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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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Immigrants are people, immigrants have kids, immigrants pay taxes.
I know full well that immigration and their subsequent high childbearing accounts for a considerable portion of the U.S. population growth.

All that said, your statement about "ZERO OR NEGATIVE POPULATION GROWTH IN THE UNITED STATES" is the stupidest statement anyone will read this month. And I proved its stupidity conclusively and still you bray on.

Inability to recognize a mistake when it is conclusively proven to be so is a sign of severe personality disorder.

Do you STILL think the United States has a zero population growth? Did I make up the numbers I posted? Are you on medication? Have you eaten one too many teabags today?

A lesson you might learn from your first post is that sarcasm is fine, making a mistake is fine but making a sarcastic mistake looks REALLY dumb. Trying to obfuscate around the mistake by changing the subject with quibbles about truncated wiki entries loooks even dumber.

The correct grown-up response is: "Yes I made a mistake about zero population growth, U.S. population growth is indeed high."

Posted on: 2010/10/9 14:02
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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^^

You quoted only half the sentence from the wikipedia article. By accident, I am sure.

"U.S. population growth is among the highest in industrialized countries,[7] since the vast majority of these have below-replacement fertility rates and the U.S. has higher levels of immigration."

So, are you purposely misrepresenting the facts, or are you suffering from the lack of education you accuse me of?

Or are you simply anti-immigration?

Posted on: 2010/10/9 13:50
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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Quote:
robotjustin wrote: Yeah, totally, because instituting a tax-based deterrent in the US, a country with basically zero population growth (like most first world industrialized countries, which have zero or negative population growth) will certainly have a GLOBAL effect on the supposed problem of overpopulation, which isn't any way centered in the famously bible-reading, right wing Christian countries like China and India.



Zero-Population growth?????? Did you first learn to count in senior high school or in college. Had you stayed for a master's degree you'd maybe have even learned percentages:

U.S. population:

1990: 248 Million
2000: 281 Million
Today: 310 Million

So ask somebody who understands big numbers to explain to you why your post is moronic.

If numbers are too challenging then a wikipedia entry might suffice:
Quote:
However, U.S. population growth is among the highest in industrialized countries



Same argument pertains to dimwits trying to argue that there are going to be 50 altercockers for every worker and thus Social Security must be eliminated. It is true that there may not be any JOBS but God knows the place will be crawling with people.

Quote:
The Census Bureau projects a U.S. population of 439 million in 2050, which is a 46% increase from 2007 (301.3 million

Posted on: 2010/10/9 13:42
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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lets first start with manditory pet classes / pet ownership license

Posted on: 2010/10/6 23:02
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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Quote:

darenot wrote:
SF writer Jerry Pournelle proposed in a novel that any food provided by public assistance be laced with contraceptives. You needed to be solvent enough to buy contraceptive free food to have kids. This is kind of a high tech and merciful throwback to pre-socialism where if you couldn't provide the basics for your kids: they died, and Darwin ruled.

robotjustin: Actually, China and India, while huge, are leading the way in plummeting 3rd world fertility rates. Who's leading the fertility race? Koran thumping countries. Gaza, subsisting on aid with virtually no economy of it's own, has one of the worlds highest birth rates. Guess they figure suicide bombers to be an exportable commodity and a growth market.


1. So did our current science czar. Although he proclaimed that contraceptives should be placed in the water supply to curb the bugbear of overpopulation.

2. That's maybe. But regardless, birth control is not prohibited by Islam. And I've never heard anyone except for right-wing extremists complain about an over-abundance of Muslims.

Posted on: 2010/10/6 12:03
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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3 observations:

The ASPCA far predated child welfare legislation. You could beat your kids and your wife all you wanted but not your horse.

SF writer Jerry Pournelle proposed in a novel that any food provided by public assistance be laced with contraceptives. You needed to be solvent enough to buy contraceptive free food to have kids. This is kind of a high tech and merciful throwback to pre-socialism where if you couldn't provide the basics for your kids: they died, and Darwin ruled.

robotjustin: Actually, China and India, while huge, are leading the way in plummeting 3rd world fertility rates. Who's leading the fertility race? Koran thumping countries. Gaza, subsisting on aid with virtually no economy of it's own, has one of the worlds highest birth rates. Guess they figure suicide bombers to be an exportable commodity and a growth market.

Posted on: 2010/10/6 4:13
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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Quote:

Xerxes wrote:
It's ridiculous alright, but not as bad as the plan to let ignorant morons procreate at will at a time when the population of the planet approaches 7 billion. And then to REWARD the jackasses with the tax structure because GOD said someting in a Bronze Age book is beyond the pale.

So yes Alec produced a silly idea but one that would improve the situation a lot. THe current siituation is abhorrent.

"Hey honey, there are no jobs, let's have 6 kids!"



On the matter of those who do not make $30,000, if they have two kids they will START to pay taxes even on salaries of $5,000 each because they will each lose $20,000 of their deduction giving them NO deductions (minus ten grand per kid per parent.)

For those who think the planet can support 20 or 30 billion people, go read your bible becasue its simpleminded enough for you to comprehend.


Yeah, totally, because instituting a tax-based deterrent in the US, a country with basically zero population growth (like most first world industrialized countries, which have zero or negative population growth) will certainly have a GLOBAL effect on the supposed problem of overpopulation, which isn't any way centered in the famously bible-reading, right wing Christian countries like China and India.

Please, regale us with some more of your brilliant plans for global governance, because we're all obviously dumber than you.

Posted on: 2010/10/6 1:57
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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It's ridiculous alright, but not as bad as the plan to let ignorant morons procreate at will at a time when the population of the planet approaches 7 billion. And then to REWARD the jackasses with the tax structure because GOD said someting in a Bronze Age book is beyond the pale.

So yes Alec produced a silly idea but one that would improve the situation a lot. THe current siituation is abhorrent.

"Hey honey, there are no jobs, let's have 6 kids!"



On the matter of those who do not make $30,000, if they have two kids they will START to pay taxes even on salaries of $5,000 each because they will each lose $20,000 of their deduction giving them NO deductions (minus ten grand per kid per parent.)

For those who think the planet can support 20 or 30 billion people, go read your bible becasue its simpleminded enough for you to comprehend.

Posted on: 2010/10/5 22:24
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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How about this: sterilize everyone, have an institution create babies in vitro, then you have to buy a lottery ticket in order to win a child - and you can't have a choice on what you receive.

anyone have a more ridiculous plan?

Posted on: 2010/9/30 1:19
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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Parenting classes wouldn't be a bad idea, though.

Posted on: 2010/9/29 23:13
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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This posting was started by a jackwad who can't spell "mandatory" and went down hill from there. What makes all the snarky posters above think that they are from gene pools that should have been extended? With any luck they will take their own advice and not procreate. That should definitely lower the d-bag quotient.

Posted on: 2010/9/29 20:03
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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What a load of self-righteous dick-heads.

Posted on: 2010/9/28 1:31
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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Some families don't make 30k. I think there's some merit exploring this though. Incentives for parents. Incentives for the kids...

Quote:

Xerxes wrote:
It's not really too hard:

Give every man and woman a $30,000 standard tax deduction per year. For each child $10,000 is removed from that deduction for each parent. With the 4th child $10,000 is ADDED to the adjusted gross income.

Just WATCH how fast family size drops. "Hey honey, do we want a "bundle of love" enough to pay the tax on $20,000 every year." (Ten grand each.) If the answer is yes, you can believe they will make good caring parents who truly want their child.

To make sure the rich are not encouraged to spawn prodigiously because $10,000 is negligible for them, another constraint to add is to increase the top 2 brackets by 1% for each child PER PARENT...no joint accounts.

Just from a practical point of view, schools cost money, sewage removal costs money, and environmental degradation per person is considerable over a lifetime.

Instead traditional religious power in the United States writes the tax code in exactly the opposite way, rewarding those who breed like roaches.

Posted on: 2010/9/28 1:30
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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Quote:

Xerxes wrote:
It's not really too hard:

Give every man and woman a $30,000 standard tax deduction per year. For each child $10,000 is removed from that deduction for each parent. With the 4th child $10,000 is ADDED to the adjusted gross income.

Just WATCH how fast family size drops. "Hey honey, do we want a "bundle of love" enough to pay the tax on $20,000 every year." (Ten grand each.) If the answer is yes, you can believe they will make good caring parents who truly want their child.

To make sure the rich are not encouraged to spawn prodigiously because $10,000 is negligible for them, another constraint to add is to increase the top 2 brackets by 1% for each child PER PARENT...no joint accounts.

Just from a practical point of view, schools cost money, sewage removal costs money, and environmental degradation per person is considerable over a lifetime.

Instead traditional religious power in the United States writes the tax code in exactly the opposite way, rewarding those who breed like roaches.


I like this idea.

Posted on: 2010/9/27 13:13
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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It's not really too hard:

Give every man and woman a $30,000 standard tax deduction per year. For each child $10,000 is removed from that deduction for each parent. With the 4th child $10,000 is ADDED to the adjusted gross income.

Just WATCH how fast family size drops. "Hey honey, do we want a "bundle of love" enough to pay the tax on $20,000 every year." (Ten grand each.) If the answer is yes, you can believe they will make good caring parents who truly want their child.

To make sure the rich are not encouraged to spawn prodigiously because $10,000 is negligible for them, another constraint to add is to increase the top 2 brackets by 1% for each child PER PARENT...no joint accounts.

Just from a practical point of view, schools cost money, sewage removal costs money, and environmental degradation per person is considerable over a lifetime.

Instead traditional religious power in the United States writes the tax code in exactly the opposite way, rewarding those who breed like roaches.

Posted on: 2010/9/27 12:08
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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Speaking of procreation bans, let's also include all the entitled parents who feel a nanny can best raise their precious little dumplings while they work the entire day and then feel "too tired to deal" when they get home leaving junior to wonder his entire life just who his mommy and daddy are. Now THAT'S a gene pool that needs some serious pruning.

Posted on: 2010/9/26 23:39
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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How about you spell mandatory correctly first.

Posted on: 2010/9/26 23:22
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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Quote:

ihatethiscity wrote:
you need a license to have a dog you should need a license to have kids. it would stop all the welfare babies and the excessive drain on society they pose and it would help move civilization along. Not everyone should be entitled to pass along their genes. That is a right that should be earned.


WOW!!! Kids of people on welfare contribute nothing to society and only drain resources? Only people with money should be able to have kids? The value of life is based on money, pieces of paper we've created to support a uniformed system to determine the value of goods and services?

WOW!!!! WOW!!! WOW!!!

Do people who did not earn their money but instead inherited it be prevented from having kids because we could argue that they are also receiving welfare, albeit private welfare?

Do people who lose their fortune also lose their right to have a baby?

Veterans who've served our country and now find themselves on welfare do they get a waiver?

Does the single mom, dad or grandmother who use welfare to feed children she/he instill values of hard work, persistence and dignity and teach them to rise above it all and succeed regardless of their circumstances get a waiver?

Posted on: 2010/9/26 23:01
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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You are 100% accountable for your dog's behavior with rules and regulations, yet 0% accountable for your child's behavior.

Posted on: 2010/9/26 22:33
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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Your eugenics program will leave JCLIST without any posters.

Posted on: 2010/9/26 21:38
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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you need a license to have a dog you should need a license to have kids. it would stop all the welfare babies and the excessive drain on society they pose and it would help move civilization along. Not everyone should be entitled to pass along their genes. That is a right that should be earned.

Posted on: 2010/9/26 18:54
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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Quote:

MDM wrote:
How would you enforce that? Forced adoptions, sterilizations, and abortions?


You are too extreme. It would start as a grassroots effort with private organizations providing payments for voluntary vasectomies and hysterectomies.

Later on the government could start a "fitness level" program that people would be required to take in order to get a tax refund. Using factors such as race, religion, education level, income, iq, attractiveness, left vs right handedness, etc the government could then create quotas for different fitness levels by providing/removing tax credits ( similar to what it does now ).

Posted on: 2010/9/26 16:41
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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it will never happen. this is a fact. a fact. ie, true. ie, your opinion is irrelevant to its truth.

btw, "manditory"? hilarious.

Posted on: 2010/9/26 15:47
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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Eugenics? You're an idiot.

Discuss.

Posted on: 2010/9/26 15:14
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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Hence the orginal question. We need dialogue on this very topic. The future depends on it.

Quote:

MDM wrote:
Quote:

bill wrote:
I completely agree, if you need a license to drive, cpr certficiation, first aid certification, etc then there should be something to see if one is suitable to be a fit parent.



How would you enforce that? Forced adoptions, sterilizations, and abortions?

Posted on: 2010/9/26 15:10
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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Quote:

bill wrote:
I completely agree, if you need a license to drive, cpr certficiation, first aid certification, etc then there should be something to see if one is suitable to be a fit parent.



How would you enforce that? Forced adoptions, sterilizations, and abortions?

Posted on: 2010/9/26 14:33
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Re: Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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I completely agree, if you need a license to drive, cpr certficiation, first aid certification, etc then there should be something to see if one is suitable to be a fit parent.

Posted on: 2010/9/26 14:21
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Thoughts on manditory parenting classes/parent licenses
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I realize the complexities and legal ramifications of such ideas would probably go nowhere but I believe they should be contemplated and researched more. The sheer amount of crap parenting I witness daily in this town is staggering. The muggings, the shootings, the FU attitude of the youth here is getting worse. The parents are hardly ever held accountable, curfew laws are rarely enforced and we wonder why another death or mugging has occurred.

This "Children See - Children Do" video is a start.

[img]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJF50kwwRJE&feature=player_embedded#![/img]

http://tiny.cc/02j7s

Posted on: 2010/9/26 13:42
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