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Re: If you like your insurance...
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Quote:

Monroe wrote:
As much as vindication would like to have us believe, the facts are that Obama went in front of the public dozens of times and stated, flatly with NO qualifiers and/or exceptions, that if you liked your insurance and doctors you could keep them-PERIOD.

It was a craven lie designed to fool the American public just before an election, one that he won by a lesser margin than his first, and with fewer people voting.

It worked. His lies got him elected.

But it's apparent, by the fact that his poll ratings are the worst in his Presidency, that in addition to being a liar he's also an incompetent POTUS. Which, after all, is what we knew going in, as his experience was woefully lacking.

His legacy will, perhaps, be the worst POTUS in history. The water carriers, of course, will play the race card to diminish the fact, but it's color blind-white, black, mixed race he's been a disaster of his own creation.


How's this for a lie to win an election:
"Read my lips: no new taxes."

Posted on: 2013/11/22 15:07
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Re: If you like your insurance...
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Monroe wrote:
It was a craven lie designed to fool the American public just before an election, one that he won by a lesser margin than his first, and with fewer people voting.

It worked. His lies got him elected.
I don't see how 2 1/2 years before an election is "just before" and I don't see how winning in a landslide that wasn't as big as your previous landslide makes any difference.

I think you're the kind of guy that if Obama personally cured cancer tomorrow, would still be yelling about how he's a monster. That he's simultaneously an evil, lying, dictator and also a bumbling idiot that doesn't know what's going on.

Posted on: 2013/11/22 15:02
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Re: If you like your insurance...
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As much as vindication would like to have us believe, the facts are that Obama went in front of the public dozens of times and stated, flatly with NO qualifiers and/or exceptions, that if you liked your insurance and doctors you could keep them-PERIOD.

It was a craven lie designed to fool the American public just before an election, one that he won by a lesser margin than his first, and with fewer people voting.

It worked. His lies got him elected.

But it's apparent, by the fact that his poll ratings are the worst in his Presidency, that in addition to being a liar he's also an incompetent POTUS. Which, after all, is what we knew going in, as his experience was woefully lacking.

His legacy will, perhaps, be the worst POTUS in history. The water carriers, of course, will play the race card to diminish the fact, but it's color blind-white, black, mixed race he's been a disaster of his own creation.

Posted on: 2013/11/22 14:19
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Re: If you like your insurance...
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This whole commotion about canceled plans is stupid. Plans were canceled because they did not have have essential health benefits (via a Forbes article):

Ambulatory patient services ? Care you receive without being admitted to a hospital, such as at a doctor?s office, clinic or same-day (?outpatient?) surgery center. Also included in this category are home health services and hospice care (note: some plans may limit coverage to no more than 45 days)

Emergency services ? Care you receive for conditions that could lead to serious disability or death if not immediately treated, such as accidents or sudden illness. Typically, this is a trip to the emergency room, and includes transport by ambulance. You cannot be penalized for going out-of-network or for not having prior authorization.

Hospitalization ? Care you receive as a hospital patient, including care from doctors, nurses and other hospital staff, laboratory and other tests, medications you receive during your hospital stay, and room and board. Hospitalization coverage also includes surgeries, transplants and care received in a skilled nursing facility, such as a nursing home that specializes in the care of the elderly (note: some plans may limit skilled nursing facility coverage to no more than 45 days).

Laboratory services ? Testing provided to help a doctor diagnose an injury, illness or condition, or to monitor the effectiveness of a particular treatment. Some preventive screenings, such as breast cancer screenings and prostrate exams, are provided free of charge.

Maternity and newborn care ? Care that women receive during pregnancy (prenatal care), throughout labor, delivery and post-delivery, and care for newborn babies.

Mental health services and addiction treatment ? Inpatient and outpatient care provided to evaluate, diagnose and treat a mental health condition or substance abuse disorder (note: some plans may limit coverage to 20 days each year).

Rehabilitative Services and devices ? Rehabilitative and habilitative services and devices to help you gain or recover mental and physical skills lost to injury, disability or a chronic condition. Plans have to provide 30 visits each year for either physical or occupational therapy, or visits to the chiropractor. Plans must also cover 30 visits for speech therapy as well as 30 visits for cardiac or pulmonary rehab.

Pediatric Services ? Care provided to infants and children, including well-child visits and recommended vaccines and immunizations. Dental and vision care must be offered to children younger than 19. This includes two routine dental exams, an eye exam and corrective lenses each year.

Prescription drugs ? Medications that are prescribed by a doctor to treat an illness or condition. Examples include prescription antibiotics to treat an infection or medication used to treat an ongoing condition, such as high cholesterol. At least one prescription drug must be covered for each category and classification of federally approved drugs.

Preventive and wellness services and chronic disease treatment ? Preventive care, such as physicals, immunizations and cancer screenings designed to prevent or detect certain medical conditions. Also, care for chronic conditions, such as asthma and diabetes.

Which one of those do you think a human being is non deserving of? If you're a man, you might say, well, why do I have to subsidize maternity and newborn care. First, I want you to call your mother and ask her if it hurt to give birth to such an ungrateful son. Then, I want you to think of a world without mothers.

Here's an idea. Why are there even standards to car insurance? Why can't I choose a 500,000 deductible and pay $1 a year for car insurance? Don't worry...I never get into accidents.....

Posted on: 2013/11/22 12:47
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If you like your insurance...
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SEN. BOB MENENDEZ (D-N.J.): ?If you like what you have, you get to keep it? ?Menendez is a member of the Senate Finance Committee, which is expected to release a bill later this week. He stressed that consumers who are satisfied with their plans won't have to change. ?If you like what you have, you get to keep it,? he said.? (?Health Care Plan Would Help N.J., Menendez Says,? The Record, 6/19/09)

Obamacare Then, Affordable Care Act Now The term ?Obamacare? has largely disappeared from the mouths of Democrats as the president?s health care reform law has gone from a rallying cry to a political grenade... House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi, who has referred to the law as Obamacare in the past, told Meet the Press host David Gregory that she ?always? referred to it as the Affordable Care

So, I think tern's question is answered.

BTW, "Affordable"?


Posted on: 2013/11/22 12:30
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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The 'highlight' of Obama's 2 terms is going to be this cock up of monumental proportions-and it won't be the disgraceful website non-roll out, but when the true travesty of Obamacare on 85% of the populace becomes apparent. True socialism at work-screw the 85% to benefit the 15%.

If only the low information voters understood this during the last election rather than believe the lies they were told by Obama about his Obamacare . . . Add 'you'll keep the plan you like' to the famous lies like 'the checks in the mail'.

Posted on: 2013/10/30 18:06
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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As of right now,

"The system is down at the moment.
We are experiencing technical difficulties and hope to have them resolved soon. Please try again later.
In a hurry? You might be able to apply faster at our Marketplace call center. Call 1-800-318-2596 to talk with one of our trained representatives about applying over the phone."

Posted on: 2013/10/30 15:50
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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Sarah Lechner, Esq., general counsel of the New Jersey Hospital Association, which represents New Jersey?s hospitals and other healthcare providers, will deliver the keynote address at the seventh annual ?Rhonda Berry Health and Wellness Symposium,? 12:00-2:00 p.m. in Multipurpose Room B of the Student Union. Ms. Lechner will explore the major changes in the Affordable Care Act that will directly affect women with breast cancer. Admission is free.

Posted on: 2013/10/30 14:48
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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Quote:

Dolomiti wrote:
Quote:

borisp wrote:
It is a banal database lookup. It may have to look in a few databases, but it is a database lookup and nothing more.

It has to query a lot of different databases (including external ones) and get that info into the HHS DB. E.g. it checks with Experian to verify your identity, and the IRS to find your subsidy eligibility, and has to put that into its own DB.


Look, I liked the XX Century myself. I was younger, more beautiful and all that, - but we are not there anymore.

The search that Google is doing is much more complicated than a database lookup. And Google has been doing it for more than a decade now. And storing things... You do realize that people buying things on Amazon, PayPal transactiona, Ebay purchases, or simple blog commentaries, - it all involves storing of the data?

10 years ago (that means 4 years before the first iPhone) I would have taken your argument seriously... may be.


Quote:

Dolomiti wrote:
It wasn't perfect right out the gate, but it's already improving.


Do you want to share with us how exactly you determined that it is improving?

And I do not mean something like "it can't get worse so it must be improving", no. I mean, - what improvement have you observed so far?

Quote:

Dolomiti wrote:

Quote:
Now, do you think your very private data you put in there are secure?

All that data is pretty much out there already.

Nor is it going to hold the kinds of data that most hackers want anyway, like credit card info. I can't imagine that there is a nefarious desire to find out whether you're on a Bronze or Silver plan.


Why would a hacker want my credit card, if he can open one in my name?


Posted on: 2013/10/24 2:23
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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Quote:

borisp wrote:
It is a banal database lookup. It may have to look in a few databases, but it is a database lookup and nothing more.

It has to query a lot of different databases (including external ones) and get that info into the HHS DB. E.g. it checks with Experian to verify your identity, and the IRS to find your subsidy eligibility, and has to put that into its own DB.

It wasn't perfect right out the gate, but it's already improving.


Quote:
Now, do you think your very private data you put in there are secure?

All that data is pretty much out there already.

Nor is it going to hold the kinds of data that most hackers want anyway, like credit card info. I can't imagine that there is a nefarious desire to find out whether you're on a Bronze or Silver plan.

Posted on: 2013/10/20 20:30
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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its working fine now, just completed it and got enrolled.

Posted on: 2013/10/20 19:03
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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Worst part is they HHS keeps talking about the number of hits... but they can't tell how many people purchased insurance? They know... if they were high numbers, they would be broadcasting them everywhere. For ACA to work they need people to register and signup or else the house of cards crumbles.

Posted on: 2013/10/17 14:38
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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I don't care how bad the implementation is. It is my constitutional right that the US Government provide me with health insurance. Fulop said so.

Posted on: 2013/10/16 11:05
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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Quote:

bodhipooh wrote:


Armchair quarterbacking, based on conjectures, not facts. Unless said programmers had direct access to the server-side code (which means they were actually part of the development process and, thus, part of the problem) then they are just spouting FUD.

How could a "programmer" claim "serious programming flaws" without seeing the code? That would be like claiming that a highly anticipated book was hard to come by upon release because of bad writing.


Here is a fact for you: it has been almost 10 (TEN) years since the google's IPO. We have Amazon, and EBay, and Yelp, and Waze and whatnot. We can play Warcraft over the internet.

And the obamacare site doesn't need to do any sophisticated searches, or 3d modelling, or do a high-frequency trading, or calculate an optimal route over countless number of possibilities.

It is a banal database lookup. It may have to look in a few databases, but it is a database lookup and nothing more.

The site that can barely handle tens of thousands requests per day, - is not a XXI century technology. It is something from the nineties.


This is something that you should be able to outsource to India for 6 months and 100K dollars.

When it is takes 3 years and has a price tag of more than half a BILLION dollars, it is not just a technological disaster, it is a total CF.


Now, do you think your very private data you put in there are secure?






Posted on: 2013/10/16 2:11
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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I_heart_JC wrote:
Quote:

bodhipooh wrote:
Quote:

I have read a few posts by experienced programmers that it is not the volume of hits that caused the system to freeze up, but serious programming flaws.


Armchair quarterbacking, based on conjectures, not facts. Unless said programmers had direct access to the server-side code (which means they were actually part of the development process and, thus, part of the problem) then they are just spouting FUD.

How could a "programmer" claim "serious programming flaws" without seeing the code? That would be like claiming that a highly anticipated book was hard to come by upon release because of bad writing.


fun analogy, bohdi, but flawed...

Everything you need to know about ACA's error-plauged websites - Washington Post

"That initial traffic rush is now over and the Obama administration says it's buying more servers to cope with future traffic spikes. So in the long run, dealing with traffic volumes shouldn't be a serious problem.
But the exchange may have deeper design flaws. As discussed above, the site needs to interact with a large number of databases operated by various federal and state agencies. If these back-end systems are poorly designed, it could take months or even years to straighten out the mess."


As long as the front end links your healthcare history/information to the IRS with know problem, Big Brother will be happy!

Posted on: 2013/10/15 18:01
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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Quote:

bodhipooh wrote:
Quote:

I have read a few posts by experienced programmers that it is not the volume of hits that caused the system to freeze up, but serious programming flaws.


Armchair quarterbacking, based on conjectures, not facts. Unless said programmers had direct access to the server-side code (which means they were actually part of the development process and, thus, part of the problem) then they are just spouting FUD.

How could a "programmer" claim "serious programming flaws" without seeing the code? That would be like claiming that a highly anticipated book was hard to come by upon release because of bad writing.


fun analogy, bohdi, but flawed...

Everything you need to know about ACA's error-plauged websites - Washington Post

"That initial traffic rush is now over and the Obama administration says it's buying more servers to cope with future traffic spikes. So in the long run, dealing with traffic volumes shouldn't be a serious problem.
But the exchange may have deeper design flaws. As discussed above, the site needs to interact with a large number of databases operated by various federal and state agencies. If these back-end systems are poorly designed, it could take months or even years to straighten out the mess."

Posted on: 2013/10/15 5:01
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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Americans Must Be Able to Obtain Health Care Coverage As Is Their Right Under the Law

Steven Fulop - Mayor, Jersey City
The Huffington Post
Posted: 10/14/2013 10:05 am

In the 1930's, Democrats created Social Security over the vocal opposition of Republicans. Today the program is an enduring legacy. It is recognized as the politically untouchable third rail of politics that provides for millions of Americans. In the 1960's, Democrats created Medicare over the vocal opposition of Republicans. Today, it's wildly popular among both older Americans and the medical community that treats them. See a pattern? It is likely to continue.

Democrats created the Affordable Care Act. Republican opposition has made the fights about Social Security and Medicare look like a walk in the park. While it's far too soon to say this program will prove as popular as the others, what is almost criminal is how opponents of the law are essentially denying Americans their now constitutionally guaranteed rights.

In their contempt for the law, too many state governments have made it next to impossible for their citizens to obtain coverage while at the same time almost ridiculing those who want to sign up. On Saturday at a rally in New Jersey, according to The New York Times, Sarah Palin rejected the notion that people should accept the Affordable Care Act though it was passed by Congress, signed into law by the President and upheld by the Supreme Court. Of course, Palin undoubtedly has fine health care coverage for herself yet she chooses to, in essence, criticize those who want to do the same for themselves and their families.

This is a tragedy. Opponents of the law are now so reckless in their hatred that they have shut down the government and threaten the stability and reputation of America not just at home but internationally as well.

While this is going on, ordinary people simply want to ensure they have affordable health coverage that previously they were unable to obtain. So while the opponents scream, let's take a look on the local level at the practical impact of the law in its first few weeks of implementation. In my city, about 55,000 residents -- nearly 20 percent of the Jersey City population -- currently have no health insurance. With the launch of the Affordable Care Act Marketplace, we had the responsibility to inform residents of their options are and how to apply. That is why the City developed a robust and proactive plan to assist residents in answering their questions and applying online.

The City partnered on a federally-funded mobile Navigator Program through a $400,000 grant that hired four bilingual counselors to visit businesses, community groups, and local non-profits to enroll residents. Only six federal grants were allocated in New Jersey, and Jersey City is the only municipality with a bilingual, mobile model. Additionally, the Department of Health and Human Services has 10 certified application counselors, many of whom are bilingual, to help residents understand their health coverage options and enroll them.

If it is possible to see the demand and need in a mid-size American city, imagine the broader results if each community in the United States undertook to ensure its citizens were aggressively advised of their rights under the law.

With history as a guide, not only will Americans be healthier because of their new right, so will the economy despite the outrageous claims made by opponents. Social Security and Medicare have benefitted not just older Americans but the economy at large as well. It is likely over the next few years and then for generations to come the Affordable Care Act will achieve similar results.

Steve Fulop is the Mayor of Jersey City, NJ.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/steven- ... t-coverage_b_4096820.html

Posted on: 2013/10/14 23:54
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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I heard an interesting interview this weekend where the former director of Medicaid thought the federal ACA website could not be repaired any time soon - certainly not in time for the Jan 1 launch of benefits. He had some serious concerns about the security issues connected with the site as well. At the close of the interview, he believed that the entire system would need to be scrapped and started over again.

Here's some interesting info to keep in mind as well:

Article

It?s been widely reported that the uninsured have until March 31 to buy coverage in the insurance marketplaces under the Affordable Care Act.

While it?s true the marketplace?s open enrollment lasts that long, those who intend to shop for insurance probably won?t want to wait. Bloomberg reports that people who buy coverage in March will end up paying a penalty.

Plans purchased between March 1 and March 15 wouldn?t take effect until April and coverage bought in the final days of March wouldn?t kick in until May. The Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act of 2010 requires most Americans have an active health insurance policy by March 31 or pay the higher of 1 percent of their annual income or $95.

Under the Affordable Care Act, starting Jan. 1, people who have access to affordable coverage and instead remain uninsured for more than three consecutive months will owe the ?individual responsibility? tax payment for those months, a Department of Health and Human Services spokeswoman told BNA in an e-mail.

Much also has been reported about high deductibles some marketplace plans include. Bloomberg reports that some people might not understand the significance of high deductibles until they seek health care.

When Barbara Retkowski went to a Cape Coral, Florida, health clinic in August to treat a blood condition, she figured the center would bill her insurance company. Instead, it demanded payment upfront.

Earlier in the year, another clinic insisted she pay her entire remaining insurance deductible for the year ? more than $1,000 ? before the doctor would even see her.

?I was surprised and frustrated,? Retkowski, a 59-year-old retiree, said in an interview. ?I had to pull money out of my savings.?

The practice of upfront payment for non-emergency care has been spreading in the U.S. as deductibles rise. Now, the advent of the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act is likely to accelerate that trend.

Many of the plans offered through the law?s insurance exchanges have low initial premiums to attract customers, while carrying significant deductibles and other out-of-pocket cost sharing. The second-lowest tier of Obamacare plans in California, for example, carries a $2,000 annual deductible.

Hospitals say they need to charge patients prior to treatment because Americans are increasingly on the hook for more of their own medical costs. And once care is provided, it?s often difficult for hospitals to collect.

?It used to be taboo to look like you were looking for money at a time when you were supposed to be focused on patient care,? David Williams, president of Boston-based consulting firm Health Business Group, said. ?It?s not taboo anymore.?

Posted on: 2013/10/14 22:38
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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Still broken. You can now actually set up an account and submit an application. A pretty bad experience, need to submit the same information several times throughout the process and long load times.

But if you log out and back into the system it says your application is "in progress" and if you click on it gives you the impression that your application was never submitted (You are sent to the beginning of the application, the forms have your your previously entered data though).

No email confirmation, however chat says my application probably was submitted and I should hear something in 2 business days.

Posted on: 2013/10/14 17:54
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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Quote:

bodhipooh wrote:
Quote:

I have read a few posts by experienced programmers that it is not the volume of hits that caused the system to freeze up, but serious programming flaws.


Armchair quarterbacking, based on conjectures, not facts. Unless said programmers had direct access to the server-side code (which means they were actually part of the development process and, thus, part of the problem) then they are just spouting FUD.

How could a "programmer" claim "serious programming flaws" without seeing the code? That would be like claiming that a highly anticipated book was hard to come by upon release because of bad writing.


I don't think you need to see the code... most websites are designed with the same or similar toolsets. Its how the hosting sites are designed to handle/manage traffic, if you have one server as opposed to multiple servers hosting you will have problems accessing the site; it sounds like that is where the failure occurred; Imagine what will happen on the last day for siging up for ACA... Picture the lines at the post office on the last day to file your taxes... it will be crazy trying to access these sites!

Posted on: 2013/10/4 23:09
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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Posted on: 2013/10/4 21:52
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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CRAP!

Just got a letter from my employer's insurance company.. The nice high deductible plan we have is being dropped due to ACA.

No idea what will replace it though, but I suspect the HSA will be history after the end of this year.

My employer is kind of small and before our current insurance, insurance costs was a major issue.

Jerseymom! There is a chance now I too will be hitting the 'reload' button the the ACA insurance exchange website in the not too distant future.

Posted on: 2013/10/4 21:15
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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Michaelangelo Conte/The Jersey Journal

About 50 to 60 people seeking information on healthcare insurance under the Affordable Care Act have visited Jersey City?s Metropolitan Family Health Network today, one of several places in the city providing counseling.

?The last three days we have been providing information seminars one on one and handing out brochures and pamphlets with a general overview of the Affordable Care Act Marketplace and Obama Care,? said Certified Application Counselor Payal Shah this afternoon.

Counselors had planned to guide those signing up for insurance through the process on the healthcare.gov website but a glitch has prevented the office from accessing the site since registration for Obama Care began Tuesday.

Shah said many people don?t feel comfortable navigating the website on their own or don?t have a computer at home so the office is taking their names and numbers and will call them to return to the office when the website becomes accessible there.

?I need to have my insurance,? said Immacula Pognon, who moved to Jersey City from Haiti in 2010. She caught sight of the brochures and counselors just inside the door of Metropolitan Family Health Network and got all the information she could.

The office also shows a video to those seeking information which ?provides an overview of health insurance reform and the Affordable Care Act Marketplace, breaking it down into simple terms,? said Shah. The video is available in English and Spanish.

Shah said most people seeking healthcare information at the office have been in their 30s or older.

Application counselors are available from 9 a.m. to 5 p.m. at the office at 935 Garfield Ave. Enrollment ends March 31.

Other Jersey City locations where information on the ACA Marketplace is available are:

-- The Jersey City Health Department office at 1 Journal Square (M-F 8 a.m. to 5 p.m.)-

-- The Preventative Clinic at 115 Christopher Columbus Drive (M/W/F ? 10 a.m. to noon & 2 p.m. to 4 p.m.)

-- The Bethune Center at 140 Martin Luther King, Jr. Drive (M-F 8 a.m. to 4 p.m.)

-- The Urban League of Hudson County office at 253 Martin Luther King Drive (M-F 10 a.m. to 4 p.m.)

Using a $400,000 grant, Jersey City and Public Health Solutions have partnered to hire four bilingual counselors to visit businesses, community group and local non-profits to enroll residents for coverage in Essex and Hudson counties.
More information about the ACA Marketplace is available at healthcare.gov.

Posted on: 2013/10/4 17:19
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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I have read a few posts by experienced programmers that it is not the volume of hits that caused the system to freeze up, but serious programming flaws.


Armchair quarterbacking, based on conjectures, not facts. Unless said programmers had direct access to the server-side code (which means they were actually part of the development process and, thus, part of the problem) then they are just spouting FUD.

How could a "programmer" claim "serious programming flaws" without seeing the code? That would be like claiming that a highly anticipated book was hard to come by upon release because of bad writing.

Posted on: 2013/10/4 13:01
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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jerseymom wrote:
Was anyone here successful in actually signing up, getting through the application process and securing a plan? Not me...


Checking the news, you are not alone... Not just NJ, but the country as a whole. I have read a few posts by experienced programmers that it is not the volume of hits that caused the system to freeze up, but serious programming flaws.

Time will tell if their assertions have weight.

Posted on: 2013/10/4 11:51
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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Was anyone here successful in actually signing up, getting through the application process and securing a plan? Not me...

Posted on: 2013/10/3 23:13
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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drifterx wrote:
Large numbers of healthy people paying into any health insurance are always the ones that make it work.


Actually, this isn't health insurance. Insurance works by the insurance company looking up the odds that you will get sick or hurt via actuary tables. If you smoke, skydive, drink heavily, etc.. the risk and therefor the rate is higher.

Premiums charged cover administrative costs with the rest invested in stocks, bonds, government debt, etc. Claims are then paid out via income and capital gains derived from the said investments, with whatever left over being potential profit.

When you force one class of people to pay into the system above what they would normally pay to cover another.. that is not insurance. It's a forced transfer of wealth.

NJ tried this years ago by becoming a guaranteed issue (can't be turned down) and community rating state. The latter meant that an insurer was required by law to charge the same rate to a healthy 25 year old male as to a 50 year old overweight heavy smoker with a heart condition.

Years back, whilst not covered at work, the best plan I could get was Blue Cross at $600+ per month. This was a non starter since I earned a whopping $25k per year. Worse, it was an 80/20 plan, which meant if I had a catastrophic issue and ran up $1 million in bills, I would still be bankrupt, as the insurance didn't cover 20% of the costs.

NJ did pass reforms later that did allow some high deductible indemnity style plans. This is the kind that people in Jerseymom's situation would often get: You pay routine costs out of pocket, but you are covered for big stuff. If I had moved to PA way back when, I could have been covered, with a large deductible, up to $3million for $125 per month.

NJ however, still loads on a lot of regulatory crap (they are still limited on the spread between the young and healthy and those that are not). As a result, indemnity plans cost 1.5x to 3X more than say a low regulation state like TX. My sister-in-law is paying about 1.5x for less insurance she got in TX (the TX plan included $250k of term life insurance).

The irony (if not right out evilness) of ACA, it makes these basic, indemnity style plans illegal. ACA requires a certain percentage of the premium to be paid into claims. With indemnity plans, a large portion of the premium is admin costs since they only pay out for catastrophic illnesses.

100,000 younger and lower income people in NJ are losing bare bones insurance as a result of ACA.

So now, we will be forcing people to pay for subsidies and buy insurance they don't want or need. Given that the fine is cheaper than the insurance and (from what I have read) can only be collected by the IRS deducting it out of your tax refund, I expect a lot of younger 'invincible' types will say screw it and forgo the insurance. When I was young, I went without insurance for a while because at what I was being charged, it was worth the risk to go without.

It is fitting that the ACA help line number is 1-800-FUCKYO

Posted on: 2013/10/3 12:10
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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Well, I don't know about you but I'm tired of being that cash cow.

Posted on: 2013/10/2 22:37
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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True, hospital billing structures are ridiculously byzantine. But the fact is, employers and insurers ARE paying hugely inflated prices, even after the substantial discounts they get. Very few individuals are paying the real cost of a long-term hospitalization without insurance - it's usually written off and absorbed by the paying customers. Universal coverage is an attempt to spread those costs over a bigger pool of people.

It's somewhat disingenuous to compare the US model to countries with national helathcare systems - part of the reason their costs are lower is that they can buy technology that is developed for the highly-profitable US market. If the cash cow of US medical costs went away, costs would go up all over the world.

Posted on: 2013/10/2 17:19
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Re: Affordable Care Act - Does anyone have any info about this?
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drifterx wrote:
Large numbers of healthy people paying into any health insurance are always the ones that make it work. It's just now that insurance companies can't have their cake and eat it too: they can't turn away people with pre-existing conditions. Am I missing something here?

Anyway, I've been trying to create an account and I've run into the security question glitch where you get blank fields on the dropdown. I can see why people are frustrated but it's early and we have until December to wrap up enrollment. I wish this could have gone smoother but it has become the norm to see these issues with massive rollouts.


Your first paragraph, change healthy to working and health insurance into social security and I think you have described the underfunded social security net in America... now the government bureaucrats have taken control of your healthcare. There are some good things about ACA like the precondition but there are many more issues that are bad or need to be addressed and unfortunately we have put ourselves in the hands of the government and the track record over the last 15 years has not been good.


Posted on: 2013/10/2 15:03
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