Thanks for the replies so far!!!

I've pm'ed each of you for some additional questions: @Dinger, @JCgurl and @Yorkster. Thanks!

Integrity are decent for a lower-mid tier window. I've used double hung integrity line before on my rental properties with significant Marvin contractor pricing incentives (best option is fiberglass exterior wood interior).I would never use them in my own house though. There are much higher performing fenestration options (double and triple glazing) so look around. Most consumers seem to prefer Marvin Ultimates but I can't stand the vinyl jambs and have been disappointed with repeated qc issues. They also don't perform that well. Learn to read performance specs -- huge performance gaps even among wood aluminum and fiberglass window types so questions like aluminum vs. fiberglass aren't that helpful.

+1 for Steve Nuding. He did a fantastic job on our street facing windows and handled all historic permits. Well worth the higher price tag. To save some bucks, we used a different contractor for the rear windows (to answer the OP's question). I have had to apply for a Certificate of No Effect for numerous jobs on my property and have always found the Office of Historic Preservation and its officers nothing but extremely helpful. I really appreciate their commitment to preserving the character of our historic neighborhood.

I just installed several Marvin Integrity Windows back of my house. Will be installing a few more once addition is complete. I looked at various brands but stuck with Marvin as their quality is top and kept it consistent with new installed historical wood windows in the front of the house. Never heard of the other company you mentioned.

Regardless of which company you go with, make sure contractor has experience installing windows in brownstones since it definitely is trickier than normal. Make sure to have the measures twice before ordering as well. Stating the obvious but if not installed properly or doesn't fit properly, brand of window won't matter.

Hi everyone - I've finally gotten quotes from 2 vendors and now have some additional questions Hopefully someone can help me:
For non-street facing windows, one contractor quoted me Marvin integrity (which is fiberglass), and another contractor quoted me aluminium windows from Crystal (I believe a windows manufacturer in Queens).

Questions:
1. are fiberglass windows better, or same, as aluminium windows? I'm approaching the windows as long-term investment, and is willing to spend a little more to get a longer piece of mind for something that will last longer;

2. anyone has Marvin Integrity windows? Feedback?

3. anyone heard of Crystal windows? I did some research online, and have not been able to find that many reviews so far, and most are either "ok", or "stay away". Anyone has experience?

4. I'm tending to go with either fiberglass or aluminium, and stay away from Vinyl. Reasons being (1) currently all my windows are aluminium, and I just feel that (2) fiberglass and aluminum are both longer lasting & stronger than vinyl, and hence worth the extra investment up front? Is that correct?

Thanks in advance for any advice / tips.

This article has some pointers as well, particularly regarding that different people men different things when they say "a new window" and that this can explain some of the price difference - brick to brick replacement (i.e. all visible exterior trim around window) or just sash kits...

http://www.nytimes.com/1997/09/04/gar ... -what-s-a-new-window.html

This may not be applicable: but one thing I wish I had considered when replacing the windows was to order factory installed child locks - doesn't add that much to the cost. The generic aftermarket ones just don't look as nice.

I had the same feeling when I did the math at first!
I had Pella do all of it. They knocked off some fees because I had them do the whole job. They were familiar with our historic codes so made it easy for me.
BUT if you decide to go with Pella don't go to home depot. Get a rep to come to your house.

Thanks everyone! I feel so much better now! I have 9 windows in total, but only 3 are street facing. I think the math is now so much more friendly :=) remaining in the 4-digit territory vs. going way OVER the 5-digit territory. Yesterday I thought I have to put a down payment amount just to get all windows replaced.

Just another question though - do you have the same contractor install both compliant and vinyl windows for you? Or you get different contractor to do them separately?

The historic windows are only for the street facing side. The rest can be the cheap vinyl ones.
I don't think the vinyl ones are as nice. They don't seem as insulated. The historic one keep out the cold and noise much better, and they just feel sturdier.

Historic rules generally only apply to what can be seen from the street/sidewalk. So, yes, you can pretty much do what you want in the back.

This is why you need to get someone who is experienced dealing with JC Historic and knows the rules.

As for vinyl windows, there are many vinyl windows that are good. They are considerably less expensive, require less maintenance (no painting.)


SRhia wrote:
Wait - are you saying I *can* install vinyl windows on non-street facing windows? So, in other words: street facing windows must be compliant, but for non-street facing wondows - all bets are off???

Given the vinyl windows are so much cheaper, are they any less "good"?

Quote:[/quote]

SRhia, please look at the PM I sent you earlier this morning. Fomite mentions the same thing I did. The historic preservation guidelines really only apply to any element of your building that can bee seen from a public right-of-way (such as a street or sidewalk). Anything not visible from a public right-of-way is fair game - i.e., back windows - though I still wouldn't let the historic gestapo know what your're planning to do back there - they would still try to interfere, IMO, and make life hard.

Wait - are you saying I *can* install vinyl windows on non-street facing windows? So, in other words: street facing windows must be compliant, but for non-street facing wondows - all bets are off???

Given the vinyl windows are so much cheaper, are they any less "good"?

Quote:

I recently replaced my windows with the historically appropriate ones.
It was actually really easy once you succumb to spending the money. I went with Pella and they did everything. Told me the correct windows, filed the paperwork with Dan, installed them and even repaired the rotted frames.
At first I was really upset about it, they were SO much more expensive than the vinyl ones I used on the non street facing windows, but now that's it done they look SO nice. The quality really is so much nicer.

If you live in a condo just make sure your association is aware that EVERYONE must replace their windows with the same thing.

Quote:

As a minor point of correction, there is no such thing. It's the Historic Preservation Commission and the Office of Historic Preservation. Jersey City doesn't have a "society".

His name is Steve (not Gary) Nuding. He's in Hoboken. He is THE go-to guy for historic window replacement around here. Everyone I know in JC who has done a historic window replacement in the last 10-15 years has used him, and I wouldn't consider anyone else when I did mine. I don't have his number handy, but you can probably google him. He's also an authorized Marvin installer, so Marvin is likely to have it.

Besides Gary Nuding, any other contractor recommendations? Would like to get a few in for estimates and comparison.

@Sommerman: just PM'ed you.

Ok, I'll check with my contractor if he can deal with the permit. But I have a feeling that he doesn't / won't.

Sounds like this will be a pain in the a*%.

Anyone knows how long this process may take?

Based on my experience you should get the person doing your windows to file the permit and work with historic, not you. If your contractor has not worked with Dan and/or Historic you might want to consider hiring someone who has, it will likely make your life easier and potentially save you some time and money.

Everyone I know that dealt with Dan and Historic got jerked around, told they had to do ridiculous things like they can ONLY put in Marvin windows, etc.

When I did my renovations my contractor dealt with Dan.

Quote:

If you go ahead without approval, the city can make you take the windows out or put a lien on your property for the amount it would cost to get the job done to requirements. Gary Nuding did my windows (Marvin) and supplied all the necessary information needed for the application.

You should speak with Dan Wrieden or Brain Blazak, the City's Historic Preservation Staff in the City Planning Division (201) 547-5010. You will need to file an application, pay the fee, and obtain an approval. The application needs to have the exact specifications of the windows ? so please don't buy anything till you have the approval. It could be an expensive error.

In case it's of some use:
The Ordinances detailing the requirements ? you might want to know these ? are 345-30 and 345-71. Search on ?Historic Preservation?

https://www.municode.com/library/nj/je ... /codes/code_of_ordinances

Does anyone have a contact at the historical preservation society? We're looking to get our windows replaced and would like to get approval before purchasing the actual units.

Thanks.

The following fact pattern has occured with respect to enforcement of the Historic Preservation Ordinance against serious Historic Preservation violations.

*Selling owner undertook major changes / improvements known by Historic Preservation to be in violation of the code -- either unauthorized or not in accordance with previously granted approvals. (Typically in this pattern Historic Preservation and the seller have already been in contact about the violation.)

*Seller fails to disclose the above events to the purchaser.

*The Historic Preservation Office is unaware of the pending sale or actual sale.

*New purchaser receives notice of violation(s), which can be enforced against them, even though the old owner is the one who caused the violation, as the violations run against the current property owner.

Ouch!

If the seller is no longer resident within Jersey City, the HPO will not be able to legally reach the old owner, but are then left with the question of what to do with a serious violation. The answer is that their only option is to enforce against the new owner -- otherwise this would become a major loophole to avoid enforcement of the ordinance.

The above is not a particularly palatable result for the new homeowner, however, you have already taken the best preventative steps -- due diligence with the Historic Preservation Officer... and hopefully before you make your purchase or finalize your contract with the seller.

If the HPO becomes aware of the potential sale, this will provide them with the opportunity to issue a notice of violation against the seller if the seriousness of the violation warrants it. Otherwise, it could be addressed informally by the prospective purchaser in direct conversation with the HPO if less serious.

HOWEVER, if it is a potentially serious violation (not yet reduced to a notice of violation), then you can take the additional steps of making the required changes a subject of your purchase negotiations to cure the violation(s), to adjust the purchase price, and/or if necessary insert appropriate indemnification or escrow provisions into the contract, pending a resolution with the HPO or should the HPO notice violations against the new property owner at a later date.

The above fact pattern was the genesis of a recommendation made more than 5 years ago that all prospective purchasers be provided with a notice that the property they own is within an Historic District and providing disclosure of known violations in advance of the purchase.

Fortunately this doesn't occur often, but it can happen.

Hope this helps.

All the best.

Geoff

You may want to be sure that you're not getting snowballed here on this forum or even when you decide to meet those in charge. The truth is that an overwhelming majority of houses throughout JC's historic districts have some "violations."

My understanding is that you cannot be MADE to correct anything simply because you're buying the house. It's only IF you decide to undertake improvements, that it then must be according to Historical Office's guidelines. At least this is my clear understanding from the neighbors on both sides of me, who have not been shy about "counter-offering" Wreiden with reasonable corrections, and have been pretty successful at doing it from what I've seen.

It can be intimidating, but you as the homeowner have far greater rights (and a much greater vote) then they would lead you to believe.

You already have your answer, Dan Wreiden is Jersey City's Historic Preservation Officer. The information you need to start making a decision will come from his office. As the above poster advised, you can then put a cost/value of the violations. One would have hoped that the/your realtor had the information and advised you.

Exterior work on properties within the historic districts require either a Certificate of No Effect from Mr. Wreiden or apply to and receiving a approval from the Historic Commission.

The merits of the historic districts have been argued on many other threads.

From what I understand the HPS is not big on fines and will only resort to them if someone has shown a total unwillingness to comply with regulations. However, the liabilty for the violations would become yours if you purchased the property as is and you would have to deal with the violation or, i imagine, eventually face fines from the city.

I would meet with Dan in person so you can go over in detail what is in violation and what needs to be done to remedy it - if you decide to place an offer on the property that is.
Then you would have to have a contractor provide a proposal for the work that would be done, have the proposed plans approved by the HPS, then negotiate the responsibility for the cost with the seller.

We're looking to purchase a place in the Van Voorst area. We were told the building we are interested is in violation of Historical Preservation Society guidelines. The current owner of the building hasn't received anything formally from the Society but just a letter stating that the building may be in violation. When we spoke briefly to Dan Wreiden (Head of the Preservation Society), he mentioned that the building "was" in numerous violations. Can anyone tell me what it mean to be in violation of historical preservation guidlines? Do they have any recourse to mandate changes to the exterior of our house once we purschase it? Are there fines associated with non-compliance? Any insight would be greatly appreciated.