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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Home away from home
 
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The traffic situation on Erie is fairly unique, and shunting cars off Erie wouldn't cause the same problems on the other Northbound roads because none of them possess the same qualities of Erie Street. Jersey and Marin are both significantly wider, making it easier to see cars creeping out of the cross streets. Washington already has traffic lights on every block. And while Monmouth is as narrow as Erie, it doesn't connect directly to the tunnel, and northbound travelers can't head East from Monmouth on sixth Street as can be done from Erie. Erie is an attractive alternate route for a lot of travelers because of how it connects Newark Ave (and Columbus via Barrow) to the Holland Tunnel, and is especially dangerous because its a narrow street with many illegally parked cars. I was thinking of one alternative measure to stop signs however. A number of municipalities with heavy pedestrian traffic install rubber "Yield to Pedestrians in Crosswalk" signs at crosswalks. This serves to remind drivers they must stop for pedestrians, and also slows them down. The signs could be installed off center in the road, leaving enough room for drivers to squeeze passed the sign, but making cautious drivers weary of speeding through the intersections.
Posted on: 2008/4/4 0:23
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Just can't stay away
 
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At the next City Council meeting the council will un-table an ordinance that I sponsored to put stop signs all along Erie Street in order to slow the cut through traffic headed the Holland Tunnel. I've been reading the responses to this thread with great interest. Many posters have made very astute observations and proposals (other than a stop sign at every corner) for addressing the cause of accidents on Erie Street. I've got a few thoughts to share and a question to add to the conversation for what its worth. 1. Addressing traffic safety issues on streets like Erie Street is extremely important. Doing so in isolation without addressing the same or similar traffic safety problems, which exist also on adjacent and other nearby downtown North/South streets (especially Monmouth Street), comes across as myopic. Traffic safety downtown is a systemic downtown problem, and requires a more comprehensive approach -- not a band aid. If you focus a solution solely on Erie Street to the exclusion of the other adjacent and nearby streets, you will quite literally, move the problem around. A solution has to start somewhere, and starting on Erie Street is a good a place as any, but if the solution stops essentially where it started, then the real problem will remain unaddressed. 2. The Councilman started this thread with a statement about dueling opinions -- his (slowing via stop signs on every corner ) and traffic engineering's (no slowing required), but we haven't been provided with traffic engineering's "explanation" for the position they are taking. Who isn't for traffic safety? Exactly what was Traffic Engineering's "explanation" for taking a position, which sounds so "anti-safety" as characterized by the Councilman? It's certainly not in character with the Joao d'Souza (Director of Traffic Engineering) I know to summarily dismiss a proposed traffic safety ordinance without providing a clear, well-reasoned explanation or without offering professional alternatives. Knowing Traffic Engineering's side of the story would be a useful addition to this thread. All the best. Geoff 
Posted on: 2008/4/3 20:34
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Home away from home
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I agree with you entirely. For many reasons (cost, effectiveness, flexibility, fairness, tangential benefits to the neighborhood) more enforcement, including parking, is the best solution.
Posted on: 2008/4/2 17:39
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Home away from home
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Thanks, sullyx - that was my point exactly. The violations could be coming from any type of driver, of course. But the sheer volume increase of traffic is due to over development and motorists coming off the turnpike at Grand st. and cutting through downtown (mostly via Jersey to Erie St. - so the problems of these 2 streets are VERY connected) to rush to the Holland Tunnel.
More traffic with less/ to no enforcement of violations leads to more dangerous streets. Simple as that. Plus people LOVE to race up Jersey from the light at Montgomery/Jersey to the light at Jersey/Columbus. Lord help you if you want to safely cross the street on any of the corners between those 2 lights!
Posted on: 2008/4/2 17:26
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Home away from home
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that may be so but are you speeding on these side streets and blowing stop signs? that's kinda the whole point here genius
Posted on: 2008/4/2 16:42
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utterly deplorable
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Home away from home
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How about some congestion pricing. Start charging everyone $8.00 to enter jersey city. That'll cut back on the through-traffic.
Posted on: 2008/4/2 16:04
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Home away from home
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So many people using the argument about cars cutting through various downtown streets to get to the Holland Tunnel. These are public streets. Everyone has the right to use them no matter where they are going. I cut through all kinds of streets in the Heights to get from 1/9 back to downtown. I just don't see how you can single out people driving to the tunnel as poor drivers that are contributing to any potential traffic issues that may exist.
Posted on: 2008/4/2 16:01
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Home away from home
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I feel weird saying this, but you're RIGHT, vig.
There was this neighborhood near where I grew up where the cops funded their entire department on speeding tickets. If you went more than 4 miles over the 35mph limit, you'd get pulled over and ticketed. Literally every time you drove past the area you'd see someone pulled over, and it WORKED. Everybody knew that you had to obey the speed limit along that section of road (except for the tourists, at least). People would actually warn friends about it if they were going to come into the area. Of course, most everybody hated the cops for being such jerks, but the road was safe and the police department was nearly self-sufficient. Enforcement works. And so would other, smarter ways. Permanent obstructions like stop signs or speed bumps will only make the road more dangerous for motorists. Do you actually think everyone if going to stop at those signs? People are going to roll right through them, and some pedestrian is going to get killed because they THINK the car will actually obey the stop sign. Lights! Cameras! Action!
Posted on: 2008/4/2 15:02
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Home away from home
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I agree that we need police enforcement and stop signs on Erie (and on Marin near the crosswalks) .
It is really scary trying to walk/drive on Erie, not to mention trying to cross Marin to Newport Mall. An old thread that covers the same points.
Posted on: 2008/4/2 14:53
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Home away from home
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Not for nothing but in regards to that flashing sign they always put up, isn't that what speed limit signs are for? Enough of alerting speeders that they might get a ticket and how about actually writing some. I have lived downtown for 20 years and have seen about 6 to 8 actual traffic stops by the police in 20 YEARS! As for the residents who live along Erie St. be careful about demanding speed bumps. They will literally shake your homes. Also, lots of stop signs will vastly increase noise as cars slow down and speed up. (Stand near a stop sign for a few minutes and you will see what I mean) Plain and simply the Cops should enforce the traffic laws and stop the speeders! How is that for a novel idea! And as I and others have stated numerous times perhaps those traffic stops will uncover some folks with outstanding warrants, drugs or even guns!!! Killing two birds with one stone! It ain't rocket science Fulop, Comey, McDonough, and Healy!!!!
Posted on: 2008/4/2 14:42
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Not too shy to talk
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Question for Councilman Fulop: Could a City ordinance be introduced which would authorize the Police to tow vehicles that are parked on corners and deemed to be a sight obstruction to vehicle traffic?
Posted on: 2008/4/2 12:12
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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so, you agree with my comments ..... thank you for editing them down .....
the city has just initiated a city-wide traffic circulation study that will cover these type of issues. via your neighborhood association - get involved - the study provides for a Stakeholder group - make sure you are represented. info on the study - Civic JC e-Newsletter February 2008 calling the police is not enough.... my two cents... Quote:
Posted on: 2008/4/1 14:38
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Home away from home
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Looks like they are moving the electronic sign to second street. Its really working, drivers are now only doing 40 instead of 60.
Posted on: 2008/4/1 13:39
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Home away from home
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+1! So far, I?ve been hit (actually more like bumped) by cars twice in crosswalks on Jersey Ave in situations where motorists should clearly yield to pedestrians. In addition to speeders, I?d also urge police enforce a full four-wheel-stop at Stop signs and red lights by ticketing those who don?t. Finally, a call for police involvement that everyone can agree makes some sense!
Posted on: 2008/4/1 12:37
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"Dogs are our link to paradise." - Milan Kundera
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Home away from home
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Ever see World According to Garp? Remember when Garp chases down the truck that whips through his hood? I'm the non-violent equivalent in VVP, particularly the corner of York and Barrow, which is essentially a blind corner from both approaching directions. At least once a day I am asking a car to slow down or making "slow down" signs with my hands. Or worse, shouting out to a parent and kid or a person and dog to watch out. The cars literally fly through that intersection. Once two crashed and one went flying into my building. True story!
Anyway, now we have a Speed Limit tracker sign thingy on that corner. You know, the portable trailer one that tells you how fast you are going? It's been there about a week now. The best part is, it's not plugged in. Be careful out there.
Posted on: 2008/4/1 1:57
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Home away from home
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For years now, I have been complaining about pedestrian safety in the downtown area, and nothing has been done at all to improve it. I've called the police about it a few times too. It's solution is long overdue and needs to be taken seriously by the police and the city as our streets are getting more and more overwhelmed with cars, not only due to over-development, but due to motorists cutting through downtown to get to the Holland Tunnel. JC needs to be as vigilant about this matter as Hoboken is - its not that hard for us to adopt their model, and we residents deserve that level of enforcement and safety.
Let me elaborate on what I speak of. Each day when I try to cross Jersey Ave. at Wayne street on my way to/ from the work, I am usually faced with one or several of these things, and I am not exaggerating. One or more of these things happens like 80% of the time I cross that street: - drivers speeding up and blowing through the cross walk that I am in, often on their cell phone. - drivers yelling at me and cursing me out for crossing the street in the cross walk, even through I have the right away. This happens A LOT! - drivers not stopping at all for pedestrians - drivers SWERVING to miss me in the cross walk, so that they can keep driving on, often too fast - Buses not yielding for pedestrians!! - Drivers running stop signs, endangering pedestrians This particular intersection (Jersey & Wayne St.) is a problem because people RACE through it to make the stop light. its becoming quite a speedway of downtown as drivers exit the turnpike at Grand st. to take a shortcut through downtown to the Holland Tunnel. But I have seen such patterns at other cross walks in our downtown area (Erie St. is a good example and also merits attention) I am tired of feeling like I cannot cross a street safely, or without being harassed. We need to push for more pedestrian signage (like Hoboken has literally IN EVERY crosswalk), flashing lights at big intersections or more stop signs (Jersey Ave. is prime for this - its becoming a speedway as cars race to the Holland Tunnel), REFLECTIVE PAINT used to re-paint all crosswalks, which are all in dire need of re-paining anyhow. And even greater - how about some police enforcement of speeding on both Erie & Jersey?? Heck - posting a cop at the corner of Jersey & Wayne may even help create a better presence re: the known drug problem over there. Win win! Its seems that at the very least the re-painting of crosswalks with reflective paint, adding a few more stop signs and pedestrian signs (in the middle of the crosswalks like in Hoboken, for our larger crossings) would be the first step and not a difficult one to enact. Thanks for your attention to this matter, Steve.
Posted on: 2008/3/31 21:38
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Newbie
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I agree. In the roughly 3 years I've been living near the corner of Erie and Fourth I've seen more than a handful of accidents. It's absurd. Stop signs at intersections seem to make total sense, but gigantic, orange radar signs placed in front of people's homes (signs placed without anyone's consent) are complete rubbish. It's a neighborhood, not a highway median. Put up stop signs but get rid of the ugly ass freeway blinking lights.
Posted on: 2008/3/30 23:36
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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I live near the Fourth and Erie intersection and my parked car was struck after an accident in the intersection - this accident most likely would never have happened if cars weren't able to fly down Erie as they currently do. My car was nearly totalled and two other parked vehicles were also significantly damaged.
As far as speed bumps or stop signs causing an increase in pollution: consider the paint fumes/pollution generated by the body shops that repair all of the damaged vehicles in accidents caused along this stretch of Erie. Also, consider the added trips and extra pollution because of all the insurance claims adjusters that had to visit the damaged vehicles (my insurance company's adjuster had to visit my car in the polluting body shop at least 3 times!). Erie Street should not be a thruway for people to access the Holland Tunnel. I would welcome stop signs or speed bumps along Erie!
Posted on: 2008/3/29 23:15
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Re: Gigantic speed radar sign on Erie and Fourth
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Home away from home
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Dan, the same thing happened on Cole St. it was put on the sidewalk because all the street spaces were taken up by the cars and the day of street cleaning they moved it onto the street because all the cars were moved for the sweeper.
Posted on: 2008/3/29 15:37
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Re: Gigantic speed radar sign on Erie and Fourth
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looks like someone might be being spiteful...
the large speed sign trailer was placed on the sidewalk, not the street, literally in front of someone's (the poster below's window). I called the Police non-emergency #201.547.5477 and asked for it to be moved into the street. You can do the same. Quote:
Posted on: 2008/3/29 15:29
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Re: Gigantic speed radar sign on Erie and Fourth
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Home away from home
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Go to the jc city website for their email addresses: http://www.cityofjerseycity.com/
Posted on: 2008/3/29 4:02
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Re: Gigantic speed radar sign on Erie and Fourth
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Not too shy to talk
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We used to live on Erie Street and speeding is a huge problem... People don't respect pedestrian crosswalks - in fact, I swear some jerks would speed up when they saw me crossing - and zoom through at high speeds like it's a big freeway or something. Yes, please, stop signs - it's a start and I feel for my former neighbors, it's just dangerous there...
Incidentally, we used to see at least one accident every couple of weeks or so at the intersection of Second and Erie, usually on Sundays when people left St. Mary's church. The car on Second would inch forward and then the car on Erie wouldn't have enough time because it was going 45 miles an hour or what have you. Maybe someone more versed on City Hall issues could also post council members' email addresses for those of us who can't be at the meeting due to work and other commitments? I'd like to express my support.
Posted on: 2008/3/29 0:38
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Gigantic speed radar sign on Erie and Fourth
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Basically, I live near this and don't want it in front of my apartment. It's awful; it's an eyesore. Put a stop sign up but not something so large it's meant for a highway. It's ridiculous.
Whom should I contact to lodge a complaint about this? Police? The city?
Posted on: 2008/3/28 21:50
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Home away from home
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There wasn't much debate or information provided on that ordinance. It was a light agenda, and it is seems that this and other ordinances were not discussed at the Monday caucus meeting. Mariano Vega suggested that they table it to get the opinion from Traffic Engineering. Don't expect Traffic engineering to be of much help, since they are part of Public Works (on record as opposing slowing traffic on Erie) so their assessment won't come as a big surprise. My opinion - I'm not yet convinced that the stop signs are a good idea. There IS a problem, and the ordinance appears to make sense and I appreciate Fulop's efforts, but if Erie traffic is slowed down the problem may shift to other streets. What we could really use is the unbiased opinion from a private Traffic Engineer.
Posted on: 2008/3/28 14:47
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Home away from home
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Meeting minutes are a matter of public record and should be available for viewing from the city clerks office, or alternatively, copies are available through the Open Public Records Act.
Posted on: 2008/3/28 13:04
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Home away from home
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Is it a council person's place to be transcribing and posting meeting minutes on a website? (which, by the way, is way more than we would ever *think* of asking our other hard-working council members to do... if they even maintained a presence on community websites like this in the first place - which they don't).
But in any event, Steve, don't take the bait and just paraphrase the opposing views, because the haters will accuse you of misrepresenting - it's a trap.... Another idea would be to attend the council meeting yourself and hear discussion on the issue for yourself if it affects you (as Fulop is urging) - because I'm sure our proactive Public Works Dept. has been hard at work on the issue all along and has some well thought-out alternative plans in place to offer. Yep. And the JCPD probably has some good ideas to make Erie St. (which they drive and park on everyday) slower too.
Posted on: 2008/3/28 12:53
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"Someday a book will be written on how this city can be broke in the midst of all this development." ---Brewster
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Home away from home
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Since minutes of all Council Meeting are recorded and transcribed, could you please provide us with this particular portion of the meeting? Were other alternatives and suggestions given by the JCPD, Traffic engineering and/or Public works? It would be helpful to know both sides of this issue and why they raised objections.
Posted on: 2008/3/28 11:57
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Just can't stay away
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There is no question in my mind, that the cars illegally parked were owned by policemen, thats why no tickets were issued. This area is notorious for this type of abuse by the police, they are not held to the same standard as you or me. I hope the people involved in the accident took pictures of those parked cars and followed through by holding the offenders accountable for their actions.
Posted on: 2008/3/27 22:01
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Stops signs are fine, but they don't address the real problem: not being able to see the speeding cars coming because illegally parked cars are blocking your view.
I live in the Erie Street danger zone: between 1st and 2nd. 10 or so days ago, there was an accident at 1st and Erie. Clearly, a car coming east on 1st hadn't seen the car going north, and they collided. The view of the car traveling on 1st street was blocked by illegally parked cars, both on 1st and on Erie. The police officer at the scene, however, didn't bother to ticket the illegally parked cars that contributed to the accident. Until the police realize what's causing these accidents, and do something about, stops signs will only do so much.
Posted on: 2008/3/27 21:25
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Re: Stop Signs on Erie Street - Steven FUlop
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Home away from home
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I still think its fastest to head down Jersey Ave and loop around Hamilton Park then to head straight down Erie.
In terms of addressing the speeding and the resulting vehicle accidents, I think the best combination is sidewalk bulb outs and crosswalks that are raised or textured. Speed bumps are annoying to drive over. That said, the cheapest solution is probably the installation of a few stop signs.
Posted on: 2008/3/27 20:41
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