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Re: 2017 Reval ~ Property Inspections
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AMo wrote:
The cost of the Mayor's purely political delay (the court called his claims "frivolous) is actually closer to five million dollars if you add the 1.2 million more charged by the second company. During the four years of this political stunt, a good part of the city (mostly the poorer parts) were over-taxed. That's what I call moving Jersey City forward. A true progressive.


And Comrade, you are true progressive. Except when throw foodtruck folk under bus, or endorsing candidate for Ward E with close ties to developers. In the end maybe all about what is best for selling pizza?

Posted on: 2017/12/9 10:05
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Re: 2017 Reval ~ Property Inspections
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The cost of the Mayor's purely political delay (the court called his claims "frivolous) is actually closer to five million dollars if you add the 1.2 million more charged by the second company. During the four years of this political stunt, a good part of the city (mostly the poorer parts) were over-taxed. That's what I call moving Jersey City forward. A true progressive.

Posted on: 2017/12/8 12:35
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Yvonne wrote:
The senior tax freeze does not benefit Jersey City homeowners, I had a next door neighbor who only had Social Security but she had two rentals in her building. The state requires a portion of the senior freeze or in her case one third. Her income with her rentals was probably $50,000 a year. Seniors in the suburban living in one family homes with a higher income receive the full tax freeze. Then the income was $75,000, it is probably higher now.


For all your howling about tax unfairness for decades you still have no idea how it works. Of course she can only get a break on the owner occupied portion, THATS HOW PROPERTY TAXES WORK!! The rentals are a business, and should be treated as such. Makes me wonder if this person files their "form E" taxes properly at all.

Posted on: 2017/12/7 16:57
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Re: 2017 Reval ~ Property Inspections
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The senior tax freeze does not benefit Jersey City homeowners, I had a next door neighbor who only had Social Security but she had two rentals in her building. The state requires a portion of the senior freeze or in her case one third. Her income with her rentals was probably $50,000 a year. Seniors in the suburban living in one family homes with a higher income receive the full tax freeze. Then the income was $75,000, it is probably higher now.

Posted on: 2017/12/7 15:52
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Re: 2017 Reval ~ Property Inspections
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neverleft wrote:
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Final tab for canceled Jersey City reval is $3.8M

Updated 12:36 PM; Posted 11:55 AM

By Terrence T. McDonald tmcdonald@jjournal.com
The Jersey Journal

JERSEY CITY -- The final tab for the property revaluation Jersey City halted in 2013, plus the city's legal fight to break its contract with the company conducting the long-delayed reval, is $3,784,198.

The amount became official last week when Jersey City finally issued payments to Realty Appraisal Co., the West New York firm hired to conduct the aborted 2011 reval. A judge in April 2016 ordered the city to pay the company, but the city appealed, lost the appeal and in September the New Jersey Supreme Court said it would not hear the case.

http://www.nj.com/hudson/index.ssf/20 ... m.html#incart_2box_hudson


The last paragraph in the linked article should be cause for concern. The city administration needs to get this reval completed and implemented and be done with it. The ongoing uncertainty is unfair to homeowners, as well as potential sellers and buyers.

Posted on: 2017/12/7 15:49
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Final tab for canceled Jersey City reval is $3.8M

Updated 12:36 PM; Posted 11:55 AM

By Terrence T. McDonald tmcdonald@jjournal.com
The Jersey Journal

JERSEY CITY -- The final tab for the property revaluation Jersey City halted in 2013, plus the city's legal fight to break its contract with the company conducting the long-delayed reval, is $3,784,198.

The amount became official last week when Jersey City finally issued payments to Realty Appraisal Co., the West New York firm hired to conduct the aborted 2011 reval. A judge in April 2016 ordered the city to pay the company, but the city appealed, lost the appeal and in September the New Jersey Supreme Court said it would not hear the case.

http://www.nj.com/hudson/index.ssf/20 ... m.html#incart_2box_hudson

Posted on: 2017/12/7 12:58
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Every senior property owner should be filing for the Senior Freeze (Property Tax Reimbursement) Program and the city should be providing some assistance. Even if one currently does not meet the income or other requirements, it is important to establish ones' base year. Jersey City is not exempt because of PILOTs.



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07310 wrote:
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Dolomiti wrote:
Does anyone know how NJ's property tax relief programs will impact the reval costs?

I know there is some sort of income-based rebate and a "senior freeze," but I don't know how that might impact some bills or rebates.


There are lots of hoops you have to jump through and you don't get any relief until many years have passed.

It doesn't look that bad. Over 65, NJ resident for 10 years, paid your property taxes, meet income limits, no 2nd homes etc.

Is JC exempt because of PILOT?

Posted on: 2017/12/7 12:45
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Dolomiti wrote:
Does anyone know how NJ's property tax relief programs will impact the reval costs?

I know there is some sort of income-based rebate and a "senior freeze," but I don't know how that might impact some bills or rebates.


There are lots of hoops you have to jump through and you don't get any relief until many years have passed.

It doesn't look that bad. Over 65, NJ resident for 10 years, paid your property taxes, meet income limits, no 2nd homes etc.

Is JC exempt because of PILOT?

Posted on: 2017/12/7 10:43
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Re: 2017 Reval ~ Property Inspections
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The senior freeze is worth looking into:

http://www.state.nj.us/treasury/taxation/ptr/



Posted on: 2017/12/7 9:21
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Dolomiti wrote:
Does anyone know how NJ's property tax relief programs will impact the reval costs?

I know there is some sort of income-based rebate and a "senior freeze," but I don't know how that might impact some bills or rebates.


There are lots of hoops you have to jump through and you don't get any relief until many years have passed.

http://www.state.nj.us/treasury/taxation/ptr/eligibility.shtml

Posted on: 2017/12/6 19:27
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Re: 2017 Reval ~ Property Inspections
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Does anyone know how NJ's property tax relief programs will impact the reval costs?

I know there is some sort of income-based rebate and a "senior freeze," but I don't know how that might impact some bills or rebates.

Posted on: 2017/12/6 18:17
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dcj wrote:
if you itemize, you can't use standard deduction. that increase is meaningless.


You seem to have a misconception on how taxes work. You can always itemize but if it's total is below the standard deduction then you take the standard deduction.

Posted on: 2017/12/6 14:59
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if you itemize, you can't use standard deduction. that increase is meaningless.

Posted on: 2017/12/6 13:22
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Frinjc wrote:
In any case, the "reform" seems more profitable for investors who buy-to-rent since it looks like there won't be cap on SALT deduction. Imho though, any investment in this area should take into consideration the likelihood of a downward adjustment in rents with more units turning on the market.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/the- ... hat-do-you-owe-2017-10-26


Rent income / loss has been treated as passive. Once your adjusted gross income goes over $100k, the tax advantage of owning investment property (ability to take losses against your active income) pretty much goes away.

So far I haven't found any articles on changes, if any, to the tax treatment of real estate income / loss.


One real estate blogger (and landlord) thinks RE investors will win big.
Quote:

https://investfourmore.com/2017/12/04/ ... x-law-affect-real-estate/

How will the new tax reform laws affect real estate investors?
The new tax laws aren’t doing any favors for homeowners, but the same cannot be said for real estate investors. The tax bills in the House and Senate are very business friendly. Right now, real estate investors pay much of their taxes as ordinary income. The highest tax bracket is 39.6% (which will also likely change), so on rental and flip income, most investors pay high tax rates based on how much income they make.

Most real estate investors use LLCs or S corporations to do business if they do not simply pay taxes as an individual. When you operate these types of businesses, the income passes through the corporation to the individual. In both the House and the Senate bills, pass-through tax rates would drastically change. If you were in the highest tax bracket, instead of paying 39.6%—or whatever the new highest rate will be (possibly 38)—you would pay 25% on pass-through income. The senate bill has some restrictions for those that make over $700,000, while the House bill does not. For those who have rentals or flip houses in a corporation, you will likely see big drops in your tax bill. I have 18 flips going at the moment, so this could literally save me hundreds of thousands of dollars in taxes in the next couple of years. However, some of these rules may not take effect until 2019.

The new rules change the corporate tax rate from 35% to 20%.

Here are some other changes that will benefit real estate investors if the changes make it into the final bill:

The depreciation schedule will decrease for rental property owners from 27.5 years to 25 years on residential properties and from 39 years to 25 years for nonresidential property.
Landlords will still be able to deduct their interest from mortgages in full on rentals they own.
Here is another article with more information on the changes with real estate.



Posted on: 2017/12/6 10:20
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Frinjc wrote:
In any case, the "reform" seems more profitable for investors who buy-to-rent since it looks like there won't be cap on SALT deduction. Imho though, any investment in this area should take into consideration the likelihood of a downward adjustment in rents with more units turning on the market.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/the- ... hat-do-you-owe-2017-10-26


Rent income / loss has been treated as passive. Once your adjusted gross income goes over $100k, the tax advantage of owning investment property (ability to take losses against your active income) pretty much goes away.

So far I haven't found any articles on changes, if any, to the tax treatment of real estate income / loss.

Posted on: 2017/12/6 7:39
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Another tool below - not sure whether it is the latest version of the senate bill. It looks like the SALT adjustment starts having a negative impact when >40K in property+state tax and it may be less impactful if AMT is eliminated. In any case, the "reform" seems more profitable for investors who buy-to-rent since it looks like there won't be cap on SALT deduction. Imho though, any investment in this area should take into consideration the likelihood of a downward adjustment in rents with more units turning on the market.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/the- ... hat-do-you-owe-2017-10-26

Posted on: 2017/12/5 20:41
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dcj wrote:
one thing being overlooked is the personal exemption. i think the plans call for its elimination. If that is eliminated (it's $4,050 a person/dependent) and you have a family of four, that's a $16,200 write off that disappears. that sucks.


The standard deduction was increased to $24k in Senate and $24.4k in the House bill. I think the Senate bill has some additional child tax credits.


Posted on: 2017/12/5 14:49
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one thing being overlooked is the personal exemption. i think the plans call for its elimination. If that is eliminated (it's $4,050 a person/dependent) and you have a family of four, that's a $16,200 write off that disappears. that sucks.

Posted on: 2017/12/5 13:58
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One other factor in the tax discussion...the proposed elimination of the AMT for individuals. For people who can afford to buy in the market, the cap on SALT may not matter that much for those who were previously subject to the AMT. I may be somewhat of a wash.

Are they killing individual AMT, or just raising the cap?


House plan kills the AMT. The Senate plan keeps it in place.

Posted on: 2017/12/5 12:43
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K-Lo2 wrote:
One other factor in the tax discussion...the proposed elimination of the AMT for individuals. For people who can afford to buy in the market, the cap on SALT may not matter that much for those who were previously subject to the AMT. I may be somewhat of a wash.

Are they killing individual AMT, or just raising the cap?

Posted on: 2017/12/5 12:05
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If you want an estimate of how your taxes will be affected by the House and Senate plan, break out last year's 1040 and plug in the data to this calculator:

http://taxplancalculator.com

It's simplified, so I would take what it calcs with a grain of salt. For example, it doesn't calculate the effect of a tax deferred / tax free savings plan (i.e. 401k, HSA).

Posted on: 2017/12/5 11:36
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One other factor in the tax discussion...the proposed elimination of the AMT for individuals. For people who can afford to buy in the market, the cap on SALT may not matter that much for those who were previously subject to the AMT. I may be somewhat of a wash.

Posted on: 2017/12/5 11:21
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Dolomiti wrote: I don't think it will make a serious dent in DTJC prices, especially in the longer term.


In the longer term, the risk is overall net migration out of the region. A very real possibility. NJ has already experienced this to a modest extent recently. As technology advances, there are fewer reasons for corporations (and jobs) to remain affixed to NYC. Sure, the idle rich will always be there, but there is a breaking point for those for the bottom end of the 1% down through 3% of top earners. I'm not saying this will definitely be the motivator for an exodus, but there is definitely an inflection point beyond which things start to change.

Posted on: 2017/12/5 10:50
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dtjcview wrote:
The Senate bill left the $1m interest deduction in-place, and 10k in SALTs. If passed, RE prices won't tank on policy.

Think Dolomiti is right, JC property prices will continue to be driven by supply and demand.


Most things I've read indicate exactly the opposite:

"The bill, if enacted into law, could send home prices tumbling 10 percent or more in parts of the New York area, according to one economic analysis. "

How New Yorkers Would Lose Under the Republican Tax Bill https://nyti.ms/2nst8oG

I don't think that prices will drop 10%. But the uncertainty is enough to drive prices down in the short term IMO.

The law is definitely much more likely to pass now than when I wrote that. Even so, the bill is not finished, and may not be as big a hit as some people fear.

The current plan is to allow a $10,000 deduction in property taxes, and interest on mortgages up to $500,000. This could change at any moment, but let's assume it will be something along those lines, or worse.

On one hand, even with the property tax deduction, this is going to hurt -- particularly with the reval. Quite a few large properties will have bigger property tax deductions, and mortgages over $500k.

On the other, this is not happening in a vacuum. It's happening right next to Manhattan, and in an area with very little inventory. What this means is that more people will get priced out of Manhattan, and will be looking at JC.

It's going to suck for a lot of current JC residents (including me) who will get hit with higher taxes. It will likely force more than a few home sales. But overall, I don't think it will make a serious dent in DTJC prices, especially in the longer term.

Posted on: 2017/12/5 10:39
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tern wrote:
The market in downtown Jersey City has come down, inventory is up and sitting around longer.

What are you basing this on?

Posted on: 2017/12/5 10:08
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tern wrote:
The market in downtown Jersey City has come down, inventory is up and sitting around longer.

Robin.


Has it actually come down, or just cooled as aspirational prices finally drive off buyers? Glad to know there IS a limit!

Posted on: 2017/12/4 22:59
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dtjcview wrote:
The Senate bill left the $1m interest deduction in-place, and 10k in SALTs. If passed, RE prices won't tank on policy.

Think Dolomiti is right, JC property prices will continue to be driven by supply and demand.


Most things I've read indicate exactly the opposite:

"The bill, if enacted into law, could send home prices tumbling 10 percent or more in parts of the New York area, according to one economic analysis. "

How New Yorkers Would Lose Under the Republican Tax Bill https://nyti.ms/2nst8oG

I don't think that prices will drop 10%. But the uncertainty is enough to drive prices down in the short term IMO.

Posted on: 2017/12/4 21:01
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The market in downtown Jersey City has come down, inventory is up and sitting around longer.

Robin.

Posted on: 2017/12/3 22:05
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The Senate bill left the $1m interest deduction in-place, and 10k in SALTs. If passed, RE prices won't tank on policy.

Think Dolomiti is right, JC property prices will continue to be driven by supply and demand.

Posted on: 2017/12/3 21:43
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brewster wrote:
Someone on a RE investors site put it this way "we're in year 10 of a 7 year cycle". A lot of people there are in "duck and cover" mode. Also, Hoboken was not nearly as out of whack as JC because the whole damn town had risen, so the tax hikes were moderate.

There is no "7 year cycle."

I see no indication that anyone is running scared right now. I haven't seen any indication that waves of homeowners are bailing before their property taxes go up, or that interest in JC has cratered for the same reason.

Hoboken hadn't done a reval in 25 years, and there's no question that properties faced increases in property taxes. What protected Hoboken's property values overall are the same factors that will protect JC's values overall: A lack of inventory, and stupendous RE prices in Manhattan ($1790/sq ft, vs JC's $472).

Oh, and don't forget, a lot of people's property taxes are going to drop. That should increase their property values, no...?



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