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Re: Black community responds to police shooting of unarmed black teenager by looting businesses
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This is going overboard. The reports I saw this morning made it clear that the violence last night was started by a small group of troublemakers, and that protestors surrounded them/pointed them out to police. I suspect that most people in Ferguson want this craziness to stop.
Posted on: 2014/8/19 15:02
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Re: Black community responds to police shooting of unarmed black teenager by looting businesses
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i haven't paid that much attention to this, but if the teenager tried to take the cop's gun away and he is a a robber on top, i find it hard to have much sympathy for the teen. I do agree that it is the responsibility of a judge/jury to decide on culpability.
i don't get all he violent protests with people destroying their own communitities and if there is rage, perhaps more of the rage should be directed inward and folks should do more self-reflecting
Posted on: 2014/8/19 15:00
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Re: Black community responds to police shooting of unarmed black teenager by looting businesses
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Give it a rest jcman8, you?re off the rails with this garbage. Expressing yourself as you have?starting with the very title of the thread?speaks volumes more about you than the issues you presume to address. Worse, like many others before you, you have also helped to further demonstrate that the webmaster of JCList is chronically permissive of racist speech.
Posted on: 2014/8/19 14:59
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Re: Black community responds to police shooting of unarmed black teenager by looting businesses
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Those are horrible analogies for a bunch of reasons. Comparing what is going on in Missouri to civil wars, revolutions, democracy protests, etc. is moronic. Now, if you want something similar then the riots in France with the French Muslims is basically the exact same thing. I don't think it is racial per se but it is indicative of a seriously defective culture within certain communities.
Posted on: 2014/8/19 14:55
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Re: Black community responds to police shooting of unarmed black teenager by looting businesses
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Necessitated by some of the most disgusting series of actions we've seen in recent memory. The Ferguson protestors were back to shooting at police last night. 31 people arrested. All in honor of a confirmed strongarm robber (yes, confirmed, as his family and accomplice admitted it was him) who very well tried to take a police officers gun, fought with him, and sent him to the hospital. Even worse, we saw an immediate crucifiction of the cop. Great role model and martyr. At not once has anyone considered they could be wrong. Not once has anyone in that community condemned the strong arm robbery. Instead we have a large group of people acting like two year olds having a temper tantrum. So yes, this whole debacle is truly disgusting.
Posted on: 2014/8/19 14:41
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Re: Black community responds to police shooting of unarmed black teenager by looting businesses
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Monroe, do you know why we have judges and juries? Is it to get to the truth and facts by examining only selective fragments of evidence we like, and not listening to arguments we might dislike? What if Brown had left money on the counter before he walked out of the store? What if Brown charged the police officer AFTER he was shot? It's a judge and jury's job to delve into those what-ifs, not mine nor yours.
Posted on: 2014/8/19 14:39
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Re: Black community responds to police shooting of unarmed black teenager by looting businesses
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Not for nothing, but you can?t claim ?biased media? and then link to Twitchy.com. Quote:
Every time I see buzzwords like ?liberal media,? I realize that the person writing up the post knows very little about how ?the media? operates. I?m willing to accept ?drive-by media? at times, but to assume that the story getting played out is biased by design is absurd. The whole point behind these stories is to get information, what little exists, out as fast as possible. It doesn?t matter the accuracy or how much information exists. What matters is who was first in reporting it. You said it yourself in the other post ?The initial witnesses lied?. Gee, and who reported those lies? Do you think the interviewer said ?This fits my liberal agenda? or do you think ?I?ve a golden nugget because this is a great story?? Quote:
Just out of curiosity, when has any community ever really taken responsibility for its own actions? For a recent example, the Catholic hierarchy promoted a guy to Pope after he spent years quashing information and protecting pedophiles, never mind the hiding of money when lawsuits break out against local parishes?
Posted on: 2014/8/19 14:36
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Dos A Cero
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Re: Black community responds to police shooting of unarmed black teenager by looting businesses
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First, Brown's own family admitted it was he in the video. It is evidence in its purest form-no spin, no shading, no opinions, just hard evidence that shows Brown committing two crimes-robbery and assault, minutes before the actions that caused his death. The other video, showing Brown dead on the ground, with live commentary saying he died charging the police, is the ONLY evidence we've seen from an eyewitness in REAL time with supporting video. The so-called 'eyewitnesses' that said he was shot, running away, in the back, are the ones you should have issue with.
Posted on: 2014/8/19 14:20
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Re: Black community responds to police shooting of unarmed black teenager by looting businesses
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Not clear to me - In downtown it seems we have had a large influx of Asians - Chinese and Indian. Are they the racists and xenophobes or is their moving here causing others to become racist and xenophobic? We also have a lot of young and prosperous people moving in of all sorts - are they the perps of xenophobia or the target?
Posted on: 2014/8/19 14:11
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Re: Black community responds to police shooting of unarmed black teenager by looting businesses
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None of what you mentioned are "facts". Brown wasn't convicted of the robbery. An eyewitness statement, is simply that, a statement that can have different meanings depending on context. They are arguments that should be subject to due process and not trial by media, nor trial and verdict by police nor Monroe.
Posted on: 2014/8/19 14:10
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Re: Black community responds to police shooting of unarmed black teenager by looting businesses
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This is one of the worst JCList threads in recent memory.
Posted on: 2014/8/19 14:09
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Re: Black community responds to police shooting of unarmed black teenager by looting businesses
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Those who prejudge should not, then, be surprised when they have the facts rubbed in their faces. Like the fact that Brown had just committed a robbery, and assaulted a store employee, minutes before the police action, while under the influence of drugs. Like the fact that a video, taken in real time, has an eyewitness saying the 6'4", 300lb man was charging the police at the time of the shooting. Which speaks to his state of mind at the time he was stopped and is critical to understanding the part he played in his own death.
Posted on: 2014/8/19 13:55
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This surprises you? You have seen the type of people moving to DTJC over the past three years, right? Pretty clear to me which direction it's going.
Posted on: 2014/8/19 13:46
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Re: Black community responds to police shooting of unarmed black teenager by looting businesses
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The attorney represents the interests of their client. So yes, it's fair to make that argument. The attorney's job isn't to be impartial, and credibility is best left to a judge and jury.
Posted on: 2014/8/19 13:37
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Re: Black community responds to police shooting of unarmed black teenager by looting businesses
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'Fair' when the attorney for the man killed are saying he was 'executed' and 'murdered', without a shred of evidence to support this?
Posted on: 2014/8/19 12:57
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Re: Black community responds to police shooting of unarmed black teenager by looting businesses
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You're the one with the - "only blacks riot and blame whitey" -narrative, not me. To me principles of justice are about due process, proportional response, fairness and impartiality. Was the shooting of an unarmed teenager proportional? Was the initial police response to protesters proportional? Do the community trust the local or state police to conduct a fair and impartial investigation to the shooting and subsequent events - or did the police's actions suggest they were closing ranks? I don't believe any of those answers are simply black and white. When the UN, Amnesty International, and other fairly independent bodies are questioning events, the least we can do is listen, and review practices and policies that have contributed to this situation. http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/08/ ... er-racial-discrimination/ http://blog.amnestyusa.org/us/amnesty ... because-all-lives-matter/ http://blog.amnestyusa.org/us/dispatch-from-ferguson-why-we-fight/ http://blog.amnestyusa.org/us/when-wi ... ustice-for-michael-brown/
Posted on: 2014/8/19 12:52
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Has anyone put the crowds in Ferguson in touch with the geniuses on jclist? I'm sure we'll have this straightened out in no time. LOL.
Posted on: 2014/8/19 10:45
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Unbelievable. More excuses and nonsense. At the heart of this "movement" we have riots in support of a robber who shoves people around like it's nothing. And who very well may have fought a cop and tried to take his gun. We also have "eyewitnesses" who think it's nothing to go on national TV and lie about what they saw (we know Brown was not shot in the back). We also have degenerates who have basically destroyed their town for this "cause," ruining the livelihoods of so many hard workers and ensuring no business will want to operate there for decades. Everyone involved being black I might add, not white or any other race. Is there a single person in the black community who says "Hmm. Maybe if we don't want bad things to happen, we shouldn't rob stores and attack cops?" No, at least not one that they are listening to. So there will be no lasting lesson. And then we have folks like you who try to blame white people for this, yet again. The timeless fallback argument. Your attitude only contributes to why this community is absolutely incapable of accepting personal responsibility (as this debacle so clearly illustrates). Yet you have some pithy remark aimed at white people.
Posted on: 2014/8/19 6:01
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You really haven't set foot outside the US have you? This response is NO different to ANY minority response to perceived injustice. White, black, asian, african - N.Ireland, Egypt, Gaza, Tiananmen Sq, Croatia, Bosnia, Rwanda, South Africa... wherever... Wake the #OOPS# up America. Just because you might be a majority, in a democracy., it doesn't mean you are right.
Posted on: 2014/8/19 4:08
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Sorry but this is where we disagree. The violent aftermath is intertwined with the killing. Also I get the feeling that if the killing actually had taken place like the lying witnesses said (the cop executed Brown by shooting him in the back just because he was black), you'd be singing a different tune. One big problem is that "perceived injustice can provoke unreasonable and disproportionate response" only in the black community. You would never see anything like this in a white, Hispanic, or Asian community. ESPECIALLY so soon, before any facts were in. And this isn't a new thing, these sorts of riots have been doing on for decades. Call it racist but it's just a fact. And think about this. Let's say that the events really went down as the officer described. This was 100% a justifiable self defense killing. And let's say based on this evidence, a grand jury does not indict the cop. We both know that regardless of the facts or truth, the black community (and not a small minority either) would go absolutely CRAZY. Even here in JC we would be at risk. This is at the root of the problem. An incredibly (self)destructive culture. Even though you seem to be approaching this in an objective manner, you know I'm right that there would be pandemonium if this cop was not charged with anything. Regardless of the truth. That is a tragedy in and of itself.
Posted on: 2014/8/19 3:51
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You and we have got to separate the killing from the aftermath. It's not a single narrative. That's another problem with trial by media. I'd say, perceived injustice can provoke unreasonable and disproportionate response. I honestly think the various gov agencies are doing a piss-poor job of managing this, Obama and down.
Posted on: 2014/8/19 2:44
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Re: Black community responds to police shooting of unarmed black teenager by looting businesses
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Wait a sec - so are you insinuating that courts and law enforcement should NOT consider character evidence in determining whether versions of events were more or less likely? In other words, do you not find it at all compelling that someone that attacked a guy and robbed a store 15 minutes earlier is more likely to attack cops vs. someone that was straight laced and never committed a crime in their life?
Posted on: 2014/8/19 2:35
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Funny, because I find the national response to this story to be mostly very disturbing and distasteful. And regardless of your feelings for an Internet thread (I think it provides much needed balance to biased media coverage), it has no real world impact, while the national response has ruined many people's lives. Anyway, I will spell out what is going on, as best I see it. The core of this issue is the media approached this story as it does most instances involving white v. black, where the black is perceived to be wronged. They sold their tried and true narrative of Black = victim and always innocent. Of course, black on black crime hurts this narrative so they do their best to minimize/ignore it. As it turns out, each fact that is released blows a hole in the narrative. A justified killing is the absolute last thing the media wants. This is why they have been desperately trying to shift the goalposts, on a daily basis. You could teach a University level course of Advanced Propaganda simply by looking at the top headline of each major media outlet and watch how it drastically shifted by the day. As the facts get worse and worse for this narrative, the media has turned their race-baiting into high gear. This article is a perfect example. I wouldn't call this advanced propaganda, more like propaganda 101. http://www.nydailynews.com/news/natio ... l-brown-article-1.1905564 Of course as many posts point out, this debacle isn't solely the media's fault. After all, if you look at the video taped at the scene, all the blacks there are already furious. They'd have absolutely no right to feel this way if it turns out the officer is telling the truth and Mike Brown grabbed the officer's gun and charged right at him. Which very well may be true. But facts matter little to these people, just emotions and life-long feelings of victimization and distrust. This is why many in the video initially confess they didn't see the shooting yet 2 min later are screaming THE COPS MURDERED HIM!!! Utterly lost in this debacle are the (many small) business owners who have seen their life's work go up in flames. The media has completely disregarded these people in the furtherance of the continued selling of their narrative. You want to know the sick moral I get from all of this? If the blacks in Staten Island rioted after the large man was killed by the police (and that one appears to be truly outrage worthy, a true murder), they would have probably gotten much better results.
Posted on: 2014/8/19 2:27
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Wish Sharpton would of been here to rally the community when they killed Detective Santiago for no reason and celebrqted the killer. Sharpton has taken the black community backwards, and looks like he is throwing gasoline on the fire down there.
Posted on: 2014/8/19 1:52
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Re: Black community responds to police shooting of unarmed black teenager by looting businesses
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Just can't stay away
 
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Shaun King wrote: "What 4 different witnesses saw is not opinion, but fact. W/O talking to each other or knowing each other, they all reported the same thing." And later, "And again, I accept that eye witnesses are unreliable, but it was a clear day on a clear street with no traffic. Furthermore..." I have to ask, what about this? http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/artic ... fficer-Darren-Wilson.html "Despite being difficult to make out, the conversation suggests that Brown ran towards Wilson before he was shot" And this: http://www.cnn.com/2014/08/18/us/miss ... ting/index.html?hpt=hp_t1 "Wilson pursued Brown and his friend, ordering them to freeze, according to the account. When they turned around, Brown began taunting Wilson, saying he would not arrest them, then ran at the officer at full speed, the caller said."
Posted on: 2014/8/19 1:30
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Re: Black community responds to police shooting of unarmed black teenager by looting businesses
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Wrong. I will repeat since you can't read. Anyway, the exact merits of the shooting are not the issue. The issue is the black and liberal community's immediate rush to judgment that this was an "execution," and the subsequent looting. Like another poster said, isn't it funny how the cop was immediately guilty in some people's minds yet any speculation about Brown is "character assassination" and disgusting?
Posted on: 2014/8/19 1:27
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Re: Black community responds to police shooting of unarmed black teenager by looting businesses
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Then why did you post it Jerseymom? Was it really illuminating. Were you fearful of black marauding gangs?
Posted on: 2014/8/19 1:26
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Re: Black community responds to police shooting of unarmed black teenager by looting businesses
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I find this thread mostly very disturbing and distasteful, but it highlights some themes...
- How can anyone get a fair and objective trial, when the matter has already been tried in the media (and on this forum) well before any case appearing in court? - Any death of a 18-year old by police gunfire deserves a fair, impartial and thorough independent investigation. - The police officers involved also deserve that same fair, impartial and independent treatment. There are serious doubts about the whole system of criminal justice in this country. There is a reason why other countries impose reporting restrictions on cases like this. As a country we need to get out of our 19th century way of handling things, rebuild trust in our legal and enforcement institutions - to ensure not only justice is done, but also justice is seen to be done.
Posted on: 2014/8/19 1:25
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I am not condemning the officer nor rashly exculpating him. However you are very quick to exonerate him and just seem to inexplicably know that mike brown the giant charged him and the officer was in fear for his life because of the threat posed. Case closed.
Posted on: 2014/8/19 1:24
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you're quick to say the eyewitnesses lied as though you know. And you are equally as quick to make your assumptions - as though you know, in this specific instance, me. Quote: and then jerseymom posts a Black Panther video (e.g. subtext "quick, they are coming for white people, get your guns")
Posted on: 2014/8/19 1:20
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