City leaders cheer federal judge's finding that "stop and frisk" violates Constitution
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Everyone quotes this Ben Franklin line as if they actually understand it.

This article is a joke and the ruling is an even bigger joke.

WTF is going on this country? Where did common sense go??

As previous posters mentioned, what exactly is Mr. William Braker doing to stem the violence in Greenville? Probably about as much as Cory Booker did in Newark (spoiler alert: the answer is NOTHING).

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VA2015 wrote:
Quote:

JC_Man wrote:
Please read Wednesday Aug 13 WSJ editorial on this to see how the wacko judge arrived at her ruling.

The same minorities that are "hurt" and "violated" by this policy will now be getting killed and shot even more.


"Those who would sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither" - Ben Franklin

Posted on: 2013/8/14 15:28
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Re: Jersey City leaders cheer federal judge's finding that "stop and frisk" violates Constitution
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Quote:

JC_Man wrote:
Please read Wednesday Aug 13 WSJ editorial on this to see how the wacko judge arrived at her ruling.

The same minorities that are "hurt" and "violated" by this policy will now be getting killed and shot even more.


"Those who would sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither" - Ben Franklin

Posted on: 2013/8/14 15:20
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Re: Jersey City leaders cheer federal judge's finding that "stop and frisk" violates Constitution
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Looks like the New York (Jersey City???) will be modeling Chicago's "wild west" law enforcement policy which is let the gang bangers kill each other and hope that collateral damage will be minimal (with all due respect to the innocent victims in these neighborhoods).

Posted on: 2013/8/14 12:43
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Re: Jersey City leaders cheer federal judge's finding that "stop and frisk" violates Constitution
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Mayor Bloomberg emphasized that the police have focused their efforts at keeping black and Hispanic minorities safe, as they are disproportionally the victims as well as the perpetrators of crime.

Posted on: 2013/8/14 12:06
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Re: Jersey City leaders cheer federal judge's finding that "stop and frisk" violates Constitution
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I'd love to know what these same Jersey City 'leaders' have been doing to reduce the black on black crime in, say, Greenville. How's that been working for them?

Posted on: 2013/8/14 12:06
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Re: Jersey City leaders cheer federal judge's finding that "stop and frisk" violates Constitution
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Please read Wednesday Aug 13 WSJ editorial on this to see how the wacko judge arrived at her ruling.

The same minorities that are "hurt" and "violated" by this policy will now be getting killed and shot even more.

Posted on: 2013/8/14 9:15
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Jersey City leaders cheer federal judge's finding that "stop and frisk" violates Constitution
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Jersey City leaders cheer federal judge's finding that "stop and frisk" violates Constitution

By Terrence T. McDonald/The Jersey Journal
August 13, 2013 at 1:03 PM

Jersey City officials yesterday applauded a federal judge who found the New York City Police Department?s ?stop and frisk? tactics violate the constitutional rights of minorities.

William Braker, president of the Jersey City branch of the NAACP, said the NYPD?s tactics are a ?blatant violation of the Constitution.?

?It?s indirect racial profiling, and it should have been stopped long ago,? Braker told The Jersey Journal. ?I?m glad we don?t have it here in Jersey City, and I hope we never do.?

In the decision issued yesterday, Judge Shira A. Scheindlin ruled that police officers have for years stopped innocent people in the street without any objective reason to suspect them of criminality.

?The city?s highest officials have turned a blind eye to the evidence that officers are conducting stops in a racially discriminatory manner,? she wrote.

New York Police Commissioner Ray Kelly yesterday said it is ?recklessly untrue? that his department engages in racial profiling.

James Shea, a retired NYPD deputy chief, has been tapped by Jersey City Mayor Steve Fulop to be the city?s new public safety director. In public appearances, Shea has repeatedly said he believes indiscriminately stopping people and frisking them without cause is a constitutional violation.

?Police officers nationwide have the right to stop a person if they are investigating a crime and police officers have the right to frisk an individual for the safety of themselves or the person they are with,? Shea said in a statement from the city. ?However, a policy using stop and frisk with the intention of altering an individual?s behavior would be unconstitutional.?

In her ruling, Scheindlin called for a federal monitor to oversee reforms to the NYPD?s compliance with the Constitution. She noted that she was not ordering an end to stop-and-frisk entirely, saying the NYPD?s tactics need to be remedied.

http://www.nj.com/jjournal-news/index ... y_leaders_cheer_fede.html

Posted on: 2013/8/14 4:15
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