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Re: Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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borisp wrote:


"A Streetcar Named Progress":

One of my favorite former colleagues, Emily Bobrow of the Economist, explains why streetcars are a bad idea. The short version: They don?t move faster than buses, at least not in the U.S., where they?re rarely given dedicated lanes. And because they require a big fixed investment, they?re very expensive, and inflexible, compared to buses.

So why are cities suddenly going streetcar-mad?


Well good thing this doesnt apply to the light rail, because it does have a dedicated track, so it is faster than the bus

Posted on: 2014/8/11 0:15
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Re: Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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I already knew that my NJ Transit Rail monthly pass also covered two bus zones (found that out after Sandy when PATH wasn't running), but after reading this thread, checked out NJ Transit's website & it also can be used on the Light Rail ? who knew!!

Thanks for the head's up!

Posted on: 2014/8/10 20:57
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Re: Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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"A Streetcar Named Progress":

One of my favorite former colleagues, Emily Bobrow of the Economist, explains why streetcars are a bad idea. The short version: They don?t move faster than buses, at least not in the U.S., where they?re rarely given dedicated lanes. And because they require a big fixed investment, they?re very expensive, and inflexible, compared to buses.

So why are cities suddenly going streetcar-mad?

Posted on: 2014/8/10 20:08
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Re: Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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Thank you bodhipooh & HeightsBrat! This will definitely come in handy!

Quote:

NewtoJCGirl wrote:
Hey Heightsbrat - is that for any 2 zonebus pass or do you have to purchase a specific type? My husband buys the monthly but we don't see where it states it covers the light rail also, that can really come in handy!

Quote:

HeightsBrat wrote:
Since I don't drive & have to commute, I have found it useful to purchase a monthly 2-Zone pass from NJT. It costs $72/mo & entitles me to ride NJT buses anywhere in Hudson County & the Light Rail. Not to bad a deal for me personally.

Posted on: 2014/7/14 15:19
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Re: Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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HeightsBrat wrote:
Quote:

NewtoJCGirl wrote:
Hey Heightsbrat - is that for any 2 zonebus pass or do you have to purchase a specific type? My husband buys the monthly but we don't see where it states it covers the light rail also, that can really come in handy!

Quote:

HeightsBrat wrote:
Since I don't drive & have to commute, I have found it useful to purchase a monthly 2-Zone pass from NJT. It costs $72/mo & entitles me to ride NJT buses anywhere in Hudson County & the Light Rail. Not to bad a deal for me personally.


Hi NewtoJCGirl - I just purchase the standard 2 zone pass, there is no specific type. It doesn't state that it covers the Light Rail but I found out from the agent I purchase my pass from. I was buying the 1 zone pass, which only covers Jersey City & 1 stop in Hoboken & Secaucus. The 2 zone pass was $18 dollars more so I asked what that got me & that's when I found out it included all of Hudson County plus the Light Rail.


The NJT website is terrible for finding information, such as what you describe above, but there is a little snippet in this link (http://www.njtransit.com/var/var_serv ... ageAction=HBLR8thStreetTo) that states the same thing as what you wrote. Scroll all the way to the bottom and the last paragraph corroborates that a "2-zone or greater monthly bus pass" is valid for light rail travel.

Posted on: 2014/7/14 15:10
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Re: Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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NewtoJCGirl wrote:
Hey Heightsbrat - is that for any 2 zonebus pass or do you have to purchase a specific type? My husband buys the monthly but we don't see where it states it covers the light rail also, that can really come in handy!

Quote:

HeightsBrat wrote:
Since I don't drive & have to commute, I have found it useful to purchase a monthly 2-Zone pass from NJT. It costs $72/mo & entitles me to ride NJT buses anywhere in Hudson County & the Light Rail. Not to bad a deal for me personally.


Hi NewtoJCGirl - I just purchase the standard 2 zone pass, there is no specific type. It doesn't state that it covers the Light Rail but I found out from the agent I purchase my pass from. I was buying the 1 zone pass, which only covers Jersey City & 1 stop in Hoboken & Secaucus. The 2 zone pass was $18 dollars more so I asked what that got me & that's when I found out it included all of Hudson County plus the Light Rail.

Posted on: 2014/7/13 14:31
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Re: Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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Hey Heightsbrat - is that for any 2 zonebus pass or do you have to purchase a specific type? My husband buys the monthly but we don't see where it states it covers the light rail also, that can really come in handy!

Quote:

HeightsBrat wrote:
Since I don't drive & have to commute, I have found it useful to purchase a monthly 2-Zone pass from NJT. It costs $72/mo & entitles me to ride NJT buses anywhere in Hudson County & the Light Rail. Not to bad a deal for me personally.

Posted on: 2014/7/13 3:25
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Re: Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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Since I don't drive & have to commute, I have found it useful to purchase a monthly 2-Zone pass from NJT. It costs $72/mo & entitles me to ride NJT buses anywhere in Hudson County & the Light Rail. Not to bad a deal for me personally.

Posted on: 2014/7/13 1:28
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Re: Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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The HBLR definitely isn't the "worst system ever." However, I do think the fare system relies too much on the honor system.

I don't think the system can be completely revised, but I do think they could check the tickets more frequently. Hiring conductors to check tickets more frequently would pay for itself.

Posted on: 2014/7/12 22:09
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Re: Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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SRhia wrote:
And user1111 is correct about the rules (one trip, in continuous direction).
[/quote]

What about on weekends, when 2nd St. and 9th St. customers have to first go to Newport, and then double back to get to Hoboken. That is one trip, but not a continuous direction. Can NJ Transit Police bust your balls on that one?

Posted on: 2014/7/12 21:38
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Re: Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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Quote:

JadedJC wrote:
I was surprised by the reduced time when I recently had to run a couple of quick errands at Newport Mall. I used to be able to go there and back on one ticket. Cutting the time isn't going to cut down on fare beating, it just punishes those who ride the system legally. Now, my way of rebelling is to offer my ticket - if there's still time left on it - to someone on the platform when I get off. I've noticed others doing the same or leaving their valid tickets in one of the ticket vending machines.


Two comments/reactions to your post:

- Two wrongs don't make a right. Your passing on the ticket to someone is actually working AGAINST YOURSELF. As more people beat the system and "fare jump" the costs remain the same, or higher, but the revenue is flat or lower. Long term, that's an untenable situation.

- Tickets are valid for ONE continuous trip. It doesn't matter if the "ticket police" are aware if this, or not. That's the stated rule. It has been argued right here on JCList in the past, and yes, someone always points out that police/agents checking tickets do not enforce that, but that doesn't mean you should exploit their ignorance or dereliction of duty. As a good citizen, and as a user of the HBLR system, that *knows better* you should try and use the system as designed. See my first point above: the more people game the system, or refuse to pay for their trips, the more reason NJT has to increase fares.


I'm in no way justifying my actions. I'm merely pointing what I've been told by their own enforcement officers, and if that's what they tell me, then I see no reason to act to the contrary. If it catches up with me someday, I'm prepared to pay the fine and modify my behavior accordingly. It would be like me throwing away one of those Bed Bath & Beyond coupons because it's past the expiration date - even though every employee has told me they honor "expired" coupons. If they're serious about getting everyone to pay and to pay according to the rules, then they should step up enforcement and make it consistent and at all hours. I don't really ride the light rail that often, but what really pisses me off is they NEVER seem to enforce after school or on weekends when all those hordes of unruly teens are riding to/from the mall. Not a single one of them ever has a ticket. It's like they're afraid of those teens. They only seem to be checking tickets when they're least likely to catch fare beaters.

Posted on: 2014/7/12 19:40

Edited by JadedJC on 2014/7/12 20:00:40
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Re: Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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nyrgravey9 wrote:
I can't remember the last time I paid for the light rail in the last 5 years. I'm such a rebel eh?


They don't check tickets up top.

Posted on: 2014/7/12 18:40
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Re: Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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JadedJC wrote:
I was surprised by the reduced time when I recently had to run a couple of quick errands at Newport Mall. I used to be able to go there and back on one ticket. Cutting the time isn't going to cut down on fare beating, it just punishes those who ride the system legally. Now, my way of rebelling is to offer my ticket - if there's still time left on it - to someone on the platform when I get off. I've noticed others doing the same or leaving their valid tickets in one of the ticket vending machines.


Two comments/reactions to your post:

- Two wrongs don't make a right. Your passing on the ticket to someone is actually working AGAINST YOURSELF. As more people beat the system and "fare jump" the costs remain the same, or higher, but the revenue is flat or lower. Long term, that's an untenable situation.

- Tickets are valid for ONE continuous trip. It doesn't matter if the "ticket police" are aware if this, or not. That's the stated rule. It has been argued right here on JCList in the past, and yes, someone always points out that police/agents checking tickets do not enforce that, but that doesn't mean you should exploit their ignorance or dereliction of duty. As a good citizen, and as a user of the HBLR system, that *knows better* you should try and use the system as designed. See my first point above: the more people game the system, or refuse to pay for their trips, the more reason NJT has to increase fares.

Posted on: 2014/7/12 16:46
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Re: Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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JadedJC wrote:
Quote:

user1111 wrote:

As far as the time stamp, it clearly says on their website that each ticket is good for one ride (not a round-trip ticket) only in one continuous direction.



I once asked an officer checking tickets and he said "as long as you haven't surpassed the time on the ticket, you're OK." I got the impression they were aware people made multiple trips on one ticket but it was too much trouble to figure out if they were on the first trip or the second or third. In my experience they've checked my ticket on a number of return trips and have never questioned the direction I was headed (i.e. back toward the station where the validation stamp was made).


My block association are currently leaning on NT Transit to make the time stamp shorter. I think 60 minutes is being very generous. There is no destination on the rail from my station that takes more than 25 minutes to get to including Bayonne and Hoboken.

When the time stamp was 90 minutes long people would pass tickets from one another or constantly beg for a ticket at the station.

When you ride the MTA and swipe your MTA Card you have paid a fare and when you get off at your destination the ride is compete, you can not use that same swipe when you decided to come back. This rule is also applies to the LR.

Fare jumpers don't surprise me, they come in all shapes and sizes.

Posted on: 2014/7/12 16:18
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Re: Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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user1111 wrote:

As far as the time stamp, it clearly says on their website that each ticket is good for one ride (not a round-trip ticket) only in one continuous direction.



I once asked an officer checking tickets and he said "as long as you haven't surpassed the time on the ticket, you're OK." I got the impression they were aware people made multiple trips on one ticket but it was too much trouble to figure out if they were on the first trip or the second or third. In my experience they've checked my ticket on a number of return trips and have never questioned the direction I was headed (i.e. back toward the station where the validation stamp was made).

Posted on: 2014/7/12 15:47
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Re: Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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I can't remember the last time I paid for the light rail in the last 5 years. I'm such a rebel eh?

Posted on: 2014/7/12 15:17
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Re: Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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maybe the op should go the nj transit headquarters and complain...sort of reminds of dope addict going to police to report that his dope has been adulterated

Posted on: 2014/7/12 15:12
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Re: Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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I agree - I don't use the system very often, but whenever I do, I've always found it useful, and surprisingly clean too.

And user1111 is correct about the rules (one trip, in continuous direction).

Quote:

user1111 wrote:
It is clearly not the worst, and mos def not the best. As person who takes the light rail regularly down to PH. I can firmly say the LR is reliable, rarely ever late, it has only been shut down once, during Sandy.

As far as the time stamp, it clearly says on their website that each ticket is good for one ride (not a round-trip ticket) only in one continuous direction.


Posted on: 2014/7/12 15:06
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Re: Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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It is clearly not the worst, and mos def not the best. As person who takes the light rail regularly down to PH. I can firmly say the LR is reliable, rarely ever late, it has only been shut down once, during Sandy.

As far as the time stamp, it clearly says on their website that each ticket is good for one ride (not a round-trip ticket) only in one continuous direction.


Posted on: 2014/7/12 15:03
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Re: Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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maybe they should offer a day pass or something. it is a small system and yes, there are systems worse that hblr

Posted on: 2014/7/12 15:02
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Re: Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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I was surprised by the reduced time when I recently had to run a couple of quick errands at Newport Mall. I used to be able to go there and back on one ticket. Cutting the time isn't going to cut down on fare beating, it just punishes those who ride the system legally. Now, my way of rebelling is to offer my ticket - if there's still time left on it - to someone on the platform when I get off. I've noticed others doing the same or leaving their valid tickets in one of the ticket vending machines.

Posted on: 2014/7/12 14:38
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Hudson Light Rail- Worst system ever !
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The recent cut in time from 90 mins to 60 mins has provoked me to write about the fare system which is the worst kind of design for a transit system. I have traveled widely worldwide and have yet to see a more moronic system that was designed for a public transportation light rail system. During the early years when the system was being planned, public comments were invited. I did my share in written comments but it was simply ignored. The powers to be politicians already decided what they wanted to do in conjunction with Raytheon, the contractor with the multi million dollar project.
As has been described by the media, the fare system is so user unfriendly and so prone to fare beating it will always be an unprofitable system and a burden to the travelling public and tax payers as well. Now the negatives about the system design including the frequency of accidents are coming back to haunt us.

Posted on: 2014/7/12 14:31
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