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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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As a former resident of the Bergen part of B-L and a current resident of the Lafayette part, I can confirm that many people in both neighborhoods agree with the general division outlined by my neighbors here. There's a swath of industrial buildings, etc. that currently provides a clear divide between the residences and businesses in both areas. Of course, this may change as Berry Lane Park is developed.

So, keeping in mind that I'm talking about Lafayette as defined by my neighbors here, I'll go ahead and respond to nemobeatz's original post: "I'm curious about what other folks in the neighborhood think about it's progress."

Having lived here for over five years, I do see progress. There are continually new buildings being constructed in vacant lots; more of the vacant lots are being kept up; and more neighbors are getting involved in the community. In fact, I just saw that Lafayette (as defined here) is the first neighborhood in JC to get to 200 members on the online Next Door community. This sense of community is reflected in the many friendships I have with my Lafayette neighbors, both long-time residents and new ones.

That said, I agree with Rebecca S that it would be great to have more amenities. I'm pleased with Nu Bar as it is being run by Dorian and Jessica, and we've got some great bodegas and little Puerto Rican and Dominican restaurants. It's also great to have the Pacific Flea once a month! But it would be nice to have some other places and activities. I think it will come in time, but in the meantime, I'm happier living here than I have been in a lot of other neighborhoods in which I've lived, which includes downtown JC, the East Village, and several other cities in the US and overseas. The genuine sense of community here is hard to find.

Posted on: 2014/8/13 18:26
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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Quote:

vindication15 wrote:
I used the wrong terminology - I meant to say areas/districts/sections. A sub-category would be neighborhoods:

JC Neighborhoods

You still can't just make-up neighborhoods though...


Lafayette has historically been known at times as Communipaw, or Communipaw-Lafayette and is in fact one of the oldest settlements in North America (as previously stated). If you need further proof, here's an entire book on our neighborhood written by John Gomez; former resident and founding member of the JC Landmarks Conservancy. It's a good read.

http://www.jclandmarks.org/tour-lafayette.shtml

Posted on: 2014/8/12 18:32
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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Neighborhoods are made up. Either by development, zip codes, police districts, geography, resident characteristics, census blocks, real estate nomenclature, or people's perceptions.

It is recognized in social science that there are no clear definitions of any given neighborhood and any neighborhood boundary chosen for analysis will be flawed one way or another because of the aforementioned issues. That is, no neighborhood boundary delineation is perfect. People will use what they perceive to be correct.

Posted on: 2014/8/12 17:48
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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I used the wrong terminology - I meant to say areas/districts/sections. A sub-category would be neighborhoods:

JC Neighborhoods

You still can't just make-up neighborhoods though...

Posted on: 2014/8/12 17:40
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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If you'll notice i mentioned that the reason i can't really comment on the rest of the area is because there is a police district designation between the area of Lafayette i live in and the rest of it. I go to and look at crime and stats on the East District part of Bergen-Lafayette. The rest is West District and it's a separate meeting, stats, reporting phone number etc.
I'm not trying to annex our neighborhood nor did I create the police district lines. But i would point out that when you talk about downtown i bet no one is thinking about the area between hoboken and 10th street which i am sure has a much different crime rate then between 10th and the grove path.
It seems like sometimes there is a double-standard for downtown and the rest of JC for some on this site.

Posted on: 2014/8/12 16:37
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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Quote:

hudson57 wrote:
Bergen-Lafayette is mostly viewed as 07304 zip code:
http://www.zillow.com/homes/07304_rb/

some of the worst areas (Bergen Ave. @ Lexington) are part of it...


The OP specified that he's talking about the "L" of B-L; this is more or less the section bordered by the HBLR tracks on the south, Garfield/Grand at west and north, I-78/LSP at east.

Bergen Ave. @ Lexington is an altogether different section of wider B-L. To disagree is to say that Italian Village and Newport are the same thing because they're both within 07302.

Posted on: 2014/8/12 16:09
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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Bergen-Lafayette is mostly viewed as 07304 zip code:
http://www.zillow.com/homes/07304_rb/

some of the worst areas (Bergen Ave. @ Lexington) are part of it...

Posted on: 2014/8/12 15:43
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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Ground breaking soon on a new 5 story building on Suydam with 83 market rate rentals will help anchor the east side of the hood-I would think it might attract a restaurant to the shuttered Kolonia site a block away or at least a coffee shop/diner type place nearby-the storefront next to Monegro's bodega is ripe for a tenant as well a block away. NuBar should benefit (God willing if it stays open . . .).

What would really push the area along is if the Whitlock Cordage development ever gets completed. I'm surprised we haven't seen a Fulop push to get this done, as it really would help the surrounding areas clean up along with it-and it would bring a ton of residents who'd use Berry Lane Park and keep it visible and safe when it opens.


Posted on: 2014/8/12 15:34
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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nemobeatz wrote:
Quote:

vindication15 wrote:

You do know that you are technically one neighborhood right? It's not Bergen and Lafayette, it's Bergen-Lafayette.

To say that your one area has less crime than downtown is not a fair comparison. In fact, if you are indeed saying that then my condo building in downtown has way less crime than your personally designated area of you neighborhood. Give me a break.


I'll just copy and paste the first two sentences from the B-L Wiki:

"Bergen-Lafayette is a section of Jersey City, New Jersey.[1]
As its name implies, Bergen-Lafayette is made of different neighborhoods."


That seems a pretty fuzzy definition, serving realtors most likely. I'm not a native, but 17 years here and I've always thought B-L was sharply defined by Grand, Garfield and the Tpk. Is that what you're now calling just "Lafayette"? Claiming the Beacon for B-L seems big stretch, that's pretty clearly McGinley Sq.

Posted on: 2014/8/12 15:32
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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vindication15 wrote:
You do know that you are technically one neighborhood right? It's not Bergen and Lafayette, it's Bergen-Lafayette.

To say that your one area has less crime than downtown is not a fair comparison. In fact, if you are indeed saying that then my condo building in downtown has way less crime than your personally designated area of you neighborhood. Give me a break.


But this is exactly the point I made below. To Manhattanites, JC's crime stats paint an unattractive picture.

They could make the same argument you're making here: "To say that your one area of JC has less crime than others is not a fair comparison. It's all one city."

In pretty much any context, you have to do nuance to some degree if you want to have a productive and interesting dialogue.

Posted on: 2014/8/12 15:19
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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Quote:

vindication15 wrote:

You do know that you are technically one neighborhood right? It's not Bergen and Lafayette, it's Bergen-Lafayette.

To say that your one area has less crime than downtown is not a fair comparison. In fact, if you are indeed saying that then my condo building in downtown has way less crime than your personally designated area of you neighborhood. Give me a break.


I'll just copy and paste the first two sentences from the B-L Wiki:

"Bergen-Lafayette is a section of Jersey City, New Jersey.[1]
As its name implies, Bergen-Lafayette is made of different neighborhoods."

It's the same as talking about the VV neighborhood or The Village neighborhood, not sure why that's difficult for you to comprehend. In reference to the crime stats, NewLafayette very clearly noted that there was a major density difference between our neighborhood and all of downtown.

With the tone of some of these responses, you'd think that we're attacking other neighborhoods. That's not the case at all, we're just shining a light on our 'hood.

Posted on: 2014/8/12 15:04
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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newlafayette wrote:
If you come to the east district captain's meetings and look at the crime stats, lafayette (talking from about woodward to the light rail, from the railroad crossing at pacific to where downtown starts) actually has less crime than downtown.
We are much less densely populated however.
I can't speak to what happens past woodward because that is a different police district and we don't get those stats. But i think when people refer to lafayette they are generally talking about before you go up the hill to garfield.
There are a few spots that always get complaints... Van Horne south of communipaw, dr. lena edwards park, the places that are getting torn down near where berry lane park is going... And recent police activity, community involvement and housing activity is starting to make a dent there. The Morris Canal CDC has had people stopping by their office the last few months asking what they can invest in, and projects that have been on hold for years are finally starting to go up. I think the next two years could see a real turning point.


You do know that you are technically one neighborhood right? It's not Bergen and Lafayette, it's Bergen-Lafayette.

To say that your one area has less crime than downtown is not a fair comparison. In fact, if you are indeed saying that then my condo building in downtown has way less crime than your personally designated area of you neighborhood. Give me a break.

Posted on: 2014/8/12 14:17
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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If you come to the east district captain's meetings and look at the crime stats, lafayette (talking from about woodward to the light rail, from the railroad crossing at pacific to where downtown starts) actually has less crime than downtown.
We are much less densely populated however.
I can't speak to what happens past woodward because that is a different police district and we don't get those stats. But i think when people refer to lafayette they are generally talking about before you go up the hill to garfield.
There are a few spots that always get complaints... Van Horne south of communipaw, dr. lena edwards park, the places that are getting torn down near where berry lane park is going... And recent police activity, community involvement and housing activity is starting to make a dent there. The Morris Canal CDC has had people stopping by their office the last few months asking what they can invest in, and projects that have been on hold for years are finally starting to go up. I think the next two years could see a real turning point.

Posted on: 2014/8/12 14:10
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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if you have a choice, make sure you like where live / move to now. work to make it safer, more open space etc, but please do not try to gentrify it, change it, that happens with the good and bad over time. and you cannot stop it either.

if you are investing, then speculate away .... but do not move in the hope of change, you will likely be disappointed. buy for the long term if you want to live there. most things do not happen overnight.

30 years ago downtown had much of what the changers in B-L want - Kiki's on 2nd, Pronto Cena, Presto's, Moochie's, Oregon Cafe, and others that have come and gone. If you like the neighborhood for what it is, you will be happier, likely, if you are older and not looking for a party (though it has hosted some great JCAST kick offs), have/want a car, like low density, a neighborhood feel.

Posted on: 2014/8/12 3:32
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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hero69 wrote:
just look at trulia crime and school statistics for BL and that says enuff for me!


This is exactly what people in Manhattan say about Jersey City. Does that make it true?

I'm sure you made the residential choice that was right for you. A lot of us are really happy out here.

Posted on: 2014/8/12 3:08
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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just look at trulia crime and school statistics for BL and that says enuff for me!

Posted on: 2014/8/12 2:25
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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RebeccaS wrote:
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brewster wrote:
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RebeccaS wrote:
There have been some changes but there must be much greater population density before our neighborhood becomes more of an attraction.


Cue Yvonne to tell us how density is bad and it will make street parking in your area impossible.

Good luck there, hope things keep improving.


As per usual, she'd be right and wrong at the same time.


Every area of Jersey City has its hidden gem & every area has its dirty secret. Too bad Yvonne no longer sees the former & only focuses on the latter.


Posted on: 2014/8/12 0:29
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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brewster wrote:
Quote:

RebeccaS wrote:
There have been some changes but there must be much greater population density before our neighborhood becomes more of an attraction.


Cue Yvonne to tell us how density is bad and it will make street parking in your area impossible.

Good luck there, hope things keep improving.


As per usual, she'd be right and wrong at the same time.

Posted on: 2014/8/11 21:40
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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vindication15 wrote:
Sorry, I thought in talking about the future of BL, it was fair to compare neighborhoods...




It's totally ok! Every neighborhood is nice in its own way . . .

Posted on: 2014/8/11 21:39
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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RebeccaS wrote:
There have been some changes but there must be much greater population density before our neighborhood becomes more of an attraction.


Cue Yvonne to tell us how density is bad and it will make street parking in your area impossible.

Good luck there, hope things keep improving.

Posted on: 2014/8/11 21:14
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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Sorry, I thought in talking about the future of BL, it was fair to compare neighborhoods...



Posted on: 2014/8/11 21:13
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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vindication15 wrote:
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brewster wrote:
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vindication15 wrote:
Are we counting JSQ as downtown?

Cause everyone knows after downtown, the next successful neighborhood will be JSQ - just because of it's connection and proximity to NYC.


Repeating this again & again will not make it true. As always, ymmv, but I know far more Downtown and Hoboken refugees who have moved to the Heights than to JS. I even know more who have moved to the Lincoln Park area.

Transit is important, but it's not everything, or the light rail would have made B-L pop 14 years ago. But the Palisade & Congress area is seeing the kind of shift to perceived desirability B-L is looking for. You have to look at ALL the factors like parks and "feel".


Umm okay? lol

Price Bought/Resale Value, Crime, and Transportation are commonly cited as the 3 most important things for a person buying a home. If you are looking for the "best park" in the area as your main criteria, then I hope you a trust fund baby because you and your money will have a very short relationship.

In any case, just look at the stats:

BL: http://www.zillow.com/jersey-city-nj-07304/home-values/

JSQ: http://www.zillow.com/jersey-city-nj-07306/home-values/

In resale, JSQ > BL
In Transit, JSQ > BL

I can post some crime stats here but I think we are all in agreement that JSQ is a safer neighborhood than BL.



I guess this is my day to be on JCList, but Nemobeatz really wasn't interested in talking about Journal Square; it's perfectly justifiable and germane to want to talk about one neighborhood without the discussion being also about another. If you'd like to talk about Journal Square, I'm sure that there will be many other opportunities to discuss its features.

Posted on: 2014/8/11 21:10
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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I have friends who live in BL a few on Pine street and a few on Maple street. I think this part of BL is very desirable, I think down by the hub is not so desirable even though there is a station there. I think BL is a huge area but the only section of it that is in high demand is surrounding the Foundry area, but its a low area and has not much housing around there.

Posted on: 2014/8/11 21:09
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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brewster wrote:
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nemobeatz wrote:
Def understand where you're coming from, but I just wanna reiterate that I'm talking about the Lafayette section of B-L in particular. I feel like it's in a unique position since it's right next to downtown, soon to be flanked by 2 major parks, and has a relatively low crime rate.


I know exactly where you're talking about, and why people have been bullish on it. It just hasn't come through yet, and broken many investors and gentrifiers. It's just my POV, but personally I know lots of people thrilled with living in the Heights for a decade or more, and a number of people who limped away from B-L. But timing is everything, and you never know.


We've been by the intersection of Pacific and Communipaw for just over four years and love it. We like being close to the parks and light rail, but truly are disappointed by the lack of amenities. There have been some changes but there must be much greater population density before our neighborhood becomes more of an attraction. We'll see when Berry Lane Park finally opens (it was a huge chemical disaster, be patient) and there has been in the Morris Canal Redevelopment Plan a proposal for another light rail stop by Pacific and Bramhall. We'll see.

Interestingly, I know of at least two couples who currently rent in the neighborhood who would like to buy and have not been able to do so--there's very little stock and sometimes what's there has been bought to turn into more rentals.

On the other hand, I was at a presentation regarding new construction on Suydam done by the firm that won a historic preservation award for the Montauk on Montgomery--that was a good sign and while they are all rentals, this might be the beginning.

It's hard to say what will happen, but I know that right now B-L is in a good place as far as good-neigborliness and friendliness.

Posted on: 2014/8/11 21:04
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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brewster wrote:
Quote:

vindication15 wrote:
Are we counting JSQ as downtown?

Cause everyone knows after downtown, the next successful neighborhood will be JSQ - just because of it's connection and proximity to NYC.


Repeating this again & again will not make it true. As always, ymmv, but I know far more Downtown and Hoboken refugees who have moved to the Heights than to JS. I even know more who have moved to the Lincoln Park area.

Transit is important, but it's not everything, or the light rail would have made B-L pop 14 years ago. But the Palisade & Congress area is seeing the kind of shift to perceived desirability B-L is looking for. You have to look at ALL the factors like parks and "feel".


Umm okay? lol

Price Bought/Resale Value, Crime, and Transportation are commonly cited as the 3 most important things for a person buying a home. If you are looking for the "best park" in the area as your main criteria, then I hope you a trust fund baby because you and your money will have a very short relationship.

In any case, just look at the stats:

BL: http://www.zillow.com/jersey-city-nj-07304/home-values/

JSQ: http://www.zillow.com/jersey-city-nj-07306/home-values/

In resale, JSQ > BL
In Transit, JSQ > BL

I can post some crime stats here but I think we are all in agreement that JSQ is a safer neighborhood than BL.


Posted on: 2014/8/11 21:00
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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Yvonne wrote:
Residents in Bergen Lafayette have complained about the sewerage. It backs up after raining, that must be fixed before there is any renaissance.


Maybe *some* residents have complained but I've never heard of sewers in my neighborhood backing up. However, when I lived on 3rd and Erie, that was constant.


Posted on: 2014/8/11 20:52
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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vindication15 wrote:
Are we counting JSQ as downtown?

Cause everyone knows after downtown, the next successful neighborhood will be JSQ - just because of it's connection and proximity to NYC.


Repeating this again & again will not make it true. As always, ymmv, but I know far more Downtown and Hoboken refugees who have moved to the Heights than to JS. I even know more who have moved to the Lincoln Park area.

Transit is important, but it's not everything, or the light rail would have made B-L pop 14 years ago. But the Palisade & Congress area is seeing the kind of shift to perceived desirability B-L is looking for. You have to look at ALL the factors like parks and "feel".

Posted on: 2014/8/11 20:46
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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vindication15 wrote:
Are we counting JSQ as downtown?

Cause everyone knows after downtown, the next successful neighborhood will be JSQ - just because of it's connection and proximity to NYC.

And since JSQ is at least 5 years from being developed and attracting businesses that will up the rents to where downtown rents are currently positioned, any other neighborhood is at least +5 years away...





I see JSQ in a similar way I see Long Island City - a neighborhood that will have buildings go up because of an easy commute and relatively low rent where no one hangs out or actually enjoys. You'll rest your head there at night but hang out and spend your money in NYC. It just doesn't have a neighborhood feel to it.

Posted on: 2014/8/11 20:45
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
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user1111 wrote:
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Yvonne wrote:
Residents in Bergen Lafayette have complained about the sewerage. It backs up after raining, that must be fixed before there is any renaissance.


I agree, I looked at a place on Monitor and the flood insurance was insane, so I moved further up the hill. That is the one thing that is a negative for BL they have the same flooding issues as dtjc.


I guess it's the mapping, because Monitor didn't have any Sandy flooding, even the low lying parking lot area at the Foundry had no flooding/sewer issues.

Posted on: 2014/8/11 20:28
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Re: What does the future hold for Lafayette?
#8
Home away from home
Home away from home


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Are we counting JSQ as downtown?

Cause everyone knows after downtown, the next successful neighborhood will be JSQ - just because of it's connection and proximity to NYC.

And since JSQ is at least 5 years from being developed and attracting businesses that will up the rents to where downtown rents are currently positioned, any other neighborhood is at least +5 years away...




Posted on: 2014/8/11 20:25
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