Old-Skool-JC wrote: Quote:

JCMan8 wrote: Is it racist to post Mike Brown's picture? I haven't seen this picture displayed in any American media outlets, only foreign ones. Despite probably showing what he looked like right before he attacked Officer Wilson.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/artic ... rely-beaten-teenager.html

Thanks JCmanH8, I had not seen this picture, no doubt part of some vast liberal media conspiracy. It does indeed lend credence to your theory that Mike Brown was a large black male. It's probably best if you stick to posting pictures from now on, I know you don't like reading articles. Here's a picture of the murderer Darren Wilson. As you can see he is a fine genetic specimen. Ape arms that reach down to his knees, ears that look like they can pick up Direct TV and a magnificent dome topped off with the ever-popular male pattern baldness.

Old-Skool-JC wrote:
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devilsadvocate wrote:
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Old-Skool-JC wrote:
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devilsadvocate wrote:
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When I read stuff like this I start to think that dialogue is utterly pointless because people who think this way just cannot be reasoned with. The only solution is to advocate for martial law, put down the riots with all force necessary, and ignore the people that will always blame white people no matter what. They are true racists and you cannot reason with a true racist.

No, it's because you are incapable of arguing, only attacking and obfuscating and advocating more violence.

What is there to argue when the response to the facts presented is "this is because of white supremacists!" - a group that isn't remotely involved here?...

You are so dumb it hurts to even contemplate what it must be like to have read that article and come away thinking that the author was actually talking about a physical group of white supremacists.
Ultimately I pity you.

Old-Skool-JC wrote:
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devilsadvocate wrote:
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Old-Skool-JC wrote:
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devilsadvocate wrote:
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When I read stuff like this I start to think that dialogue is utterly pointless because people who think this way just cannot be reasoned with. The only solution is to advocate for martial law, put down the riots with all force necessary, and ignore the people that will always blame white people no matter what. They are true racists and you cannot reason with a true racist.

No, it's because you are incapable of arguing, only attacking and obfuscating and advocating more violence.

What is there to argue when the response to the facts presented is "this is because of white supremacists!" - a group that isn't remotely involved here?...

You are so dumb it hurts to even contemplate what it must be like to have read that article and come away thinking that the author was actually talking about a physical group of white supremacists.
Ultimately I pity you.

JCMan8 wrote:
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hero69 wrote:
suggestion: maybe the government should start a reparation fund for people of ferguson. put all the reparation money into a fund to pay for the college education of children from low income families from that area.

So Ferguson should be rewarded for immediately rioting and looting simply because the victim was black? All that will do is encourage others to violently riot in order to get free things.

My suggestion is that all business owners who have had their livelihoods destroyed over the looting and arson get some compensation from the government.

Old-Skool-JC wrote:
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devilsadvocate wrote:
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Old-Skool-JC wrote:
White supremacy is the real culprit in Ferguson... This is about the value of black life in 21st-century America.

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisf ... cy-ferguson-black-excuses

When I read stuff like this I start to think that dialogue is utterly pointless because people who think this way just cannot be reasoned with. The only solution is to advocate for martial law, put down the riots with all force necessary, and ignore the people that will always blame white people no matter what. They are true racists and you cannot reason with a true racist.

No, it's because you are incapable of arguing, only attacking and obfuscating and advocating more violence.

VanVorster wrote:
Yes Devils that is precisely what you and many others are saying. Here's your bingo card. I think growing up here many of you get the benefit of being oblivious to race and racial issues. Some whites, in particular my many white friends, however recognize it.

http://sassy-gay-justice.tumblr.com/image/94792171265

Here are your talking points: Blacks are predisposed to criminality;

their culture is horrible and they take no personal responsibility like white people

Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson hate white people because they haven't talked about black on black crime and fixed it yet

-- although we haven't fixed white on white crime either;

and because blacks kill blacks, then it really shouldn't be a really big deal when whites (civilian or officers) kill blacks. End scene.

Old-Skool-JC wrote:
White supremacy is the real culprit in Ferguson. The excuses just prove it.

We?ve had enough of the police brutality, of the colorblind mythologies and post-racial rhetoric, of the sweet-talk, of the calls for non-violence; of mass incarceration and systemic poverty, of trigger happy cops and crying black mothers, of the Eric Garners and Renisha McBrides, the Michael Browns and Tarika Wilsons; of black tears and white terror. Dr Martin Luther King Jr said in 1968: ?A riot is the language of the unheard?. Today, nearly 50 years later, black America demands to not only be heard but heeded ? by any means necessary.

This week in Ferguson, Missouri, there has been more backlash over the resistance of a few black (and some white) protestors than the violence of white police. Meanwhile, according to organizers on the ground, it has mainly been (white) outsiders inciting violence to promote their own agenda. As the writer Sarah Kendzior tweeted: ?White people coming to STL to provoke police violence against black residents and get them blamed?. More than blamed: black people are left to bear the brunt of the political mess white infiltration leaves behind, be it by the National Guard or outside organizers.

As Sean Beale, a 27-year-old local, told the Guardian: ?If you don?t live here you don?t worry about the burning and looting. You don?t worry about stores closing, or losing your job, or walking for miles to buy food.?

But to focus more on the people?s resistance than the police repression that created it ? even as tensions cooled in the streets on Monday night ? is to participate in the dehumanization and devaluing of black life. To ignore the elders rallying for the sake of our babies and young people peacefully protesting on behalf of our future while some (white) visitors instigate disarray is morally reprehensible. Beyond Ferguson, the pattern is clear. Blacks are always to blame, even as we are brutalized by police, ghettoized by neoliberal policies, and disenfranchised by a racist criminal (in)justice system.

But that?s the crux of white supremacist racial logic: the problem with black people is ? well, black people ? not mass incarceration and the deindustrialization of urban America, not educational inequality and generational poverty, not 400 years of slavery, lynchings, and Jim Crow. To be black in America is to be victimized and then made responsible for our victimization. We built this country. But, apparently, it is we who are lazy and dependent. We are bullied politically, socially and economically. But it is we who are called ?thugs?.

?There is never an excuse for violence against police,? President Obama said. Yet there are endless excuses for state violence against black people. For mass incarceration, there?s the ?war on drugs?. For poverty and unemployment, there?s ?a culture of laziness? and ?government dependence?. For the educational gap, there?s the burden of ?acting white?. For Eric Garner: ?loosies?. And for Michael Brown, there are stolen cigarillos, jaywalking or anything the police can say to shift the narrative from their white supremacist practices to black ?ghetto? culture.

It is to say that black lives do not matter, that our babies deserve death and despair, that our communities don?t deserve protection and justice.

Obama needs post-racialism like Bush needed the ?war on terror?: to camouflage our contradictions, to exercise global dominance vis-?-vis a (neo)liberal-democratic narrative, to lie to the world. But with the numbers of black bodies unemployed, incarcerated and extrajudicially executed, what are to we to do?

No one person knows.

But we must act collectively and courageously. Alongside the immediate arrest of Darren Wilson, we must demand the demilitarization of law enforcement as well as the decriminalization of the black body. In addition to the withdrawal of the curfew and National Guard, we must demand the withdrawal of apartheid police forces and local governments where a black majority is ruled by a white minority. We cannot depend on the same police force that killed Brown to liberate us. In Ferguson and across the nation we must push for the implementation of community-oriented police models that include prevention, problem-solving, citizen engagement and community partnerships. There needs to be a cop-watch program in every city across America with a high concentration of people of color.

Also, we must recognize that naming Wilson as the killer without naming white supremacy as the culprit fails to address the root of racialized police violence. We must recognize, as Malcolm X did, that police brutality is a human rights issue that will not be solved simply by the passing of legislation. Our rallies must spark revolutionary action. Our marching must evolve into a sustainable movement. We must see that this is bigger than Brown and Wilson, than Ferguson or New York City. This is about the value of black life in 21st-century America.

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisf ... cy-ferguson-black-excuses

VanVorster wrote:
Deflect all you want Monroe. Here are your talking points: Blacks are predisposed to criminality; their culture is horrible and they take no personal responsibility like white people; Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson hate white people because they haven't talked about black on black crime and fixed it yet -- although we haven't fixed white on white crime either; and because blacks kill blacks, then it really shouldn't be a really big deal when whites (civilian or officers) kill blacks. End scene.

http://mediamatters.org/research/2014 ... n-black-crime-cana/200467

VanVorster wrote:
Devils by all means quote from Fox, Bill O'Reilly, and Rush. You're basically their acolyte and JCList mouthpiece. However, it only confirms for me and others to doubt the veracity of any of your drivel and diatribes.


http://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza ... teners-not-poll-suggests/

VanVorster wrote:
Monroe,
Your "but what about black on black crime" excuse is such a red herring and smokescreen. No one is ignoring black on black crime including Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson. Sharpton addresses that too in his NAN organization, Jackson has also been involved with mitigating this and have you ever heard of Stop the Violence campaign? Also you do realize you can challenge BOTH black on black crime and police brutality/wanton killings of blacks by officers and one does not preclude the other? Also, how many black, Asian and Latino police officers do you see mistakenly killing white kids? It's predominantly white officers killing people of color. The Jezebel article clearly elucidated that. And if you would like to get out of your Fox Breitbart Drudge echo chamber, consider the information below.

http://www.upworthy.com/5-black-crime ... hich-ones-did-you-believe

http://www.theatlantic.com/national/a ... ck-on-black-crime/378629/

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/07 ... ack-on-Black-Crime-Thing#

VanVorster wrote:
This thread is atrocious and so much for people complying with terms of service, which appears to be quite lax. None of us knows what actually happened that afternoon and let's wait to find out. We shouldn't assume that MB had it coming and we shouldn't presume that Darren Collins is guilty. What I think bothers many people of color is the blithe manner that sort of excuses the death of black people (and Latinos), where mistakes are permissible and always justified. " No one is suggesting that black Americans are saints who never commit crimes or do things that call for police action. But I have to say, it sure is funny how many actions become a death sentence when a black person is the one doing them."

These are really illuminating.
http://jezebel.com/ways-the-media-and ... -of-unarme-1623881362/all

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mary-an ... d-unworthy_b_5673321.html

JCMan8 wrote:
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Asif wrote:
I don't understand why people can't wait until all the facts are in which are weeks if not months away from being thoroughly collected. There are so many assumptions and pure fantasy being thrown around.

You should ask the people of Ferguson this question, along with Al Sharpton and many in the media.

Pebble wrote:
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JCMan8 wrote:
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Pebble wrote:
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devilsadvocate wrote:
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Pebble wrote:
You are wrong. That is about as simple as I can state it.

Ah, the incisive analysis we have all come to expect from Pebs on display here.

Why give a breakdown on an absurd conspiracy theory? What next, you want a breakdown on why batboy isn't real?

I'd love it if your fantasy about how the press operated was true but you couldn't be further off base.

It's actually pretty easy to understand if you have basic knowledge of the workings of capitalism. Might want to do some reading.

I'd suggest spending some time with reporters... Capitalism, it is not. Your basis in your theories on business, mine isn't a theory, it's actual reality of a newsroom borne from actually speaking with those that are editors and reporters.

Maybe next time you suggest to someone that they should "read a book" you get yourself some actual information on the industry you're discussing...

On_The_3rd wrote:
A lot of peeps dig Mod Cup but if you work DT, they'll be inconvenient since they're up on Palisades Ave (they do the Farmers Market @ Grove from time to time). WORD bookstore serves Stumptown which I brew at home and like a lot, though I've never tried from WORD. I've heard good things about Warehouse on Bay St. as well.

kitkat13 wrote:
Hi,

I just started working in Jersey City and I'm looking for a good coffee place. I've found the closest Starbucks. I've tried Brewshot and Legal Grounds once.

Any thoughts on these places? Any suggestions?

Thank you!

Pebble wrote:
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devilsadvocate wrote:
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Pebble wrote:
You are wrong. That is about as simple as I can state it.

Ah, the incisive analysis we have all come to expect from Pebs on display here.

Why give a breakdown on an absurd conspiracy theory? What next, you want a breakdown on why batboy isn't real?

Pebble wrote:
You are wrong. That is about as simple as I can state it.

Pebble wrote:
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JCMan8 wrote:
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Pebble wrote:
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JCMan8 wrote:
Amid the heavy gunfire towards police last night, 78 people were arrested. Most from Missouri. So NOT mostly outside agitators as the media tried spinning. Oops, time to shift the goalposts again!

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/mich ... rest-records-show-n184036

A community acting like two year olds having a temper tantrum. All in support of a thug who terrorizes hardworking store owners.

Is "the media" spinning this article that you posted which comes from... "the media"?

Get a grip, man. You have to quit claiming that there is some inherent bias in the media trying to drive a narrative.

This is obvious in contrasting the initial headlines of "unarmed black teenager executed by racist cop who shot him in the back" to headlines that completely ignore the witnesses lied about the back part. Now the goalposts have shifted to he was shot 6 times in the front so 6 is automatically excessive. Never mind if he was charging the cop or not.

Anyway I can go along with you and we don't need to focus on the narrative. Just the facts in that link. Last night, the cops were under heavy gunfire by protestors, 78 people got arrested, and the vast majority were local as opposed to out of state.

I'm not discussing the actual issue. I'm merely pointing out the fault in your arguments regarding "the media."

As stated previously, do you honestly believe that every reporter went into the shooting wanting and hoping for the story to be "racist cop shoots unarmed teenage black"? Or do you think these reporters asked questions and rushed to print any and every piece of information for fear of being scooped by the competition?

If you truly believe the former, then you have absolutely no concept about the current direction of news organizations.

bodhipooh wrote:
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arcy wrote:
goods&greens is closing this week.

That's impossible. Haven't you been told by now? DTJC is VERY affluent, people love to spend their money here, and high end businesses wouldn't fail because the neighborhood will support them.

Frank_M wrote:
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JCMan8 wrote:
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Frank_M wrote:
Give it a rest jcman8, you?re off the rails with this garbage. Expressing yourself as you have?starting with the very title of the thread?speaks volumes more about you than the issues you presume to address. Worse, like many others before you, you have also helped to further demonstrate that the webmaster of JCList is chronically permissive of racist speech.

Sorry, facts are not racist. They clearly make you uncomfortable, but I and others on this thread are pointing out the terrible truth of what is going on.

I?m familiar with the ?I?m just telling it like it is,? argument. It?s one of the most common defenses of racist speech along with, ?I?m just saying what everyone is thinking.?

mwa7368 wrote:
Still doesn't make it the 6th boro, and it's still not cool to call it the 6th boro. You will still sound dumb if you call it that.

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vindication15 wrote:
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jc_dweller wrote:
Actually if NYC wasn't there JC would probably be MORE substantial. The only reason that it seems insignificant is because Manhattan dwarfs everything around it. If Manhattan was gone, JC would be a serious mid-sized city - bigger than Boulder, Orlando, Richmond, etc.

hahahahaha. If JC wasn't right next to NYC with 24/7 access then it wouldn't be the second largest city in NJ, there would be no luxury condos, there would be no restaurant row, there would be any luxury at all actually. Minus well just rename Jersey City Greenville.

Just look at all the new buildings, restaurants, food trucks, and population growth - all of that is happening in the area right next to NYC - DTJC.

You people are fooling yourselves.

Asif wrote:

Some would argue there is something about white culture that leads to fear of and oppression and violence towards minorities.

The history of the US littered with such examples.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosewood,_Florida

dtjcview wrote:
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devilsadvocate wrote:
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I cannot see another possible description of the causation given the circumstances.

Might want to look a little further for causation. For example, the right-leaning Brooking Institute think tank offers one alternative and plausible explanation.

http://www.theweek.co.uk/us/60016/fer ... verty-and-white-supremacy

CdeCoincy wrote:
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devilsadvocate wrote:
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dtjcview wrote:
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JCMan8 wrote:
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One big problem is that "perceived injustice can provoke unreasonable and disproportionate response" only in the black community.
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You would never see anything like this in a white, Hispanic, or Asian community. ESPECIALLY so soon, before any facts were in. And this isn't a new thing, these sorts of riots have been doing on for decades. Call it racist but it's just a fact.
...

You really haven't set foot outside the US have you? This response is NO different to ANY minority response to perceived injustice. White, black, asian, african - N.Ireland, Egypt, Gaza, Tiananmen Sq, Croatia, Bosnia, Rwanda, South Africa... wherever...

Wake the #OOPS# up America. Just because you might be a majority, in a democracy., it doesn't mean you are right.

Those are horrible analogies for a bunch of reasons. Comparing what is going on in Missouri to civil wars, revolutions, democracy protests, etc. is moronic. Now, if you want something similar then the riots in France with the French Muslims is basically the exact same thing. I don't think it is racial per se but it is indicative of a seriously defective culture within certain communities.

http://www.liberation.fr/monde/2014/0 ... m=email&utm_campaign=quot

Interestingly an editorial in today's Liberation compares Ferguson to the French riots.

dtjcview wrote:
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devilsadvocate wrote:
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dtjcview wrote:
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JCMan8 wrote:
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One big problem is that "perceived injustice can provoke unreasonable and disproportionate response" only in the black community.
...
You would never see anything like this in a white, Hispanic, or Asian community. ESPECIALLY so soon, before any facts were in. And this isn't a new thing, these sorts of riots have been doing on for decades. Call it racist but it's just a fact.
...

You really haven't set foot outside the US have you? This response is NO different to ANY minority response to perceived injustice. White, black, asian, african - N.Ireland, Egypt, Gaza, Tiananmen Sq, Croatia, Bosnia, Rwanda, South Africa... wherever...

Wake the #OOPS# up America. Just because you might be a majority, in a democracy., it doesn't mean you are right.

Those are horrible analogies for a bunch of reasons. Comparing what is going on in Missouri to civil wars, revolutions, democracy protests, etc. is moronic. Now, if you want something similar then the riots in France with the French Muslims is basically the exact same thing. I don't think it is racial per se but it is indicative of a seriously defective culture within certain communities.

It's easier to believe that some races or cultures are simply broken, than believe social injustice might still be an issue in America. Right?

HeightsBrat wrote:
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Yvonne wrote:
People here do not want an honest discussion, they want to throw mud and attack instead. If this forum is how to make this the best mid size city then address the issues, you don't pretend graffiti does not exist, visitors have a limited parking or they are assaulted by the noise in the air. I have been living in JC longer than some of you have been alive and I have seen the changes in JC, some positive and other negative. People here want to pretend the negative does not exist. If JC collected information from visitors I am sure they would say something similar to my comments. So why doesn't the city collect and publish some honest data from people who do visit the city?

The only negative thing on this board that people want to pretend does not exist is YOU. You have NEVER once come on this board saying anything positive. You suck the life forces out of everything.

Please find your perfect little town and move there.

dtjcview wrote:
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JCMan8 wrote:
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One big problem is that "perceived injustice can provoke unreasonable and disproportionate response" only in the black community.
...
You would never see anything like this in a white, Hispanic, or Asian community. ESPECIALLY so soon, before any facts were in. And this isn't a new thing, these sorts of riots have been doing on for decades. Call it racist but it's just a fact.
...

You really haven't set foot outside the US have you? This response is NO different to ANY minority response to perceived injustice. White, black, asian, african - N.Ireland, Egypt, Gaza, Tiananmen Sq, Croatia, Bosnia, Rwanda, South Africa... wherever...

Wake the #OOPS# up America. Just because you might be a majority, in a democracy., it doesn't mean you are right.

VanVorster wrote:
Did I ever say he was a nice guy? I said, I am not castigating Michael Brown (playing respectability politics that dictates that we determine if he was one of the good blacks) NOR am I condemning Darren Wilson (innocent until proven guilty)


http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2 ... -brown-ferguson-black-men


http://breakingbrown.com/2014/03/whit ... se-so-wheres-the-outrage/

VanVorster wrote:
And this man wasn't shot (not even a flesh wound) while he was being apprehended and he assaulted police officers. When you combine black with big, it's basically a veritable pass to say "well the scary big black man scared me" and all bets are off and I think people are subconsciously permissive in using their guns on black/brown people as evident by the Study below.

http://www.kmov.com/news/crime/Police ... s-officers-271009211.html

Old-Skool-JC wrote:
A disgusting amount of racism is allowed on this board, glad people are finally being called on it.