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Re: Parking Too Close to Crosswalks
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not to stir the pot any more .... but


I was told (when I was a student) that students are not required to change their plates/registration/addresses because its a temporary thing. This is possibly why the JCPA has to work with this bc a student could live in JC part of the year (ie sept - may) but legally be a resident of some other city/state etc. However your wife was told that she legally has to change (bc that is the rule when you move - you have 30 days to update your registration/insurance etc as to your new address)

Posted on: 2011/4/4 17:50
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Goodmorning JC_Downtownregular....

I like the debating, intelligent sparing about real topics with people who have an open mind.

Times here are changing, yes for the better! Im not beating you up but your here 7 years , Im here close to a half century. Ouch that hurt. The transformation has been incredible. In JC now , unless you go to different sections of the city , change is going to be harder for you to see. The people in charge are doing , what was done downtown 20 plus years ago, in other areas of the city. It takes time. I have no idea what street you live on but some of downtown wasnt the greatest of places , yes my family and I once lived there. I ll bet you wouldnt have lived here back then. It took the 20 plus years to change...Descisions made then have to be re thought and a new plan of attack has to come from that...

Heres one.... this is off the top of my head, since I was researching past practices of the PA, I found that they owned the lot where the BJs and Shoprite is. It was let go so cheap so the developers could invest and build. 20 plus years later , hind sight being 20/20 . Bad move. that could have made a great parking deck for the commuters . But back then , who knew.

Back then maybe the people in charge didnt have the ability to look that far in the future. That was just one decision from just one agency at one time made then that impacts now. It would be great to take that back but thats not happening. With the people in charge today , I see they have vision! Looking for ways to increase parking for all residents and visitors. Trying to , hate to say correct the descisions made back then because maybe the descisions made were the best they could do, so I will call it adjusting the descisions.

OH I understand about the certian cars get a ticket and some dont. Not to air others dirty laundry so I wont get into specifics but there was issues in another part of the city in regards to this. A friend called the JCPA CEO and explained her complaint The CEO sent someone in and summons were issued. We were both standing there. We were impressed. The ones who got tickets didnt complain about it, they sucked it up like men/women . People are being held accountable . Its better . Again it wont happen over night.

The people working to make this city better, I believe are trying . It takes time and im sorry to say change for some things , 7 years may be a stepping stone.

Posted on: 2011/4/4 4:00
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jcresident0001 wrote:
JC_Downtownregular...

You must have gotten an A in Biology in school the way you dissect each of my answers. I believe that you dont want the right answers, just answers that will create controversy. I do understand that , it comes from frustration. I was the same way until i realized that it will get me "ZERO".


I like to call it debating. You raise points and I either agree or disagree and debate on a point by point basis. Am I looking for a right answer? No. Am I looking for a wrong answer? No. I am just giving you my point of view from my experience and my facts. Am I right and you wrong or vice versa? No. Do I want to stir controversy? No. Am I frustrated? Yes, at the unresponsive and contemptuous JC government. Am I actually trying to get influence change in JC policy and government this through this medium know as JCList? You've got to be kidding me. Do I, like so many other people, old timers and newcomers, come here to complain and vent full knowing that I will get responses ranging from sympathetic to outright disingenuous and uncalled for? Yes.

Quote:

I will leave you with the answer to your last experiment...
There have been and always will be people who will beat the system. Thats human nature. Also im sure there are special circumstances.

In December I was up on Central ave , as like you doing the permit thing when a young man came in and was being helped right next to me. He was on the phone, I believe with one of his parental units , as he was speaking with the JCPA rep. This man lived in JC but the vehicle , which was an out of stater, was registered to his parents. Meaning that he did live in JC (not sure what zone) but the vehicle belonged to his parents who are from another state. The man must have called before he got there because he had alot of documentation proving he lived there. If memory serves , he had a PSEG bill and a copy of lease. Yes they did give him a resident permit. So an out of state plate did get a residential permit.


Interestingly, when my wife moved to JC, her vehicle was registered to her parents, and she provided the deed for her residence and various bills. The JCPA would only give her a temp permit with 30-days to register the vehicle with the current address and the vehicle registered in her name.

Quote:

Are consessions made for some circumstances, yes. Do I think the JCPA/PD are "Out to get the resident"? I did, then I reaserched some things and found that thier job is preserving parking for the resident while making this city commuter friendly. That comes at a cost. Always have and always will. 30 years ago when it started ,who knew!!!


When they ticket resident vehicles at 6:30 AM and don't ticket the vehicle with a police shield in the windshield, yes they are out to get the resident and exhibit favoritism towards a fellow law enforcement officer over residents. Enforcement has recently had nothing to do with preserving parking and is all about increasing the money in the city's coffers. The JCPA and PD hide this new ticketing campaign under the guise of public safety, but the JCPA admitted to taking a hit when alternate side was canceled for two months and neither the JCPA or PD had such aggressive enforcement done before for the same violations. Only time will be the judge when we see if this steeped up enforcement continues when their pockets are overflowing.

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You stated that you are here 7 years correct? You got here after the downtown section had gone through its change from a section full of broken down buildings, boarded up factories and empty lots to the "West Gold Coast" we have now . And you, as a tax payer and a resident want the whole thing fixed to your liking over night. Sorry pal not happening. It takes time . Yes I a lifer of JC , they will probably plant me in the cemetary on Garfield ave when my time comes. Im very proud to make that statement. I understand what it takes to make changes ,some do some dont .


I never asked for changes. I am just pointing out discrepancies in policy and enforcement and just would like some consistency across the board. Believe you me, I know more about trying to implement changes in government than I would care to know. Let's just call it an occupational hazard for me.

Quote:

Im sure all these complaints and rants ,when people talk in thier own circles, start with the topic of "Government Corruption" . Its easy to do . Am I happy with my taxes going up ? No But I remember, you dont, when taxes didnt go up at all for years!! The beautiful brownstones downtown were dirt cheap!! They were giving them away! Now that JC is "The place to live" , Its gonna cost you!!


I have no problem paying my fair share of taxes and I am happy for you when taxes didn't go up for years. I don't appreciate my taxes going up 333% in 7 years and getting lousy services in the form of policing, education, waste management, infrastructure, and non transparent corrupt government.

Quote:

Im going to get off my soap box now and leave you with this last statement. People who want to crank up the masses with assumptions just make things worse.

Have a great day


I am not cranking up with the masses. As I have said these are my personal experiences. Maybe if so many people are "cranking up" with the same bad experiences it is actually JC that is making things worse for the residents. Are there people out there with a sense of entitlement? You bet. Are there people that like the status quo? You bet.

Posted on: 2011/4/3 18:37
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Re: Parking Too Close to Crosswalks
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JC_Downtownregular...

You must have gotten an A in Biology in school the way you dissect each of my answers. I believe that you dont want the right answers, just answers that will create controversy. I do understand that , it comes from frustration. I was the same way until i realized that it will get me "ZERO".

I will leave you with the answer to your last experiment...
There have been and always will be people who will beat the system. Thats human nature. Also im sure there are special circumstances.

In December I was up on Central ave , as like you doing the permit thing when a young man came in and was being helped right next to me. He was on the phone, I believe with one of his parental units , as he was speaking with the JCPA rep. This man lived in JC but the vehicle , which was an out of stater, was registered to his parents. Meaning that he did live in JC (not sure what zone) but the vehicle belonged to his parents who are from another state. The man must have called before he got there because he had alot of documentation proving he lived there. If memory serves , he had a PSEG bill and a copy of lease. Yes they did give him a resident permit. So an out of state plate did get a residential permit.

Are consessions made for some circumstances, yes. Do I think the JCPA/PD are "Out to get the resident"? I did, then I reaserched some things and found that thier job is preserving parking for the resident while making this city commuter friendly. That comes at a cost. Always have and always will. 30 years ago when it started ,who knew!!!

You stated that you are here 7 years correct? You got here after the downtown section had gone through its change from a section full of broken down buildings, boarded up factories and empty lots to the "West Gold Coast" we have now . And you, as a tax payer and a resident want the whole thing fixed to your liking over night. Sorry pal not happening. It takes time . Yes I a lifer of JC , they will probably plant me in the cemetary on Garfield ave when my time comes. Im very proud to make that statement. I understand what it takes to make changes ,some do some dont .

Im sure all these complaints and rants ,when people talk in thier own circles, start with the topic of "Government Corruption" . Its easy to do . Am I happy with my taxes going up ? No But I remember, you dont, when taxes didnt go up at all for years!! The beautiful brownstones downtown were dirt cheap!! They were giving them away! Now that JC is "The place to live" , Its gonna cost you!!

Im going to get off my soap box now and leave you with this last statement. People who want to crank up the masses with assumptions just make things worse.

Have a great day

Posted on: 2011/4/3 4:50
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Re: Parking Too Close to Crosswalks
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The amount of out of staters would be alot less on the weekends You would be surprised how many people commute into the city from out of state to work. I can see your wheels turning from here. Your saying....Public Transportation to get to JC.... right.. I agree but what I see downtown and all over the city during the day is out of staters 10 to 1 weekdays to weekends

Theyr is a Non Resident permit for out of staters . They have to show proof of employment in JC , then they pay 300.00 per year.


Ok, somehow I don't think that the owners of the KY or NY vehicles with the permits for Zone 5 of all places work here. They are more than likely residents.

Also, just what states are these people traveling great lengths from to park illegally in NJ? NYC folks that work in JC won't want to hazard the traffic of Manhattan to get into JC. CT folks wouldn't either. Pennsylvania types typically take the Martz buses. And the cars I see with the NH and ME plates probably aren't commuters either.

What I find in the mornings and find more believable are other JC residents from other parts of JC and NJ state residents from outside of JC parking downtown and hopping on the PATH into NYC. I don't think that the great influx of vehicles with NJ tags in the morning in Zone 5 that disappear by the time I get home from work belong to residents and they certainly don't belong to employees at the waterfront.

Posted on: 2011/4/2 22:19
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The amount of out of staters would be alot less on the weekends You would be surprised how many people commute into the city from out of state to work. I can see your wheels turning from here. Your saying....Public Transportation to get to JC.... right.. I agree but what I see downtown and all over the city during the day is out of staters 10 to 1 weekdays to weekends

Theyr is a Non Resident permit for out of staters . They have to show proof of employment in JC , then they pay 300.00 per year.

Posted on: 2011/4/2 21:30
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8 out of state plates on a saturday isnt alot? 8 on a short walk to the store isnt alot??? Serious? what about the rest of the area? You want numbers , give me a bit of time. Are you in JC during the day weekdays? I ll bet you its 10 times that amount between Grand st and 9th from Marin Blvd to the water. If you ever want to take a ride around on a weekday just let me know... Id take a day off for that tour.


Like I said, I would actually expect an increase in weekends. And two of those eight cars with out of state plates have resident parking permits. How does a KY and a NY registered vehicle get a resident permit? And yes the license on the permit matched the license on the vehicle.

Posted on: 2011/4/2 13:27
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Real quick,,, court date rescheduel , new court date , cant make it can it be next week..... on and on ... The 2 tickets are it just tickets with ticket dates and then the BOOT. Quicker easier and fair.

The ex CEO who was fired booted wrongly yes, thats why he s the EX CEO. The new CEO has to clean up the messes he left like giving money back for wrongly booted vehicles, 4 to 5 year old lawsuits equiptment bought and placed in the wrong places and things like that. I believe she is doing a good job considering it seems like putting out fires have been first and foremost, yes with much more to do.

8 out of state plates on a saturday isnt alot? 8 on a short walk to the store isnt alot??? Serious? what about the rest of the area? You want numbers , give me a bit of time. Are you in JC during the day weekdays? I ll bet you its 10 times that amount between Grand st and 9th from Marin Blvd to the water. If you ever want to take a ride around on a weekday just let me know... Id take a day off for that tour.

Im not trying to win anyone over I just state facts as I get them . This was stuck in my craw for years . Like I said I probably paid for some of thier equiptment with what they have hit me in the past that is why i WANT the RIGHT answers and I try to pass them along.

Posted on: 2011/4/2 12:59
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jcresident0001 wrote:
JC_Downtownregular....

Goodmorning... The first time booting is ONLY done in Reserve Permit spaces , Resident Only spaces I believe they are Zones by the Light rail and colleges.
Non issue.. Do you have any idea how much money is outstanding with the out of staters!! There is an outstanding debt of Scofflaw in JC of almost 10 million!!!!!! The only ones that can get picked out are the Jersey Residents . Out of staters get a pass. Thats fair ? They use this state to park without care and we pay. Sorry pal, that is a Big issue.

The change in the Ordinance is instead of (3) FTAs then the boot, it would be (2) outstanding tickets then boot . Thats outstanding from the court dates. A much faster process. The Out of staters are subject to those rules because the JCPA can keep track of the dates the tickets are issued and can tell by thier records without going through DMV. The (3) FTA process could take months , 3 months plus. The (2) outstanding tickets process is weeks. Again sorry, another Huge issue.

Also the Out of state vehicles with permits are purchased by the owner of the vehicle AFTER proving that the owner works in JC. The cost of that permit is $300.00.

Im sorry again my friend , take a good look during the day there are more out of state plates then you think.

I hope this explains what the issues are and why they need to be addressed/changed .


No, booting was done on a first violation basis for many years up until recently. My sister-in-law's ex-boyfriend was parked on Jersey Ave and was booted after his first offense. It was probably because he had NY plates and the JCPA thought it was an easy target. I'd have to do some searching around the threads but I know other people had been booted on their first violation. Wasn't the JCPA ordered to reimburse the boot fee for those that were improperly booted?

On my way back from doing laundry, I took a quick notice of how many out of state cars are packed in a five block area around my part of downtown. It is the weekend so I would expect a greater number of out-of-state vehicles here. I counted 8 cars with non-NJ plates and two of them, one with a KY plate and one with a NY plate, had resident parking permits that expire sometime in the next eight months. I would bet that these cars belong to residents and not non-JC residents that work here.

Again, I don't see this huge number of out-of-state vehicles parked in downtown. Maybe if the JCPA could provide numbers in the form of a study rather than conjecture of how many out-of-state vehicles are actually illegally parked, as as well as how many within state vehicles that are illegally parked, I would give this notion of millions of dollars lost some more credibilty.

I don't understand how a 3 FTA violations takes month and a 2 FTA process takes weeks.

So you still haven't won me over with this being a big issue rather than the JCPA going down rabbit holes.

Posted on: 2011/4/2 12:42
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JC_Downtownregular....

Goodmorning... The first time booting is ONLY done in Reserve Permit spaces , Resident Only spaces I believe they are Zones by the Light rail and colleges.
Non issue.. Do you have any idea how much money is outstanding with the out of staters!! There is an outstanding debt of Scofflaw in JC of almost 10 million!!!!!! The only ones that can get picked out are the Jersey Residents . Out of staters get a pass. Thats fair ? They use this state to park without care and we pay. Sorry pal, that is a Big issue.

The change in the Ordinance is instead of (3) FTAs then the boot, it would be (2) outstanding tickets then boot . Thats outstanding from the court dates. A much faster process. The Out of staters are subject to those rules because the JCPA can keep track of the dates the tickets are issued and can tell by thier records without going through DMV. The (3) FTA process could take months , 3 months plus. The (2) outstanding tickets process is weeks. Again sorry, another Huge issue.

Also the Out of state vehicles with permits are purchased by the owner of the vehicle AFTER proving that the owner works in JC. The cost of that permit is $300.00.

Im sorry again my friend , take a good look during the day there are more out of state plates then you think.

I hope this explains what the issues are and why they need to be addressed/changed .

Posted on: 2011/4/2 9:52
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jklm wrote:

Jersey City has to give up some portion of the revenue from state and federal violations (too close to hydrant and also too close to stop sign or curb).


Pardon my ignorance, but exactly what parking violations violate federal law?



I really find it unnecessary to get into specifics - I was just stating what I had heard, I can't cite regulations from google searches nor do I care to debate this point. The point is that Jersey City does not collect all the money from parking violations.
But there are federal guidelines behind some practices, but whatever.

Posted on: 2011/4/2 2:29
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Quote:

JC_DowntownRegular wrote:
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jklm wrote:

Jersey City has to give up some portion of the revenue from state and federal violations (too close to hydrant and also too close to stop sign or curb).


Pardon my ignorance, but exactly what parking violations violate federal law?



http://www.ehow.com/about_5396723_fed ... andicap-parking-laws.html


From CRS Report for Congress Federal Law on Parking Privileges for Persons with Disabilities

"State law generally governs parking privileges for people with disabilities. However, federal regulations offer a uniform system of parking privileges, which includes model definitions and rules regarding license plates and placards, parking and parking space design, and interstate reciprocity. The federal government encourages states to adopt this uniform system. As a result, most states have incorporated at least some aspects of the uniform regulations into their handicapped parking laws."

From briefly skimming the report and your link, I don't see a federal parking law. The federal government has a set of regulations and guidelines that states can adopt, but there is no federal law or any CFR that specifically indicates that someone can receive a ticket for improperly parking in a handicapped space. Those are laws developed by states and local municipalities.

Posted on: 2011/4/2 0:56
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Jersey City has to give up some portion of the revenue from state and federal violations (too close to hydrant and also too close to stop sign or curb).


Pardon my ignorance, but exactly what parking violations violate federal law?

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Here is a kick for all who have there vehicles parked and registered in NJ.... Ready.........

When the vehicle has tickets that are not paid they are considered SCOFFLAW violators. Once the vehicle gets (3) FTA ( Failure to Appear in court notices) they can be booted and brought to court so payment on back due tickets can be made......... Im sure everyone here has seen alot of out of state plates on vehicles parked all over downtown. Since they are out of state the FTA rule doesnt apply because the other states dont have the same rules It never hits the DMV of other states...They can park here get tickets every day and dont have to worry about it!!. I was told that the Dir of the JCPA has been on top of this and she is fixing the ordinance then bringing it before the council for approval. FREE PARKING FOR THEM NOT US! I have been told this has been going on forever. Thank you JCPA for the attention to detail and stopping this.


Um, not really news. And until recently, the JCPA was booting first time offenders, with in-state and out-of-state plates. And maybe I'm the only one, but I really don't see an unusually high amount of vehicles with out-of-state plates parked downtown. Sounds to me like JCPA is trying to do something about a non-issue.

And just what changes would the JCPA request in the ordinance? Report them to out-of-state DMV's? They can report these scofflaws, but since the JCPA has no jurisdiction outside of JC, why would out-of-state DMV's even care? There is no financial benefit to out-of-state DMV's. Why would they suspend a driver's license or vehicle registration for out of state violations? Again, it's the JCPA trying to do something about a non-issue.

Interestingly, I have noted that what out-of-state vehicles I have seen, they have had valid JCPA parking permits. Don't you need to have a vehicle registered in NJ before the JCPA will even consider giving a non-temporary permit?

Posted on: 2011/4/2 0:17
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JKLM...

You beat me to it! What you stated is correct. If the JCPA & PD issue summons to the title 39 violations like hydrants, intersection , crosswalks violations like that, the State gets the money not the city. The City gets the money for meters , zone permits , lots, booting. So those wont make the city money.
Here is a kick for all who have there vehicles parked and registered in NJ.... Ready.........

When the vehicle has tickets that are not paid they are considered SCOFFLAW violators. Once the vehicle gets (3) FTA ( Failure to Appear in court notices) they can be booted and brought to court so payment on back due tickets can be made......... Im sure everyone here has seen alot of out of state plates on vehicles parked all over downtown. Since they are out of state the FTA rule doesnt apply because the other states dont have the same rules It never hits the DMV of other states...They can park here get tickets every day and dont have to worry about it!!. I was told that the Dir of the JCPA has been on top of this and she is fixing the ordinance then bringing it before the council for approval. FREE PARKING FOR THEM NOT US! I have been told this has been going on forever. Thank you JCPA for the attention to detail and stopping this.

GETZ011..... Working on finding the codes....

Posted on: 2011/4/1 13:54
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I've noticed both yesterday and today JCPA giving tickets to cars parked on Sussex between Greene and Hudson. I've also notice the city never bothered to put up signs (permit parking, street cleaning, etc..) on that block.

Just a heads up for those parked there!

Posted on: 2011/4/1 11:05
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This is what I've heard:

Jersey City has to give up some portion of the revenue from state and federal violations (too close to hydrant and also too close to stop sign or curb). Sometimes that ticket isn't worth as much as you think FOR Jersey City, especially if people challenge ticket in court.

Violations in which a sign is actually installed by Jersey City most likely will go to city, not the state. So zone permit violations (especially reserved parking), street cleaning, meter and maybe a sign that has an arrow pointing "No Parking" away from curb or stop sign. These will generate more money.

Posted on: 2011/4/1 9:28
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Vigilante wrote:
I know the Parking Director of a small to medium sized resort city. His department has an operating budget of about $350,000 yearly and they generate $20,000,000 in revenue by ticketing and towing. Every time you see an illegally parked car or a person running a Stop-sign or speeding you're seeing city revenue slip through our fingers.
Such a shame.


Don't worry, I'm close to filling half that quota this year with my car alone...sigh...

Posted on: 2011/4/1 8:13
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JC_Downtownregular....
I understand what you are saying... OK time for more research....I will get back to you soon. I refuse to assume what they are or where to look. Please be patient.


Vigilante....
A budget of $350,000 generating 20,000,000.00 !!! With such a budget , I have to ask , how many employees?Benefits? Do they walk ? No Vehicles? If they have vehicles ,gas for said vehicles? No equiptment? Maintainance ?Insurance? Rent or mortgage for space they occupy? In 2011 all of the above cost so much that I would have to say the big boss should write a book!
By no means am I saying you are exagerating ,but either the fines in that town are more then the vehicles themselves that are being ticketed or the employees make $5,000.00 per year.

Getz011.....
Im sorry if I didnt understand right off the bat. I have been researching parking because I was a regular getting those great "Love Letters" from the Municipal court. Hell I should have had my own space by the courts! Most tickets are understandable . I will find the answer to where the codes are. I will be back with it soon.
I now follow the title 39 laws and try to use that common sense that I stated in my previous post. Im getting less love letters now.
I own a mid sized car. I refuse to ,even if I have to walk a few blocks, to block a hydrant or a handicapped space. I ll take my chances at the corners. If I park at the corner I try to stay ten feet from the outer white line of the crosswalk. It seems to be acceptable to the JCPA & PD. But like I said I have a mid sized car so its easier to see the signs, intersection as you approach looking over/ past my car. If its a big van , I could understand having to be further away from the crosswalk.

Posted on: 2011/4/1 3:13
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Re: Parking Too Close to Crosswalks
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jcresident0001 wrote:
The PD and JCPA can use discretion in issuing tickets for those violations.


Law and parking enforcement agents should use discretion when issuing tickets for violations. However, JCPD and JCPA don't use discretion, but rather favoritism. I posted in another thread that a few weeks ago I watched JCPD write tickets for 7 of 8 vehicles parked too close to the corner on Jersey Ave and First Street at 6:30 in the morning. Vehicle number 8 had a police shield in the windshield -one of those big shield with the three suction cups affixing it to the windshield. Worst of all, this car was actually parked in the crosswalk. The end result was no ticket issued.

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jcresident0001 wrote:
GETZ011.....I believe you and I are on the same page. But I think you want discretion defined as to what is acceptable distance for parking off corners.


You don't seem to understand. Getz011 isn't asking for a definition of discretion. He'd like the municipal code code regarding Jersey City be posted in an easily accessible place for the public. This way the public is informed as to what is legal and illegal and the enforcement agencies aren't applying the law unequally.

Posted on: 2011/3/31 19:20
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Re: Parking Too Close to Crosswalks
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I know the Parking Director of a small to medium sized resort city. His department has an operating budget of about $350,000 yearly and they generate $20,000,000 in revenue by ticketing and towing. Every time you see an illegally parked car or a person running a Stop-sign or speeding you're seeing city revenue slip through our fingers.
Such a shame.

Posted on: 2011/3/31 16:36
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GETZ011.....I believe you and I are on the same page. But I think you want discretion defined as to what is acceptable distance for parking off corners. If you have a big custom van ,no you cant park right up to the white line . If you have a small car you can. Its up to the drivers use of common sense to determine if you are too close and the other drivers can or can not see as they approach that particular intersection.

I have done alot of research into the JCPA and I was shocked as to the answers I have gotten. They operate with a small amount of enforcement officers. The revenue that was generated last year was amazing, 15 million. This paid all overhead. The JCPA has no debt except for the building they bought and occupy. Plus they get rent from the Post office . They have turned over to the city roughly 8 million dollars. To me thats a very successful entity. Dont you agree?

Posted on: 2011/3/31 14:10
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Re: Parking Too Close to Crosswalks
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The city has signs that says no parking close to corner and I don’t think its 25 feet, but at least that’s a good indication for people as to where to park..

Posted on: 2011/3/31 13:51
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To Getz011.....

The PD and JCPA can use discretion in issuing tickets for those violations. Its not illegal to give some people a break. The amount of parking on any street would be cut by 8 spaces minimum. As long as the vehicles are not obstructing traffic , line of sight to the intersection or in the middle of the crosswork why pound the residents with tickets ?? For that thinking to use the money from the tickets issued to the residents to balance the budget , just raise taxes . Some families are just making ends meet . Thats not right. Why beat them into the ground?

[...]

Im just against hitting the hard working people in this city over the head measuring the street corners and if your 22 feet from the corner you get a ticket. I hope you can see/understand my rant


resident, I think you misread my posts or misunderstood their point. I'm not advocating that JC's hardworking citizens - myself included - be ticketed for parking an inch too close to a stop sign, nor have I suggested that the city remove eight parking spaces from each city block.

I'm advocating that JC municipal government and JCPA do a better job of making it possible for all citizens to know what the laws are so that they don't get hammered for doing something they had no way of knowing was illegal. Can you tell me what the ordinance is in Jersey City? 50 feet from a stop sign? 25? 15?

I think we all agree that limiting parking 50 feet from a stop sign is insanity in Jersey City. Personally, I think that limiting it to 25 feet is also insanity. Parking is scarce, even in my neighborhood of Lafayette, let alone downtown. So we agree there.

All I'm saying is, I'd like to know what the law is so that I can choose to observe it, rather than counting on JCPA's discretion when I'm parked illegally. Discretion is a slippery slope - who deserves it? People in certain neighborhoods? Government officials? Cars that look like they belong to hardworking owners?

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As long as the vehicles are not obstructing traffic , line of sight to the intersection or in the middle of the crosswork


Actually, they are. All over JC. That's the product of JCPA's discretion. And its impact on hardworking citizens of JC like ourselves is that it creates a safety hazard, reduces the quality of life, and contributes to a loss of civic confidence in the capability, impartiality and commitment of local government. If we ticketed those violators, it would not only address these issues, but raise money to boot.

Posted on: 2011/3/31 13:26
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To Getz011.....

The PD and JCPA can use discretion in issuing tickets for those violations. Its not illegal to give some people a break. The amount of parking at any intersection would be cut by 8 spaces minimum. As long as the vehicles are not obstructing traffic , line of sight to the intersection or in the middle of the crosswalk why pound the residents with tickets ?? For that thinking to use the money from the tickets issued to the residents to balance the budget , just raise taxes . Some families are just making ends meet . Thats not right. Why beat them into the ground?

I have driven around this town for many years , one thing I have noticed are the amount of school buildings and churches that were once homes. For example, I dont know if you know the St Peters College area ( Glennwood ave/ Fairmont ave/ Montgomery st ) . Many of the buildings that are now "for school use" were once Ratable properties. That is the problem . The buildings are now student housing that tuition pays for and we get nothing.

I ll bet you that the percent of properties paying taxes are below 60% of the total properties in JC. The amount of the 60% that are up to date with the tax payments , probably 75% of that . With my numbers that means 45% of the properties are paying taxes.

I ll get off my soap box now. Im just against hitting the hard working people in this city over the head measuring the street corners and if your 22 feet from the corner you get a ticket. I hope you can see/understand my rant

Posted on: 2011/3/31 12:56
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PBW wrote:

Since the Jersey City CAN change the state law, and you can't find it - wouldn't one have to assume that they didn't supercede the state law? Must every municipality put down on paper what state laws they aren't changing? Legitimate question, not being snarky either.


Not snarky at all - you're quite correct.

I've posted the NJ state code below for reference - Title 39 covers everything related to vehicles. It does allow municipal authorities to revise minimum parking distances by ordinance, with the 25-/50-foot exception for school zones during class hours (see bottom).

All I can find of any use online is at the JCPA's web site (http://www.jcparking.org/about.htm); and all that says is "The responsibilities of the JCPA include... enforcement of Title 39 violations and Jersey City municipal ordinances."

So this raises two issues:

1. If there's no local exception to NJ's 50-foot rule, JCPA is not fulfilling its mandate to enforce Title 39 by not ticketing. As many have stated before, this would substantially improve city revenues, safety, quality of life, and confidence in local government. (I would imagine that part of its mandate is also to ensure that curbs in no parking zones are adequately identified with red paint. No time to research that, but in Lafayette at least, those suckers don't seem to have been painted since the Carter administration.)

2. More importantly, it directly states that there are municipal ordinances. Great - I want to obey them. What are they? Where are they? Why don't citizens have greater access to them?

Anyway, that's enough from me. Thanks for an interesting dialogue!

----------------------------------------------------

New Jersey Statutes - Title 39 Motor Vehicles and Traffic Regulation - 39:4-138
Places where parking prohibited; exceptions; moving vehicle not under one's control into prohibited area.

h. Within 50 feet of a "stop" sign except as provided in section 2 of P.L.2009, c.257 (C.39:4-138.6) ----->

C.39:4-138.6 Municipal authority to set certain permissible parking distances.
2. A municipality may mandate by ordinance the permissible distance a person may park a motor vehicle from a crosswalk, side line of a street or intersecting highway, or "stop" sign. A municipality may not, however, permit parking within 25 feet of a crosswalk or side line of a street or intersecting highway or within 50 feet of a "stop" sign in a school zone during hours when school is in session.

Posted on: 2011/3/31 11:12
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getz011 wrote:

I'm going to avoid the urge to be snarky, because I'm sure that everyone here except for me parks 50 feet or more from stop signs - just to be safe, because that's the law in NJ, even though no one knows what it is in JC. Good night, all.


Since the Jersey City CAN change the state law, and you can't find it - wouldn't one have to assume that they didn't supercede the state law? Must every municipality put down on paper what state laws they aren't changing? Legitimate question, not being snarky either.

Posted on: 2011/3/31 9:46
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Many of the corners are marked with red paint. The normal marked area from any corner is about one to one and a half car lengths. Most corners have signs that indicate that you should not park "beyond" them. I have noticed that the corner of Pavonia and Monmouth is particularly bad for parking violators. It is extremely dangerous there for pedestrians trying to cross. Erie and First is another horrible corner and there is NO DOUBT that illegally parked cars have contributed to accidents there.

Posted on: 2011/3/31 0:09
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getz011 wrote:

In other words, it's a guessing game: is JC going to selectively enforce its vague parking law today when I park in front of my house? Heads they win, tails I lose!


I don't see what's vague about it. 50 feet from a stop sign seems pretty exact. If you park in front of your house and it;s 50 feet from a stop sign or 25 feet from a crosswalk, you are, in effect, parking illegally and risking a fine. Just because they haven't ticketed for it before doesn't make it ok.


That's not my point. My point is: What's the law in JC? 50 feet from a stop sign? 25 feet? I've spent a reasonable amount of time searching online and have found no conclusive answer.

Don't tell me to call the parking authority; in the depths of January's blizzard, I would call to ask about alternate side parking and get an automated notice that it was in effect. Nearly every time I talk to someone at the parking authority to clarify a regulation, I get a contradictory answer. In any case, that response wouldn't hold up in court.

I have a law degree. In my past career, I spent 10 years working in postwar Bosnia, Serbia, and Iraq. For much of that time, my job - funded by the US State Dept. - was to advise and train local government as it put in place mechanisms to increase: citizens' access to local regulations; the transparency of government decision making; and consistent and politically neutral enforcement of local laws. (The unfortunate term for this practice was "democratization.")

Jersey City has a deficiency of democratization. We don't know what a basic code is, yet we're debating it. I've spent a lot of time trying to conclusively determine it without taking a half day off to visit the local library. As I mentioned in my original post, 50 feet is NJ state law - but it allows for local variances in recognition of urban density. (My observation, based on the occasional positioning of traffic signs, suggests that JC code permits parking up to 25 feet from a stop sign). Whatever it is, the code is routinely disregarded and rarely enforced. Give me access to the code, and I'll happily observe it; as a bonus, enforce it consistently to encourage us all to observe it. And, as mentioned earlier, there's the minor matter of the ticket citing us for parking within 50 feet of the sign - which is likely incorrect in JC - and directing us to appear in court at a time that the court is closed. That's the kind of thing my Bosnian counterparts were convinced could never, ever, happen in the US.

I'm going to avoid the urge to be snarky, because I'm sure that everyone here except for me parks 50 feet or more from stop signs - just to be safe, because that's the law in NJ, even though no one knows what it is in JC. Good night, all.

Posted on: 2011/3/30 23:21
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Re: Parking Too Close to Crosswalks
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To PBW.....

I have a feeling ( correct me if im wrong) 1st st and Jersey???

I agree that there are problems there and as one of the answers that I have gotten from the JCPA regarding enforcing specific intersections is as follows.....
The daytime enforcement people go directly to certain routes ( sweeper , permit, meters) and some are there to address complaints. It appears that there is a manpower shortage and I was told it is being addressed. The night time enforcement is very short, I was told there are 5 enforcement officers for the entire city. That also is being addressed. I would suggest that if you have specific areas that are dangerous , like I do call the JCPA at 201-653-6969.

Posted on: 2011/3/30 21:02
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jcresident0001 wrote:

I agree that some of the parking laws are a little out there but they are the laws. You are right MFADAM, the money made off those tickets would balance the bugdet but thankfully the JCPA and the PD understand the parking issues and use common sense. Believe it or not common sense is applied in regards to issuing tickets like this.



While I agree with the sentiment that enforcing these laws to the T would not necessarily make sense in an urban area, I have to disagree about JCPA and common sense (never thought i'd use those two together in a sentence). There have been too many accidents on Jersey Ave alone this past year, and I'm still dangerously in the middle of the street at many intersections trying to tell if it's safe to go.

Posted on: 2011/3/30 17:16
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