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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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If you dedicate a room to prayer you are taking away a space that could be used for something actually worthwhile.

Posted on: 2014/5/6 14:22
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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WhoElseCouldIBe wrote:
I'm struggling to understand why a college should provide a prayer room for any religion or reason. If you want to pray, that's great but do it on your own time and space. Colleges are for education.


Quote:
caj11 wrote:
If ANY religious group at HCCC or any other public institution wants to provide for a prayer space, let them provide for it out of their own money by renting a room. Colleges are for education.


Colleges almost always provide facilities that serve a variety of their students’ extracurricular interests and personal needs that are not directly related to education. Dedicating a room for prayer is not much different than dedicating a room for exercise, and similarly, has no influence over the rights and freedoms of students who do not participate.

Posted on: 2014/5/6 14:11
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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Posted on: 2014/5/6 12:52
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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Do you thing that authorities in JC will allow Muslim students to have a "peaceful prayer place"? When Satanist can have a statue in front of Oklahoma Statehouse, why Muslims cannot have prayer room :)

http://www.vice.com/read/heres-the-fi ... -for-oklahomas-statehouse

Posted on: 2014/5/6 12:49
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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Posted on: 2014/5/5 17:42
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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First God hears all prayers, this is not about hatred towards any group but the responsibility of a particular group to provide prayer space for that group. Students are Hudson County Community College are legally adults. They are not children. I remember leaving school an half hour early and traveling with my brothers for my CCD classes at the local Catholic School. I was a very young person, not an adult.

Posted on: 2014/5/5 16:17
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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user1111 wrote:
...and when did the Irish become ethnics?


I'd say sometime between 1700BC and 1000AD when they developed their own national identity, culture, beliefs, language and arts. Most Irish would probably point to the life of St Patrick in the 5th century AD, as the defining point in time for Irish identity and ethnicity.

http://www.diffen.com/difference/Ethnicity_vs_Race

http://www.heraldry.ws/info/article12.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Patrick


Posted on: 2014/5/5 16:02
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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user1111 wrote:
No, by the way your hatred for Muslims is showing, and when did the Irish become ethnics?

When it is the Irish festival, when it is the St. Patrick's Day parade it is of religious connotation.

Posted on: 2014/5/5 15:54
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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user1111 wrote:
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caj11 wrote:
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user1111 wrote:
Quote:

caj11 wrote:
Quote:

user1111 wrote:
Anythings is possible, excuse me while I worship.


The Supreme Court may say it's okay to have an opening prayer (which I don't agree with but okay), but that doesn't cost any extra tax dollars.

If you want to worship fine, but I'm not paying for your space.


If city council is praying at city hall before each meeting how are you not paying for it?


I'm paying no matter what they do. But a prayer room of any kind is an additional cost, and no city or county should have to pay for something like that. This city already pays enough in added police protection and cleanup for all these stupid ethnic parades, can't you be satisfied with that?

No, by the way your hatred for Muslims is showing, and when did the Irish become ethnics?


Where did you ascertain any hatred of Muslims? His logic is consistent across all religions.


Exactly. I don't hate Muslims or people of any religion (well, maybe the Westboro Baptist Church but that's another story and they seem to hate everyone). I just don't see why there should be any taxpayer dollars spent on prayer rooms for anybody. I believe I mentioned in a previous thread that if you have to pray during school hours, find your own "mosque, church or synagogue to go to". Jeez. Colleges are for education, particularly public ones, end of story.

Oh and as for the parades issue, just ignore the word "ethnic". I am sick of the city/county subsidizing all the parades, but it's not something that's going away anytime soon, so I'll just learn to live with that one.

Posted on: 2014/5/5 15:46
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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Quote:

user1111 wrote:
Quote:

caj11 wrote:
Quote:

user1111 wrote:
Quote:

caj11 wrote:
Quote:

user1111 wrote:
Anythings is possible, excuse me while I worship.


The Supreme Court may say it's okay to have an opening prayer (which I don't agree with but okay), but that doesn't cost any extra tax dollars.

If you want to worship fine, but I'm not paying for your space.


If city council is praying at city hall before each meeting how are you not paying for it?


I'm paying no matter what they do. But a prayer room of any kind is an additional cost, and no city or county should have to pay for something like that. This city already pays enough in added police protection and cleanup for all these stupid ethnic parades, can't you be satisfied with that?

No, by the way your hatred for Muslims is showing, and when did the Irish become ethnics?


Where did you ascertain any hatred of Muslims? His logic is consistent across all religions.

Posted on: 2014/5/5 15:36
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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Quote:

caj11 wrote:
Quote:

user1111 wrote:
Quote:

caj11 wrote:
Quote:

user1111 wrote:
Anythings is possible, excuse me while I worship.


The Supreme Court may say it's okay to have an opening prayer (which I don't agree with but okay), but that doesn't cost any extra tax dollars.

If you want to worship fine, but I'm not paying for your space.


If city council is praying at city hall before each meeting how are you not paying for it?


I'm paying no matter what they do. But a prayer room of any kind is an additional cost, and no city or county should have to pay for something like that. This city already pays enough in added police protection and cleanup for all these stupid ethnic parades, can't you be satisfied with that?

No, by the way your hatred for Muslims is showing, and when did the Irish become ethnics?

Posted on: 2014/5/5 15:15
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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Quote:

user1111 wrote:
Quote:

caj11 wrote:
Quote:

user1111 wrote:
Anythings is possible, excuse me while I worship.


The Supreme Court may say it's okay to have an opening prayer (which I don't agree with but okay), but that doesn't cost any extra tax dollars.

If you want to worship fine, but I'm not paying for your space.


If city council is praying at city hall before each meeting how are you not paying for it?


I'm paying no matter what they do. But a prayer room of any kind is an additional cost, and no city or county should have to pay for something like that. This city already pays enough in added police protection and cleanup for all these stupid ethnic parades, can't you be satisfied with that?

Posted on: 2014/5/5 15:08
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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Quote:

caj11 wrote:
Quote:

user1111 wrote:
Anythings is possible, excuse me while I worship.


The Supreme Court may say it's okay to have an opening prayer (which I don't agree with but okay), but that doesn't cost any extra tax dollars.

If you want to worship fine, but I'm not paying for your space.


If city council is praying at city hall before each meeting how are you not paying for it?

Posted on: 2014/5/5 15:04
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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user1111 wrote:
Anythings is possible, excuse me while I worship.


The Supreme Court may say it's okay to have an opening prayer (which I don't agree with but okay), but that doesn't cost any extra tax dollars.

If you want to worship fine, but I'm not paying for your space.

Posted on: 2014/5/5 15:00
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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Religion is respected in this country because we don't favor one religion or support any religion. This prayer room will break that trend and perhaps bring backlash.

Posted on: 2014/5/5 14:58
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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Whatever happened to separation of church and state?


Posted on: 2014/5/5 14:53
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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Anythings is possible, excuse me while I worship.

Posted on: 2014/5/5 14:47
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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heights wrote:
Won't "sharing" the room make it less appealing for it's use. With other people/religious sects using it the room might not be worthy for the noted use.


Well then too bad. Take what you can get. This HCCC, a public institution with no religious affiliation. Tax dollars should not support something like this. They don't even have to make a broom closet available. They are under no obligation to make any kind of prayer room for anybody available.

Find a local mosque, church or synagogue to go to. What, you say that isn't convenient, not close enough to HCCC? Well, you should have thought of that when you enrolled.

Posted on: 2014/5/5 13:33
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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There are many properties off the tax rolls including Hudson County Community College. It is the reason, I believe JC should have an income tax as their main source of income and not a property tax. But returning to the subject, religion is not the responsibility of the public but the responsibility of the believers. I am sure the next request will be a place to wash feet which is a custom of the Muslim faith.

Posted on: 2014/5/5 13:23
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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Yvonne wrote:
How do you share a room when there are different practices? When the Synagogue was purchased for Islamic worship, the benches were removed. Christians and Jewish services use benches, but the Muslim faith do not. But that is not the point. Each religious group is responsible for their own faith practice. As an example, St. Peter’s Church in lower Manhattan has a chapel named the St. Joseph Chapel for worshippers near business. Likewise, Muslim groups should purchase property for their members as a site of worship near the college. http://stpetersrcny
c.org/index.cfm?load=page&page=7


Wouldn't purchasing a property for worship take that property off the tax rolls?

Posted on: 2014/5/5 13:03
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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How do you share a room when there are different practices? When the Synagogue was purchased for Islamic worship, the benches were removed. Christians and Jewish services use benches, but the Muslim faith do not. But that is not the point. Each religious group is responsible for their own faith practice. As an example, St. Peter’s Church in lower Manhattan has a chapel named the St. Joseph Chapel for worshippers near business. Likewise, Muslim groups should purchase property for their members as a site of worship near the college. http://stpetersrcnyc.org/index.cfm?load=page&page=7

Posted on: 2014/5/5 13:00
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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Won't "sharing" the room make it less appealing for it's use. With other people/religious sects using it the room might not be worthy for the noted use.

Posted on: 2014/5/5 12:14
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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Someone should tell Imtiaz Syed that hospitals and offices are usually private entities (so they can do what they want), and that the prayer space at Newark Airport is a non-sectarian, non-denomenational "meditation room" that can be used for any religious services.

It's fine for them to have a space at HCCC, as long as it can be used by any group for any sort of service. It just can't be exclusively for Muslims.

Posted on: 2014/5/5 12:00
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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Def was not suggesting that they pour additional dollars into making a Muslim prayer room, I just don't see the big deal in letting ANY students use a vacant room for 10 min or so. If there was a large enough population, then I agree it'd be best to let a local Islamic org/ mosque rent out a room for them.

Posted on: 2014/5/5 11:58
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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WhoElseCouldIBe wrote:
I'm struggling to understand why a college should provide a prayer room for any religion or reason. If you want to pray, that's great but do it on your own time and space. Colleges are for education.


Thank you! Also, HCCC is a public institution with no religious affiliation. If Muslims or any other faith need a place to pray during the day, they should attend a private institution that can accommodate them or do their praying at home.

Taxpayers should not have to be the slightest bit involved in providing for the practice of religion. Muslims have to pray five times a day, i get that. Jews and Catholics, if they are serious enough, attend hour-long services every day. Neither is something that taxpayers as a whole should have to cater to. Nor does it matter that airports and hospitals already cater to these religions (and I really had no idea that all of them did), the public educational institutions are under no obligation to do so.

If ANY religious group at HCCC or any other public institution wants to provide for a prayer space, let them provide for it out of their own money by renting a room. Colleges are for education.

What's next? Do we have to provide cleanup services for Satanist groups that want to do animal sacrifices at HCCC as well?

Posted on: 2014/5/4 20:10
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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I'm struggling to understand why a college should provide a prayer room for any religion or reason. If you want to pray, that's great but do it on your own time and space. Colleges are for education.

Posted on: 2014/5/4 19:04
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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CdeCoincy, everyone ate fish and everyone had the Jewish days off, we are referring to a special room for prayer. If religion means that much, do what many religious groups do, create your own school. Down the road the college will be defending a lawsuit from the an atheist group and taxpayer's money will be used to defend this.

Posted on: 2014/5/4 18:09
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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If a prayer room meant that more Muslum children went on to receive higher education at HCCC it sounds like a good investment. Throughout my elementary education NYC served fish fingers or some other non-meat lunch on Friday to accommodate Catholic students. I don't recall anyone making a fuss about special treatment that resulted in everyone being effected. Nor when school was closed for Jewish holidays in September was there ever a controversy.

Posted on: 2014/5/4 17:40
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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Yvonne wrote:
What does a particular religion has to do with prayer, it is where the prayer is held. Prayers are sacred and not something to take lightly. Jerseymom, God is not Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, or Muslim but people are. My conduct in church is reverent but my conduct in a library is not. I would not be comfortable doing research is someone is praying. I would feel I was disrespecting God while someone is praying and I am doing research.


Yvonne, that is not true to everyone. Location is not always important to the reverence of a prayer. As others have pointed out, for many, including Muslims, where you pray is not important, but that you pray is. For them, they just want a place where they can go to offer their prayer as they feel they are required to do.

Again, a common room for all faiths should not be a problem as long as all users are made aware that anyone can enter and use it, so long as they don't impinge on others using it. Muslims would be allowed to use it if their prayers remain short and quiet while others are in there and they don't stop anyone else from entering. Same could be true for anyone else going in.
As far as "decoration," they could keep it very simple, but the moment one symbol goes up, than every effort must be made to put up every symbol of equal size and weight.

Posted on: 2014/5/4 14:38
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Re: Muslim Prayer Room
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And what's wrong with just replacing the prayers with "a moment of silence.. or meditation"




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Monroe wrote:
Will they install foot baths as well?

http://theislamicworkplace.com/2007/0 ... aths-for-muslim-students/

Posted on: 2014/5/4 14:28
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