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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Home away from home
 
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The city has already contributed more money to the board of ed. We were paying $72 million, then in 2005, those caps were lifted, the costs increased. We are now paying $112 million. I am concerned about Fulop saying we need more affordable housing, in translation he is saying more children but no tax dollars from those new buildings.
Posted on: 2016/2/1 0:16
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Time to start a class action lawsuit against flop to force the reveal. Everyone who is overpaying should be suing.
Posted on: 2016/1/31 23:56
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Not at all. I'm just saying that real estate values are only one factor that goes into deciding how school funding gets apportioned from Trenton. While obviously real estate has appreciated since the last reval, wide areas of JC still have very poor residents-and income is also a factor in calculating school funding. And Trenton can't arbitrarily reduce state aid, it's a formula that must be adhered to.
Posted on: 2016/1/31 23:47
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Quote:
Jersey City will NOT lose $420 million in Abbot money because of a reval. Jersey City will lose $420 million if the state decides to strip JCPS of its Abbot district destination. That seems to be pretty clear from the comments below, so why ask the question? Reval is already a done deal. There is no way it's not going to happen. There has been nothing said publicly that the state will remove JCPS from Abbot status, but I think the suburbs have a point... Why are they subsidizing our schools when we're building half million dollar condos? Reval happens first and it just seems the opportunity is perfect to remove Abbot district after. This is strictly my opinion and there has been nothing in the media that has hinted that will happenen, but like the reval, it's bound to happen sooner or later. Do you agree, Monroe, or are you saying Jersey City Public Schools will keep Abbot status for all eternity?
Posted on: 2016/1/31 23:30
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Can someone show me where JC will lose 420 million in Abbott money because of the reval?
Posted on: 2016/1/31 23:11
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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True that. Had he let it proceed his hands would have been clean, "it was Healey's fault". I wonder who he owed a campaign debt that made him fall on this grenade for them. That bit of video is not going away, ever.
Posted on: 2016/1/31 22:35
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Home away from home
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Quote:
JC losing its Abbot status and along with it a shift from $420 million of state aid to JC property taxes. I blame the state for allowing such a horrible system to exist. Revals should be mandatory every 5 years or so. Counties elsewhere in the country do it ever year. Why must it be so complicated in NJ and will lead to eventual destruction of the housing market here. Bamb00zle is correct! The city portion of the tax bill will decrease by thousands of dollars for thousands of residents when the reval occurs but the school portion of the tax bill will increase by an equal amount or more. No one will see any savings and the reval would be used as the scapegoat. Bankrupt NJ gets to shed an annual $420 million liability. Ward E is @#%&ed! Either way, downtown taxes are going to the moon. Maybe Yvonne was correct, just a tad early in the sale. Not sure how Fulop is to blame for any of this with the exception of he should not have cancelled the reval in the first place. It's gonna come back to royally bite him in the a$$ big just in time for his run for governorship. Stupid rookie mistake.
Posted on: 2016/1/31 22:15
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Home away from home
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Quote:
A line in that report about Paterson says it all: ?...homeowners said the impact of the new assessments were not evident until late in the summer when a higher tax rate was set for the city.? stateaidguy's other posts on JCList speak more to the big picture. My 2-cents worth ? the state wants to shift school aid costs ($420 million yearly) back onto Jersey City taxpayers. But first the valuations better line up with reality, since there's no getting blood from a stone. Yes, JC needs a reval but don't hold your breath waiting for taxes to go down ?thousands? at the end of all this game-playing. That's not what's in store for us.... is it DanL?
Posted on: 2016/1/31 20:43
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Home away from home
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this is the comment -
State Aid Guy January 30, 2016 at 4:19 pm The NJ Treasury officials who are ordering the reval justified it primarily in terms of the huge gap between Jersey City?s assessed value and its Equalized Valuation, but they did make a reference to Jersey City?s Coefficient of Deviation, which is the better measure of tax unfairness. If a town never does a reval but all properties increase in value at a uniform rate, then the tax assessment is still fair, since everyone?s property differs from the assessed value by the same ratio. For instance, Westfield hasn?t done a reval in decades, but Westfield doesn?t have a location that stands out as a ?hot neighborhood,? and Westfield?s Coefficient of Deviation is 15%. There might be people in Westfield in badly over assessed or under assessed properties, but not many. By contrast, Jersey City?s Coefficient of Deviation is 39%, the highest in NJ. http://www.state.nj.us/treasury/taxation/lpt/devtab.shtml Steve Fulop claimed that some JC property owners might get a few hundred off their tax bills but this is crap. There are people for whom this will mean paying thousands less. When Paterson did a reval its Coefficient of Deviation was in the low 20s and it still led to hundreds of property owners paying thousands less. http://www.northjersey.com/news/city- ... rty-revaluation-1.1437630 Quote:
Posted on: 2016/1/31 16:04
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Newbie
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Here's a pretty clear, but short explanation about the reval
https://civicparent.org/2016/01/proper ... ation-ratio/#comment-7605
Posted on: 2016/1/31 15:39
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Home away from home
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like I said draw one's own conclusions and many have - this is why there needs to be a reval -
Jersey City has been growing at a breakneck speed for the past fifteen years. As a city grows, it is required to stop along the way and revalue its real estate. This process is termed ?revaluation.? Revaluation is about ensuring that tax assessed values ? the number you see on your tax bill ? are equal to current market values. As Jersey City has grown, it has failed to revalue itself. As a result, current market values have been allowed to grow grossly out of synch with outdated tax assessed values. But in November 2015, Jersey City?s 15-year joyride was put on notice: NJ treasury officials turned on their proverbial police car sirens and ordered Jersey City to pull over. The charge: Jersey City was deemed to be ?dramatically out of compliance with Constitutional and statutory provisions requiring fair and uniform property tax assessments.? It is imperative that the public have an educated dialog about this issue and understand what a revaluation is (and isn?t), the merits for revaluation, and context as to why elected officials have failed to revalue Jersey City over the years. Read more - https://civicparent.org/2016/01/proper ... 1-the-equalization-ratio/
Posted on: 2016/1/30 19:57
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Fulop's numbers are crap. For every 1% your effective tax rate is over the official rate, per $100k of value, you are paying $1000. A $200k house in Greenville paying 3.4% is paying $2000 more than they should, not Fulop's "couple of hundred".
As for his advice that these homeowners should appeal, that only solves half the problem. It reduces that homeowners tax to 2.4%, but does nothing about the properties like his own that are paying 1%. The unfairness just chugs on, but in the case of massive appeals the city would find itself short on it's budget, and have to raise the base rate, unlike the reval where the total tax haul remains the same. Fixed income retiree homeowners should not be an issue, there's numerous creative ways to protect them without allowing corporate investors to get their fair taxes paid by others. The current situation is a regressive tax, plain and simple.
Posted on: 2016/1/30 18:41
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Just can't stay away
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2015/10/21 0:40 Last Login : 2019/5/15 18:48 From One of the Oranges
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Agustin Torres is trying so hard to be even-handed in his Fulop essay that he misses some important contextual facts (or doesn't know them)
"Jersey City's situation is not unique. It's not like it isn't the only municipality that waited and waited. Remember Newark when it reached some 40 years without a reval? Now with the state ? which has allowed these situations to fester and is as much to blame ? involved, a reval is certain." Most of the other towns in NJ that haven't done revals (and all the long-delayers are in Middlesex, Union, and Hudson Counties) have had more uniform growth and therefore very few property owners are being taxed unfairly. This consistency of growth shows up in having low Coefficients of Deviation, which is the statistical measure of assessment variability. Edison, which has also gone decades without a reval and whose assessment is a small fraction of its Equalized Valuation, has a Coefficient of Deviation of 12%. This means for Edison that the lack of a Reval doesn't really matter since properties sell for basically the same ratio from their official assessments. Jersey City's Coefficient of Deviation is 39% - the state's highest. This means that properties are selling at very different ratios from their official assessments.
Posted on: 2016/1/30 17:12
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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I'm sorry Mr. Mayor, but having a basic grasp of percentages and fairness does not qualify as hatred...
Posted on: 2016/1/30 16:58
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Pols should never pour whine in public | Political Insider By Oops, let's get off the sidetrack. The week ended with meetings and debates over property reval. Some were big snow jobs or political platforms. Big in the headlines was the mayor's statement toward the end of a long soliloquy that was an answer to a resident's reval question at a town hall meeting. Fulop said much of the loud noise criticizing him for stalling property revaluation was from those who hate him and his administration. At least he didn't Christie the response by calling anyone stupid.Responding to the statement, the mayor's biggest critic of late, former city Corporation Counsel Bill Matsikoudis, simply categorized Fulop as "delusional."Fulop is probably right. Problem is that, even though the complaints have taken on a political nature, the criticism is not exactly wrong either. Even more important, never pour a tall glass of whine in public. The mayor feels that he's doing more residents a favor by stopping the reval, having suggested that a remedy is to appeal real estate taxes, rather than save a couple of hundred dollars but lose thousands in property value.Politically speaking, he should have just let it happen after the previous administration backed out on its reval effort in an election year. It would have been smarter to let the natural order of things prevail and just blame the previous administration. Unfortunately the city is embroiled in a legal battle over the hiring of a reval company that local officials believe was allegedly tainted by the firm's hiring of a former city administrator.Read more http://www.nj.com/opinion/index.ssf/2 ... n_public_political_i.html
Posted on: 2016/1/30 16:42
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Quote:
Thank you.
Posted on: 2016/1/30 1:41
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Home away from home
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Reval Hearing 28 minutes
https://youtu.be/JvjjgUueXCA
Posted on: 2016/1/30 0:55
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Quote:
Stringer wrote:
Posted on: 2016/1/29 22:32
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Home away from home
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Fulop: People arguing for Jersey City reval hate meBy JERSEY CITY — As New Jersey officials decide whether to force Jersey City perform a citywide tax revaluation, Mayor Steve Fulop alleges that those arguing in favor of the reval are doing so because they hate him. Fulop, appearing at a town hall meeting Tuesday night at Grace Church Van Vorst, said his critics who say the city should go ahead with the reval are being "disingenuous" when they say stalling the process is helping some Downtown property owners at the expense of those in other city neighborhoods. "They are doing it purely for hatred of me," he said. Read more: http://www.nj.com/hudson/index.ssf/20 ... ng_for_reval_hate_me.html
Posted on: 2016/1/29 21:37
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Most Jersey City residents at public hearing call for tax reval, some critical of FulopAt a public hearing hosted by the NJ Division of Taxation, 14 speakers argued that a Jersey City tax reval can help even the city’s tax burden, but can also cause people to lose their homes. Read mrore: http://hudsoncountyview.com/most-jers ... l-some-critical-of-fulop/
Posted on: 2016/1/29 21:32
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Quote:
You hit the nail on the head with the line "Anyone with a basic understanding of percentages can see that the game is totally rigged"... A few months ago, some loudmouth came in here to try and explain to me (and others) why percentages don't matter and that we should be looking at total tax paid, and that his 10K on a million dollar brownstone ought to be enough. People's ability to play dumb and willingness to bury their heads in the sand is incredible. Property taxes as a percentage of property value is a standard across the nation. That's the way it is done everywhere, and yet people want to spin it in their favor imposing that total dollars paid out should be the standard. This is a matter of fairness, period. Fulop was being very, very disingenuous in that video.
Posted on: 2016/1/28 17:59
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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someone should run for Mayor with property tax fairness as their single issue. Lotta votes outside of downtown.
Kind of a serious version of the "the rent is too damn high" guy from NYC... I am floored that the council members outside of downtown aren't screaming about this. Anyone with a basic understanding of percentages can see that the game is totally rigged for DTJC owners...
Posted on: 2016/1/28 17:22
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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As I said in the other thread on his BS session, the "couple of hundred" is not true. The Effective Tax Rate is 2.216.
Lots of other ward properties are paying upwards of 3% while Downtowners are paying 1%. A property valued at $500k whose rate drops even 0.5% will see a savings of $2,500, far from "couple of hundred". And the game of reval hot potato will continue for another decade, or two? How long can Mayors keep this up? Till the hedge funds have cashed out? And where are the Councilmembers who supposedly represent the other 4/5 of JC?
Posted on: 2016/1/28 16:37
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Fulop is probably breaking the law with his shady tactics. I'm betting he gets arrested by the FBI before he becomes governor.
The tax man is coming for you, Fulop!
Posted on: 2016/1/28 16:26
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Home away from home
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If you own a home in DTJC or the Waterfront, and you think your paying a fair property tax rate I have a bridge to sell you. As a former DTJC home owner I knew we were lucky and we paying absurdly low property taxes. I was for the ReVal when I Was in DTJC, and now that I live in in McGinley Square I'm support it even more. Why should one part of JC subsidize another?
When does the angry mob with pitch forks and torches gather outside Fulop's new house? I'll bring the torches.
Posted on: 2016/1/28 16:21
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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I thought it was particularly galling that he stated that those who are in favor of a reval do so out of hatred for him. That's just non sense.
A reval is necessary because you have a LOT of poor and middle class families in neighborhoods outside of downtown subsidizing million dollar homes in DTJC. It is a matter of fairness. And, he is preying on people's fears by claiming that a reval will lower property values for all homeowners, and that homeowners in neighborhoods outside will only see decreases of $200 or $300 per year. Looking at current tax rolls, many people in BL or The Heights will see drops of at least 1 or 2 thousand dollars, and much more for a few families. That's real money for a lot of people.
Posted on: 2016/1/28 15:52
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Home away from home
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There was a listing on the zillow sometime back that had a house on sale for over a million and when I checked the city tax site they are paying a little over 10K. Apparently the building owner rakes in well over 50K in rent. How does that make sense?
Posted on: 2016/1/28 15:42
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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of late the marginal rowhouse buyer downtown is Dixon Leasing. Not some hard working family looking to raise their kids in JC.
Dixon donates to those in power and a big chunk of their PnL comes from keeping property taxes where they are, LOW in downtown. What's all the more ironic is many downtown residents are extremely disappointed in the Mayor and unlikely to vote for him should he ever run again anyway. His argument is specious at best
Posted on: 2016/1/28 15:30
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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Basically, the mayor is saying he is protecting one community over another community.
Posted on: 2016/1/28 14:51
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Re: Jersey City mayor-elect orders end to citywide reval
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All I ever hear from progressives is that 'everyone should pay their fair share'. Since a reval won't result in added tax revenue, a proper reval will result in exactly that. Who is Mayor Fulop protecting by being anti-reval? Wasn't he elected to represent ALL Jersey City residents?
Posted on: 2016/1/28 13:00
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