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Re: Jersey City developer seeking 30-year tax abatement in Journal Square
#9
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Quote:

Yvonne wrote:
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LimpiarElSucio wrote:
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Yvonne wrote:
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LimpiarElSucio wrote:
then go become a developer. since you can do things cheaper than they can you can competitively cut them out and rake it in.

Quote:

Yvonne wrote:
Quote:

hero69 wrote:
well, i guess if it falls within the jsq redevelopment area nd that area qualifies for 30 year abatements, i can't really object BUT perhaps the city should start scaling back abatements in jsq to 10 year


When the economy was soft, Kennedy Lofts, asked for a 15 year abatement, Healy gave them 12 years. Kennedy Lofts is the old Welfare building in Journal Square. The economy is great today and now we are granting them 30 years, 18 more years than under Healy. I don't buy this. Journal Square is prime property.


Developers take the risks and receive the rewards. This should not involve taxpayers subsidizing them. When they sell their property, usually 2 or 3 years later, the public does not receive the benefit because the abatement is transferred. Besides, who is bailing out the 2,300 people in lien for 2013? The answer is no one.


Developers build properties for their own benefit, not the benefit of a community. When development is isolated to one part of a city, only one part of the city benefits from development. The other part(s) get little to nothing and you have the tale of two cities continue to widen. Since government cannot force developers where to build it is limited to enticing them... Pilots reduce some varieties of risk so that the opportunity cost of developing in riskier markets is reduced, and the "love can be spread."


Markets are constantly changing, week to week, month to month, year to year, and certainly decade to decade. You cannot possibly believe that just because 1 developer (out of thousands) decided to build something 20 years ago that it means all, or even any, developers would be able to justify development in the same area today. Its just not rational to hold that belief.


There is nothing in the city charter saying regular taxpayers should subsidize development. In fact, when the law was originally passed, it targeted property no one wanted. These abatements went to downtown where developers were paying $5 and $10 million for the plot in the 1990s. Journal Square is prime property, the fact Kennedy Lofts got a 12 abatement when the market was soft shows 30 years are not necessary.




1) the success of kennedy lofts is yet to be seen, 2) buying land/property during a soft market (From the government) that will be ready during an upswing (2014) reduces risk (buy low), and 3) no 2 developments are the same. you don't even live in a world that is just black or white with no shades of gray, you view things through monochrome lenses and speak from a standpoint as if you know what you are talking about when you lack experience and education on the topics.

i know, i know... "abatements are bad, subsidization, taxes, yada yada yada"

why do we even try?

Posted on: 2015/5/28 19:57
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Re: Jersey City developer seeking 30-year tax abatement in Journal Square
#8
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Quote:

Yvonne wrote:
Quote:

LimpiarElSucio wrote:
Quote:

Yvonne wrote:
Quote:

LimpiarElSucio wrote:
then go become a developer. since you can do things cheaper than they can you can competitively cut them out and rake it in.

Quote:

Yvonne wrote:
Quote:

hero69 wrote:
well, i guess if it falls within the jsq redevelopment area nd that area qualifies for 30 year abatements, i can't really object BUT perhaps the city should start scaling back abatements in jsq to 10 year


When the economy was soft, Kennedy Lofts, asked for a 15 year abatement, Healy gave them 12 years. Kennedy Lofts is the old Welfare building in Journal Square. The economy is great today and now we are granting them 30 years, 18 more years than under Healy. I don't buy this. Journal Square is prime property.


Developers take the risks and receive the rewards. This should not involve taxpayers subsidizing them. When they sell their property, usually 2 or 3 years later, the public does not receive the benefit because the abatement is transferred. Besides, who is bailing out the 2,300 people in lien for 2013? The answer is no one.


Developers build properties for their own benefit, not the benefit of a community. When development is isolated to one part of a city, only one part of the city benefits from development. The other part(s) get little to nothing and you have the tale of two cities continue to widen. Since government cannot force developers where to build it is limited to enticing them... Pilots reduce some varieties of risk so that the opportunity cost of developing in riskier markets is reduced, and the "love can be spread."


Markets are constantly changing, week to week, month to month, year to year, and certainly decade to decade. You cannot possibly believe that just because 1 developer (out of thousands) decided to build something 20 years ago that it means all, or even any, developers would be able to justify development in the same area today. Its just not rational to hold that belief.


There is nothing in the city charter saying regular taxpayers should subsidize development. In fact, when the law was originally passed, it targeted property no one wanted. These abatements went to downtown where developers were paying $5 and $10 million for the plot in the 1990s. Journal Square is prime property, the fact Kennedy Lofts got a 12 abatement when the market was soft shows 30 years are not necessary.
i agree that 30 year tax abatement for jsq development is overkill. it's time for fulop to review and revise the guidelines.

Posted on: 2015/5/28 17:23
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Re: Jersey City developer seeking 30-year tax abatement in Journal Square
#7
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Quote:

LimpiarElSucio wrote:
Quote:

Yvonne wrote:
Quote:

LimpiarElSucio wrote:
then go become a developer. since you can do things cheaper than they can you can competitively cut them out and rake it in.

Quote:

Yvonne wrote:
Quote:

hero69 wrote:
well, i guess if it falls within the jsq redevelopment area nd that area qualifies for 30 year abatements, i can't really object BUT perhaps the city should start scaling back abatements in jsq to 10 year


When the economy was soft, Kennedy Lofts, asked for a 15 year abatement, Healy gave them 12 years. Kennedy Lofts is the old Welfare building in Journal Square. The economy is great today and now we are granting them 30 years, 18 more years than under Healy. I don't buy this. Journal Square is prime property.


Developers take the risks and receive the rewards. This should not involve taxpayers subsidizing them. When they sell their property, usually 2 or 3 years later, the public does not receive the benefit because the abatement is transferred. Besides, who is bailing out the 2,300 people in lien for 2013? The answer is no one.


Developers build properties for their own benefit, not the benefit of a community. When development is isolated to one part of a city, only one part of the city benefits from development. The other part(s) get little to nothing and you have the tale of two cities continue to widen. Since government cannot force developers where to build it is limited to enticing them... Pilots reduce some varieties of risk so that the opportunity cost of developing in riskier markets is reduced, and the "love can be spread."


Markets are constantly changing, week to week, month to month, year to year, and certainly decade to decade. You cannot possibly believe that just because 1 developer (out of thousands) decided to build something 20 years ago that it means all, or even any, developers would be able to justify development in the same area today. Its just not rational to hold that belief.


There is nothing in the city charter saying regular taxpayers should subsidize development. In fact, when the law was originally passed, it targeted property no one wanted. These abatements went to downtown where developers were paying $5 and $10 million for the plot in the 1990s. Journal Square is prime property, the fact Kennedy Lofts got a 12 abatement when the market was soft shows 30 years are not necessary.

Posted on: 2015/5/28 17:03
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Re: Jersey City developer seeking 30-year tax abatement in Journal Square
#6
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Quote:

Yvonne wrote:
Quote:

LimpiarElSucio wrote:
then go become a developer. since you can do things cheaper than they can you can competitively cut them out and rake it in.

Quote:

Yvonne wrote:
Quote:

hero69 wrote:
well, i guess if it falls within the jsq redevelopment area nd that area qualifies for 30 year abatements, i can't really object BUT perhaps the city should start scaling back abatements in jsq to 10 year


When the economy was soft, Kennedy Lofts, asked for a 15 year abatement, Healy gave them 12 years. Kennedy Lofts is the old Welfare building in Journal Square. The economy is great today and now we are granting them 30 years, 18 more years than under Healy. I don't buy this. Journal Square is prime property.


Developers take the risks and receive the rewards. This should not involve taxpayers subsidizing them. When they sell their property, usually 2 or 3 years later, the public does not receive the benefit because the abatement is transferred. Besides, who is bailing out the 2,300 people in lien for 2013? The answer is no one.


Developers build properties for their own benefit, not the benefit of a community. When development is isolated to one part of a city, only one part of the city benefits from development. The other part(s) get little to nothing and you have the tale of two cities continue to widen. Since government cannot force developers where to build it is limited to enticing them... Pilots reduce some varieties of risk so that the opportunity cost of developing in riskier markets is reduced, and the "love can be spread."


Markets are constantly changing, week to week, month to month, year to year, and certainly decade to decade. You cannot possibly believe that just because 1 developer (out of thousands) decided to build something 20 years ago that it means all, or even any, developers would be able to justify development in the same area today. Its just not rational to hold that belief.

Posted on: 2015/5/28 16:57
 Top 


Re: Jersey City developer seeking 30-year tax abatement in Journal Square
#5
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Quote:

LimpiarElSucio wrote:
then go become a developer. since you can do things cheaper than they can you can competitively cut them out and rake it in.

Quote:

Yvonne wrote:
Quote:

hero69 wrote:
well, i guess if it falls within the jsq redevelopment area nd that area qualifies for 30 year abatements, i can't really object BUT perhaps the city should start scaling back abatements in jsq to 10 year


When the economy was soft, Kennedy Lofts, asked for a 15 year abatement, Healy gave them 12 years. Kennedy Lofts is the old Welfare building in Journal Square. The economy is great today and now we are granting them 30 years, 18 more years than under Healy. I don't buy this. Journal Square is prime property.


Developers take the risks and receive the rewards. This should not involve taxpayers subsidizing them. When they sell their property, usually 2 or 3 years later, the public does not receive the benefit because the abatement is transferred. Besides, who is bailing out the 2,300 people in lien for 2013? The answer is no one.

Posted on: 2015/5/27 18:09
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Re: Jersey City developer seeking 30-year tax abatement in Journal Square
#4
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then go become a developer. since you can do things cheaper than they can you can competitively cut them out and rake it in.

Quote:

Yvonne wrote:
Quote:

hero69 wrote:
well, i guess if it falls within the jsq redevelopment area nd that area qualifies for 30 year abatements, i can't really object BUT perhaps the city should start scaling back abatements in jsq to 10 year


When the economy was soft, Kennedy Lofts, asked for a 15 year abatement, Healy gave them 12 years. Kennedy Lofts is the old Welfare building in Journal Square. The economy is great today and now we are granting them 30 years, 18 more years than under Healy. I don't buy this. Journal Square is prime property.

Posted on: 2015/5/27 17:56
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Re: Jersey City developer seeking 30-year tax abatement in Journal Square
#3
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Quote:

hero69 wrote:
well, i guess if it falls within the jsq redevelopment area nd that area qualifies for 30 year abatements, i can't really object BUT perhaps the city should start scaling back abatements in jsq to 10 year


When the economy was soft, Kennedy Lofts, asked for a 15 year abatement, Healy gave them 12 years. Kennedy Lofts is the old Welfare building in Journal Square. The economy is great today and now we are granting them 30 years, 18 more years than under Healy. I don't buy this. Journal Square is prime property.

Posted on: 2015/5/27 16:46
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Re: Jersey City developer seeking 30-year tax abatement in Journal Square
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well, i guess if it falls within the jsq redevelopment area nd that area qualifies for 30 year abatements, i can't really object BUT perhaps the city should start scaling back abatements in jsq to 10 year

Posted on: 2015/5/27 16:13
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Jersey City developer seeking 30-year tax abatement in Journal Square
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Jersey City developer seeking 30-year tax abatement in Journal Square area

Hudson County View
May 27, 2015 - Jersey City, News - Written by John Heinis

A Jersey City developer is seeking a 30-year tax abatement on a Newkirk Street property, which falls in the city?s Journal Square Redevelopment Zone, and is willing to pay the city a minimum of $22,913 for additional costs associated with the project.





Read more: http://hudsoncountyview.com/jersey-ci ... t-in-journal-square-area/

Posted on: 2015/5/27 15:40
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