I don't think the PATH trains would fit in the existing tunnels for the 4,5 or 6 trains. If you ride those trains regularly, which I do, you will notice those trains are much narrower than the PATH trains. And I'm prettty sure the tunnels for the 4, 5 & 6 trains are similarly narrower. I know for instance that trains such as the F, B, & D are wider and their tunnels are wider than the 4, 5 & 6 trains. This results in the NYC MTA being able to have 4, 5 & 6 trains travel on F, B & D tracks but the F, B & D trains can't travel on the 4, 5 & 6 tracks.

I think the PATH trains if anything would have to connect to tracks that accomodate trains like the A, C, E, B, D & F not the 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, or 6 trains.

Is the Port Authority unique? It seems like an odd organization, in control of shipping ports, airports, a subway, road tunnels, buildings, road bridges, a bus terminal, etc, etc, all spanning two states. The PA police force has jurisdiction across multiple cities counties and two states. Is there anything else like it anywhere in the US?

Clearly the first step would be a "one fare" transfer from PATH to MTA, no? Just follow the money folks. I've never even heard anyone talking about that mild step, even though it all goes on the same Metrocard as the "one fare" NYC implemented a few years back.

The only way an actual connection would ever happen is if the PA sold the PATH to the MTA. The PA hates the PATH, always has, and resents having to put ANY money into it.

I love New York, but I prefer New Jersey. We have lower taxes/a better financial position. We have room to expand, and as the most densly populated part of the state, we have lots of political influence. Until January, we will have 2 US Senators and Gov all from Hudson County.

Hmm. I don't think I quite agree that the Subway should connect to the second ave. subway. Here's why, the second avenue subway will come online (crosses fingers) earliest in 10 to 15 years, and this project has taken almost 100 years. I wouldn't want to bank our system expansion on a project that particular project when the 4,5,6 trains are literally a block for a connecting tunnel. Not to mention, the lex line is a much more valuable access than second ave.

That said, I totally agree that the project has very limited political feasibility because the MTA and PA can't play nice. I simply wish we could hold them to higher standards. I'm certain JCers would gladly pay 2.25 instead of the Usual 4.00 is you switch. Perhaps the PA could simply pay the MTA to run the system provided the PA keeps their level of funding stable and interest adjusted. The consolidation alone would financially benefit both. Again, I know its a dream...

I'm familiar with the Scranton project. I think the major stagnation in that project is that they don't think it will generate capital (political, ridership, or otherwise).

Staten Island has tried to secede from NYC and NY before, they fired a canon at manhattan about 20 years ago: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ ... n_proposals#New_York_City

I think NY and NJ should trade some territory. NJ gets Staten Island, NY gets Hoboken, Jersey City, and Newark. Then we could have a nice integrated transit system.

Quote:

A more realistic alternative would be extending the Second Avenue subway under the Hudson River from its planned eventual terminus at Hanover Square.

While the 4,5,6 trains are nearly identical cars, connecting two old subway systems would probably be more difficult than extending a new modern subway line.

I have seen this proposal as part of the redevelopment of ground zero, they would only need to build a tunnel a block or two to make it happen. What better time when you are rebuilding that station anyway! I would get behind connecting to the MTA 4, 5, 6 line in a heartbeat, I also dont think it will happen. I think the root of the problem is that it is two different organizations, cities and states. The MTA and PA would have to figure out all kinds of things like scheduling, maintenance deals, revenue sharing, etc, etc. It probably wouldnt bring much additional revenue if any to either. Only if the PATH was merged into the MTA would i expect this to be realistic. It makes brilliant sense to do this for the people who use the PATH and expands the MTA?s service. Unfortunately the orgs dont always do what is best for the people.

This isnt the only proposal of this type. There is a perfectly good HUGE abandoned elevated rail line going from a Hoboken train line in Hopatcong, NJ all the way to Scranton PA. There have been talks of putting high speed passenger service on the rail line from Hoboken to Scranton. As far as i can tell they are only going to the NJ/PA boarder...because NJ and PA can not figure out how to play nicely with each other.

I think we can safely agree that we are both 100% behind accessibility, but that is a requirement that the PA will have to comply with anyway. It's expansion versus maintenance and I believe with proper support the MTA and PA have the capacity and capability to do both. This would be a common sense project that would make the subway more accessible for everyone. It can be hard for me a fully able person to reach the Fulton Street trains. It must be much harder for a handicap person working on the eastside.

What if we fought for the PATH to become more ADA accessible first before making it only a tad more convenient for capable commuters?

It always occured to me connecting the PATH and Subway make sense. They are not that much different, and only require a tunnel. If we can build another 8 billion dollar tunnel under the Hudson, why not spend less money and bridge the PATH to the Subway. It provides Eastside Access for New Jersey.

I stumbled upon an article by the NJ Association of Railroad Passengers from 2006 http://www.nj-arp.org/path_lex.html which suggests that the new cars for the PATH even run on the same voltage as the 4 5 6 trains.

I know there will be few No votes for this connection in this forum. Why don't we seriously lobby to have this done for us?!